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Old 11-07-2014, 13:57   #301
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Re: Rebel Heart Crew Suing.....

Not surprised Eric is wasting his time altering and deleting posts. It certainly is the fools errand of someone who thinks they are smarter than they really are.

Unfortunately for him, the Web Archive never forgets, or changes. Put the URL of the deleted post in the WayBack Machine, and tada! Every Attorney wants a client who is caught red handed altering evidence.

Like Vegas, what you posted on the internet, stays on the internet.....forever! When you change it, that stays too. Isn't technology awesome?

Case dismissed.

May I suggest the retail slip and fall scam, it's harder to tell on yourself, and the payout is small but immediate, of course there are no interviews......

'
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Old 11-07-2014, 14:14   #302
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Re: Rebel Heart Crew Suing.....

I have reviewed the Iridium phone agreement. It states that the seller isn't liable except for gross negligence. The agreement is governed by Florida law and that the lawsuit must be filed in State or Federal Court in Florida.

I used to deal with clowns like this attorney all the time. They don't bother to read the contracts their clients signed. This guy thinks he can keep this case in California, good luck...

As has been stated before, the Courts will not let them claim damages for the costs incurred by the Government. The only way that would be possible was if the Government was seeking reimbursement directly from them. If they are trying to make a negligence claim, then their negligence will also become an issue. There is a "but for" standard for damages, so whether their boat was damaged and able to complete the voyage will be relevant.

Attorneys for the defendants will be all over social media looking for comments posted by these folks. The fact that they are trying to delet their prior comments will not look good. They will be asked, under oath, about all of them, and if they deny making those statements, they can get in real trouble with the Court.

My prediction: There will be a media show pushed by their attorney. Once in litigation in the proper court, you won't hear anything, and it will all go away in the end with a confidentiality agreement that ensures that we never know what happened...

My torts professor used to say "If you have the law, pound the law, if you have the facts, pound the facts, if you don't have either, pound the table." I'd paraphrase that to "if you don't have either, go on TV."
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Old 11-07-2014, 14:15   #303
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Re: Rebel Heart Crew Suing.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by letsgetsailing3 View Post
No. Why would this involve Iridium? If their lawyer could have figured out an angle on that, I'm sure they would have liked the deeper pockets. They'd also get the more robust legal defense.

They'll have to sue the sat phone retailer for negligence, and prove that this negligence caused their catastrophe. It's a tall order to begin with, so they must be counting on pushing the sat phone retailer into a settlement.
In the interview, RH says that the thing that kicked off the lawsuit was that some satphone corporate dude said on one of the sailing mag sites (L38 I think) that they would never cut off service like that - that it would be illegal...basically saying RH was "lying" (in RH's words). I remember seeing something about it, but can't remember if the dude was with the service provider/retailer or Iridium. That's why I'm wondering.
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Old 11-07-2014, 14:17   #304
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Re: Rebel Heart Crew suing.....

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Who are you to judge that?
As someone who gets pissed off with people who think a GPS and satphone will turn them into sailors and can see the inevitable loss of freedom that these ill prepared fools will bring about I feel I have every right to judge them. If my freedom to cruise is curtailed by legislation introduced to save these people from themselves then I will judge them more harshly.
Look at the NZ Cat 1 legislation and tell me how protecting the stupid has not curtailed everyone's freedom.
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Old 11-07-2014, 14:28   #305
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Re: Rebel Heart Crew Suing.....

A bit more info:

AOL.com Article - Sailing family rescued at sea speak out about being 'bad parents'

This humurous tidbit:

Quote:
Eric and Charlotte say their satellite phone just didn't work, effectively cutting them off from anyone on land. That's why they were forced to use the indicator beacon to call the Coast Guard.
And this interesting tidbit:

Quote:
KGTV did get in touch with an employee from the satellite phone provider who said the reason the Kaufman's phone didn't work was because the phone was turned off after a billing issue occurred.
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Old 11-07-2014, 14:32   #306
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Re: Rebel Heart Crew Suing.....

I found this on another forum frequented by Eric.
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Old 11-07-2014, 14:36   #307
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Parents Rescued by Navy Warship Plan to File Lawsuit

Just read on Yahoo. Under-equipped boat offshore plans to sue the satellite company instead of praying to our great country. Sounds very pitiful to me.
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Old 11-07-2014, 14:40   #308
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Re: Parents Rescued by Navy Warship Plan to File Lawsuit

There is already a whole, sad thread on this.


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Old 11-07-2014, 14:42   #309
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Re: Rebel Heart Crew suing.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by NoTies View Post
As someone who gets pissed off with people who think a GPS and satphone will turn them into sailors and can see the inevitable loss of freedom that these ill prepared fools will bring about I feel I have every right to judge them. If my freedom to cruise is curtailed by legislation introduced to save these people from themselves then I will judge them more harshly.
Look at the NZ Cat 1 legislation and tell me how protecting the stupid has not curtailed everyone's freedom.
This is my fear that this couple has done a lot to harm the public perception of the sailing and cruising community. Lots of people think of us as rich yachtsmen, and now they are seeing us as reckless adventures who have contempt for the "ordinary" people with boring lives. They think we cost them hundreds of thousands of tax payers dollars in rescues. And now this lawsuit to keep things in the news. I just see this as a sad chapter. Back in the sixties ocean sailors were heroes now we are being seen as leaches. I personally feel they would do best to drop below the radar but somehow do not see that happening. Maybe the 15 min will run out soon.
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Old 11-07-2014, 14:44   #310
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Re: Parents Rescued by Navy Warship Plan to File Lawsuit

Sorry, did not see it.
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Old 11-07-2014, 14:47   #311
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Re: Rebel Heart Crew suing.....

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Originally Posted by sailvayu View Post
This is my fear that this couple has done a lot to harm the public perception of the sailing and cruising community. Lots of people think of us as rich yachtsmen, and now they are seeing us as reckless adventures who have contempt for the "ordinary" people with boring lives. They think we cost them hundreds of thousands of tax payers dollars in rescues. And now this lawsuit to keep things in the news. I just see this as a sad chapter. Back in the sixties ocean sailors were heroes now we are being seen as leaches. I personally feel they would do best to drop below the radar but somehow do not see that happening. Maybe the 15 min will run out soon.
in a nut shell,very well said i could not agree more,these people have done untold damage to the sailing community,and we will feel the repercussions for many years to come.
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Old 11-07-2014, 14:48   #312
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Re: Rebel Heart Crew Suing.....

I had a "billing issue" with a creditor and with a state agency once. They both said "Well, we mailed it to you eight weeks ago" and funny thing, my mail was not being forwarded by the USPS for a period of six weeks despite a forwarding order that had been in effect.

The official excuse from the Postal Station Manager (it was a Station, not a full Post Office) was that my local carrier had been off on sick leave and decided to take early retirement. The substitute carrier didn't know what to do with forwarded mail, so he just put it aside (supposedly the route carrier performs the forwarding) and then the next carrier never looked at the bundle on the side.

So I can tell you all "it was mailed" means nothing. While the courts tend to accept proof of mailing as reasonable belief in delivery, it just ain't quite so.

Sending something in the mail is like sending a text message: You've got no reason to think it arrived, except the law of averages.

And the six to eight pieces of mail that I get every year, pretty clearly addressed to someone down the street with a similar but different digit in the street address? Give me reason to expect that if I get their mail six times a year, they probably get (and discard) my mail just as frequently. Perhaps by a dyslexic carrier, perhaps simply by a careless one.

" No really, the check is in the mail. "
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Old 11-07-2014, 14:54   #313
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Re: Rebel Heart Crew suing.....

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in a nut shell,very well said i could not agree more,these people have done untold damage to the sailing community,and we will feel the repercussions for many years to come.
I agree 100%
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Old 11-07-2014, 14:56   #314
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Re: Rebel Heart Crew suing.....

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Maybe the 15 min will run out soon.
over 300 posts on this thread, so it doesn't look like it
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Old 11-07-2014, 15:17   #315
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Re: Rebel Heart Crew Suing.....

I can understand the feelings they are going through. Our "welcome home" was planned after what for us was a successful 4yr cruise and we had a very difficult time adjusting back to the "real world", I'm not even sure I have adjusted yet to be honest. Nor am I sure I really want too when I look around at this "first world civilized country". After the releif of being safe and not losing their child now the financial reality takes hold. Rent, Car, food, JOBS...the increased cost of living and dealing with the **** that most Americans calll normal but is actually insane. That can really get you down and make you look for someone to blame, when you should be in Bora Bora. Living in San Diego when you "should be" in Paradise.

We had a 1000 mile Baja Bash to beat the Joy and life out of us before returning to the States, they had a US Navy Rescue ship. So I'm going to cut them some slack. I don't think they should prevail in the lawsuit, but I'm also not going to be a part of the BS attacks that reflect more poorly on some of the CF Members making them than on the still tramatized family trying to put their life back together. Even if I disagree with their choices then and now, they are STILL members of the Cruising Community.

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