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Old 25-07-2018, 16:02   #46
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Re: Is private vessel tracking public record?

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Originally Posted by mikedefieslife View Post
Not seen it mentioned here but there doesn’t seem to be anything to stop recreational vessels from buying a better class A system. Some of the Icom systems sold at reputable chandlers are only slightly more expensive than a class B system
Any boat can use a Class-A transponder. These do allow for user-programming of name and other "static" data, although I don't know about the legality of name-changes. MMSI certainly shouldn't be changed at will.
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Old 25-07-2018, 16:35   #47
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Re: Is private vessel tracking public record?

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I curious why you would want to operate a ground station?
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Originally Posted by zboss View Post
They get access to more features. It’s for boat enthusiasts and people that just like technology.
AIS has value as a navigation tool, MarineTraffic has zero value as a navigation tool.

It makes one wonder why a 'boat enthusiast' would see any value in MarineTraffic.
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Old 25-07-2018, 17:07   #48
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Re: Is private vessel tracking public record?

The information on PRIVATE vendor web sites, like MarineTraffic, is not a matter of public record. It becomes a matter of PRIVATE COMMERCIAL VENDOR DATA better known as "datamining" which is resold for commercial purposes, just like your web site viewing habits and your Facebook information.

I do not know if MarineTraffic or anyone else is monetizing the information beyond selling subscription views of the data, but I would expect this to be going on. That's just why datamining is SO lucrative.

Public record is just that: Information kept by a government agency and made available to the general public on request. So if the USCG had a vessel traffic control system in place (which they sometimes do) and they were creating a log file of all the data they received, THAT would be a matter of public record. You could file a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) asking for "all records of AIS broadcasts from the vessel GuppyII" and they'd be required to provide them. They could probably argue that records of warships and others were a matter of national security and not available, but that's for the courts to clarify.

"I’d bet the same is true for Marine Traffic and other sites, if you fill out the form or whatever you can likely ask that your position not be displayed."
You know, US telephone companies all used to offer that service. Just pay another five bucks per month, every month, to keep your number unlisted. MT would have to be either terribly generous or real fools to let folks ask for this for free, when it could be a paid $ervice available to $ubscribers only.

Buy your Guy Fawkes masques now, while you can still do that anonymously.
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Old 25-07-2018, 18:17   #49
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Re: Is private vessel tracking public record?

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Originally Posted by DotDun View Post
I curious why you would want to operate a ground station?


Because it assists in the safe operations of boats in our area. At the time, there was a sailboat missing somewhere around, they had left AIS on so if the boat was near here it would have been located.
I'm a huge fan of AIS, I wish it was mandatory so we could always see who was near us. When my boat is here on anchor, I leave the AIS on so if it gets loose I have a chance of finding it.
I have internet most of the time I am sailing, Marinetraffic.com lets me see what's outside my reception area. We were 20 miles of Nevis last week and I had data, I could see cargo ships on my phone that I could not see on my AIS.
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Old 25-07-2018, 18:42   #50
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Re: Is private vessel tracking public record?

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Because it assists in the safe operations of boats in our area. At the time, there was a sailboat missing somewhere around, they had left AIS on so if the boat was near here it would have been located.
I'm a huge fan of AIS, I wish it was mandatory so we could always see who was near us. When my boat is here on anchor, I leave the AIS on so if it gets loose I have a chance of finding it.
I have internet most of the time I am sailing, Marinetraffic.com lets me see what's outside my reception area. We were 20 miles of Nevis last week and I had data, I could see cargo ships on my phone that I could not see on my AIS.
Why would you need to see vessels that are so far away they cannot be seen by your AIS receiver?

It's foolish to use MarineTraffic as an aid to navigation. If you want accurate AIS data, get a receiver.

MarineTraffic, and others like them, are the reason I leave my AIS in 'standby'. How does that help the system?
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Old 26-07-2018, 01:44   #51
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Re: Is private vessel tracking public record?

I'm not in the business of changing your opinions, DotDun, and I cannot even answer all of your questions, but I'll have a go at some of them.

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I curious why you would want to operate a ground station?
Were you in Australian waters, you'd find that rescue and related services to recreational boaters are provided by volunteer NGOs (non-governmental organisations) such as the Australian Volunteer Coast Guard and similar. Many of the base stations of the AVCG do exactly what you are talking about: running an AIS base station that feeds AIS data into channels including the channels that end up with the AIS data aggregators (e.g. marinetraffic.com, exactEarth.com and its exactAIS, fleetmon and so on).

Those rescue NGOs plus government maritime safety agencies and maritime police and port authorities find that data useful. I'm not a member of any of them, but I understand that the ability to play back the tracks of AIS signals of vessels and to look at density maps is quite valuable to the NGOs, govt agencies and authorities. You can imagine how useful AIS tracks of vessels that happen to collide might be to investigators. Density tracks similarly are useful to port authorities and maritime safety agencies when considering traffic control, buoyage, and so on.

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It's foolish to use MarineTraffic as an aid to navigation.
I personally find the AIS density maps that you can get from marinetraffic.com for free and also the much better quality density maps that you can buy from marinetraffic.com and exactEarth.com (take a Captain Cook at: https://www.exactearth.com/products/...s#online-store) jolly valuable.

Amongst other things, AIS density maps can give you local knowledge of a port you've never visited or even a chunk of ocean you've not sailed before in a hurry.

The value of AIS density maps has been covered a couple of time on CF. For instance at: Marine Traffic density

A time or three, including here on CF, I've used AIS density maps to suggest to foreign cruisers how best to enter my home waters and to alert them to the shipping hazards of those waters (which include a busy cargo port and some fishing areas).

To give some examples:

1. Have a look at BNE-NZ density map.gif, the waters between Brisbane City (the name is partly obscured by AIS markers, but it's on the left of the graphic, between Sunshine Coast and Gold Coast) and the N tip of the N island of New Zealand. If you were planning a voyage from Brisbane to NZ, one look at the density map and you would know how far from the Australia coast you have to sail before you're in waters with a relatively low risk of meeting a cargo ship. And you can also see four or more places with green fuzzy lines - in contrast to the straight green or brown lines of high density cargo ship tracks - showing where to expect fishing craft.

2. Moreton Bay, my home waters, has its own complexity. See Moreton Bay density map 2017.gif. That complexity is due to shipping particularly going to and from the container dock at Fisherman's Islands. But also from sandbanks that constrain choices. When I'm talking to a cruiser unfamiliar with Moreton Bay, that density map tells them things that no hydrographic chart does. One of them is the viability of a shoal water route into Moreton Bay from the N, a route that skirts Bribie Island (the thin brown density track that runs just offshore the town of Woorim). Many foreign cruisers look at the chart and choose to run down the shipping channel (the thick brown density track, with orange AIS virtual buoys dotted along it). Those with local knowledge can choose what's called the 'Gilligans Island shortcut' and run that thin brown density track (working the tides if their draft makes it necessary) past Woorim to avoid being amongst the cargo ships and saving miles (depending on their final destination, of course).

And if you think of being in the shoes of a maritime safety agency that has only a finite amount of money to pay to install and maintain buoys, one look at the Moreton Bay AIS density map might help you decide just where to put those buoys.
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Old 26-07-2018, 07:50   #52
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Re: Is private vessel tracking public record?

Yes lots of "public services" which are in the US gov-only, or privatized for-profit services, are in Australia mostly volunteer efforts.

Greater spirit of being members of a real community, where stateside that feeling is more fragmented, even tribal.
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Old 26-07-2018, 15:47   #53
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Re: Is private vessel tracking public record?

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Why would you need to see vessels that are so far away they cannot be seen by your AIS receiver?
It's the 21st century.

Here is a mate of mine, Bill Hatfield, 30K miles into a solo westabout circumnavigation. I can see where he is, what weather conditions he is facing, read his latest thoughts, etc. He is homeward bound.

https://gis.ee/leaucommotion/

Why would I NOT want to see his vessel so far away that my AIS receiver cannot see him?
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Old 26-07-2018, 15:51   #54
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Re: Is private vessel tracking public record?

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Yes lots of "public services" which are in the US gov-only, or privatized for-profit services, are in Australia mostly volunteer efforts.

Greater spirit of being members of a real community, where stateside that feeling is more fragmented, even tribal.
I'll add to that, john61ct.

Why would I want safety checks and rescue services delivered to me in a militarized manner?

I and other Aussies choose the police model (versus the military model) for safety checks and the volunteer/community help model for rescue and support.
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Old 26-07-2018, 16:42   #55
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Re: Is private vessel tracking public record?

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Why would you need to see vessels that are so far away they cannot be seen by your AIS receiver?
My AIS is good for about 3 miles. If I'm heading out of Anguilla going towards the end of the island, my AIS cannot see a container ship coming from St. Maarten to Anguilla. If I know I am going to round the end of the Island and head to St. Maarten after dark, knowing the container ship is going to be there at the same time helps me.

Sometimes I want to know where a yacht is, I'm not close enough to radio them but I know they are where I am going.
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Old 26-07-2018, 16:45   #56
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Re: Is private vessel tracking public record?

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Originally Posted by Alan Mighty View Post
It's the 21st century.

Here is a mate of mine, Bill Hatfield, 30K miles into a solo westabout circumnavigation. I can see where he is, what weather conditions he is facing, read his latest thoughts, etc. He is homeward bound.

https://gis.ee/leaucommotion/

Why would I NOT want to see his vessel so far away that my AIS receiver cannot see him?
If I want someone to track me, I'll give them access to Delorme....Marinetraffic is way too flaky to track when you really need to the information.
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Old 26-07-2018, 16:49   #57
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Re: Is private vessel tracking public record?

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My AIS is good for about 3 miles. If I'm heading out of Anguilla going towards the end of the island, my AIS cannot see a container ship coming from St. Maarten to Anguilla. If I know I am going to round the end of the Island and head to St. Maarten after dark, knowing the container ship is going to be there at the same time helps me.

Sometimes I want to know where a yacht is, I'm not close enough to radio them but I know they are where I am going.
You have issues on your vessel if you can't see a container ship on AIS more than 30 minutes CPA. There is zero reason to see it further.

Marinetraffic is neither realtime nor reliable.
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Old 26-07-2018, 17:12   #58
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Re: Is private vessel tracking public record?

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Why would I want safety checks and rescue services delivered to me in a militarized manner?

I and other Aussies choose the police model (versus the military model) for safety checks and the volunteer/community help model for rescue and support.
I completely agree.

And even local police forces here are getting very militarized, buy surplus Pentagon gear with unfairly seized civilian-assets.

Like occupying forces, often see the general public (poor and brown, especially when angry) as the enemy.

https://www.tennessean.com/story/new...gear/89780460/
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Old 26-07-2018, 18:25   #59
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Re: Is private vessel tracking public record?

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Originally Posted by masonc View Post
My AIS is good for about 3 miles. If I'm heading out of Anguilla going towards the end of the island, my AIS cannot see a container ship coming from St. Maarten to Anguilla. If I know I am going to round the end of the Island and head to St. Maarten after dark, knowing the container ship is going to be there at the same time helps me.

Sometimes I want to know where a yacht is, I'm not close enough to radio them but I know they are where I am going.
You need to have your AIS installation checked ... something is seriously wrong if that is the best it can do..... honestly...
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Old 26-07-2018, 18:38   #60
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Re: Is private vessel tracking public record?

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You need to have your AIS installation checked ... something is seriously wrong if that is the best it can do..... honestly...


No, I need a splitter for the masthead antenna, currently using one on the Bimini for AIS.
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