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Old 03-12-2015, 20:21   #1
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First solo sail on the ICW

So i went to ASA over the summer, read and watched many DVD's and books...just bought a 22ft Catalina....went out on the boat twice with the person i bought her from who has showed me a thing or three...he has a captain license... question if i were to sail with just one sail which would it be ..the main or the jib ? just until i feel comfortable...thank you all in advance mark rocco
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Old 03-12-2015, 21:31   #2
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Re: first solo sail on the ICW

Congratulations on your new boat. We had an '81 and loved it for many years.

Do you have roller furling?

The mast head rig on your boat makes the jib the driver.

If you're only beam reacvhing, either would do.

If you have to do any upwind work, the jib only is the way to go.

If you have to go downwind, the jib is also easier, no gybing the main.

The main alone will be slower and almost useless going upwind.

Good luck, reef early, reef often.
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Old 04-12-2015, 05:57   #3
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Re: first solo sail on the ICW

Thank you Stu. I don't have a roller furling yet...that would make life a little easier....might get one down the line. I'm thinking there isn't to much traffic out there this time of year so i might just put both sails up. Thank you again. mark rocco
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Old 04-12-2015, 07:04   #4
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Re: first solo sail on the ICW

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Originally Posted by Stu Jackson View Post

If you have to do any upwind work, the jib only is the way to go.
What? You had two choices and guessed at the wrong one.

The jib pushes the boat off the wind. Also, with the jib up alone you are putting more torque on the rudder.

The main is the sail to use to go upwind, but the jib will help the main generate more power.

Think of sailing without a rudder. The main is used to bring the bow of the boat into the wind. The jib is used to push the bow of the boat off the wind. It's how racers can sit still on the start line waiting for the clock to count down

On a nice day with steady wind say around 12 -15 knots, try sailing upwind once with the jib alone then do it once with the main only. You will be able to actually point toward the mark with the main.

This reminds me of a guy in Pensacola trying to motorsail into the wind with just his jib up and I sailed passed him on main alone. He was putting tons of pressure on his rudder and making almost zero progress
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Old 04-12-2015, 07:28   #5
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Re: first solo sail on the ICW

You are going to love your boat. I learned to sail on a Catalina 22. We sold her and I miss her dearly. I'll miss our current boat too, but your first boat is always your first love.

If you are solo sailing I highly recommend you use a tiller stay. That way your boat will stay on course if you need to go forward to set or take down the jib.
Catalina Direct: Tiller Stay Tiller Controller
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Old 04-12-2015, 09:43   #6
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Re: first solo sail on the ICW

Congratulations and good luck! You will get different advice on using one sail, but in general, if I were to pick, it would be jib downwind, and main upwind. More importantly, if you are going ICW, make sure that your engine is ready to go as you will do more motoring than sailing. And carry a spare impeller. You don't specify which part of the ICW, but there are plenty of blogs out there (including mine - sorry for the plug) with good details. Also get a cruising guide, and get Active Captain on your phone or iPad.

Fair Winds!
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Old 04-12-2015, 09:45   #7
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Re: first solo sail on the ICW

Sailing the ICW? From where to where is my question. If you are moving your new boat from any distance it might be wise to look at all the bridges in the ICW along your route.

Fixed bridges will not present any issues re sailing but if you need to pass thru tended bridges it certainly may. Planning is everything and a quick starting auxiliary engine will keep you moving in the right direction.

Good luck with your new boat!
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Old 04-12-2015, 10:15   #8
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Re: first solo sail on the ICW

If you want to sail solo on your C22, A tiller autopilot will make your life a lot easier. The Raymarine ST1000 is a great, self contained unit that is pretty easy to install yourself. Cost about $400 new, but nothing wrong with a used unit. At the very least, a "tiller tamer" will hold the boat on course for a few moments, also easy to install.

A roller furler on your jib will also make your life easier, and much safer too, keeping you off the foredeck when the wind and waves are up.

As others have said (correctly) jib for off the wind, but you need the main to go upwind, or you simply stall the boat with too much rudder.

It also depends on your area. In light winds, you can do pretty much whatever. Where I live, it blows hard almost every day. I use a very small jib. If I need to go upwind when its blowing, I put a deep reef in the main. it give a ton of power, and balances the jib forces. Most days I would just set the jib and just have fun. Jib alone off the wind gives you a lot of control, and less stress on you and the boat.

Whatever you decide, experiment, have fun, and do lots of sailing.
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Old 04-12-2015, 10:25   #9
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Re: first solo sail on the ICW

You are best using both your sails. With the main only up you will find that the boat has more "weather helm"... where you have to pull the tiller to the windward side to keep the boat on track, thus dragging the rudder thru the water sideways. With the Jib only up, you will find that at times you cant turn the boat where you want to go. Proper balance between t he two is the best situation. ... and good for you to learn. Most people put the main up even if motoring though.... for stability.
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Old 04-12-2015, 10:26   #10
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Re: first solo sail on the ICW

Quote:
Originally Posted by mark rocco mont View Post
Thank you Stu. I don't have a roller furling yet...that would make life a little easier....might get one down the line. I'm thinking there isn't to much traffic out there this time of year so i might just put both sails up. Thank you again. mark rocco
Mark, take a look at a little book called Sailing Illustrated by Pat Royce. There is a section on safety specifically with the Catalina 22 drawn quite well.

Here is an example page:

Anyone ever rerget their C22 purchase? | SailboatOwners.com Forums

Scroll down to #19 and click on the thumbnail. You'll also find a LOT more C22 info on that website than here, noodle around there.

thomm is simply wrong regarding the masthead rig and sail's power for your boat. Nothing personal. Don't agree? Then try each one and see.
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Old 04-12-2015, 10:43   #11
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Re: first solo sail on the ICW

++ on the little book Sailing Illustrated. Read that book and you will understand a lot more.
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Old 04-12-2015, 11:06   #12
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Re: first solo sail on the ICW

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Originally Posted by Stu Jackson View Post
thomm is simply wrong regarding the masthead rig and sail's power for your boat. Nothing personal. Don't agree? Then try each one and see.
I'm talking sailboats in general, and the Catalina 22. You use the main to go upwind.

And to answer his question about if you had to pick one sail to sail with that sail would be the main because you can use it to sail all points of the compass in any wind.

It's pretty obvious to me and also is the reason why unirig sailboats have a mainsail only. (not a jib only)

Think of it this way, the jib is nearest to the bow. If you try and go upwind with the jib up only the wind will push the bow of your boat away from the wind...........so you have to try and force the boat to go to windward with the rudder.

The main swings the bow of the boat toward the wind when you sheet it in. Boats with too large of a main or too long of a boom have weather helm. The main has forced the boat too close to the wind and you have to use the rudder to turn away. (or ease the main sail out some)

Not rocket science.
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Old 04-12-2015, 11:16   #13
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Re: First solo sail on the ICW

thomm, the C22, as I mentioned in reply #2, is a MASTHEAD rig. The larger driver is the JIB. I've owned three Catalinas, all mast head rigs. It IS how they work. I really don't want to argue with you, I'm just pointing out that generalities may apply in some cases, but NOT in his case.

Here's an example:

A gybe with a main is a PITA. Not an issue with just a jib. Sure is nice to not have to worry about the boom. In heavy air you just have to make sure the jib doesn't go flying around the forestay. We had a friend sail his boat down the coast of California. He told me that had big trouble around Point Conception, a notoriously heavy wind area. "We were running with just the main up and we had a lot of trouble turning back upwind to drop it." All I asked was if they were able to do it. What I was going to say, before I realized it would sound rude, was "What the hell were you doing going downwind in heavy wind and seas with only your main instead of just your jib?"

For a new sailor, sailing with just the jib is way easier. And as I get older and lazier, I do it many times, since the only "work" left on my boat is taking the cover off the mainsail!!!

and here's another:


We learned to sail jib only back when we had our C22 on Clear Lake, a few hours north of here. We'd trailer the boat up for the summer and leave it in the water, made for great weekends. One day after a race, the winds picked up BIG time. We had a 110 jib and only a single reef in the main. I asked one of the old pros and he said: "Sail on only one sail or the other. With your mast head rig, you'll sail better on your jib since you have to go upwind. The main would do, but it's slower." A few years later we were in the BVIs with heavy Christmas winds, and we sailed the Endeavor 32 with just the jib for a few days. Just yesterday we sailed from San Francisco back to our slip on just the jib, although the winds were mild and we were still doing 4 knots at 9 knot apparent wind on a reach. We do it a lot, both upwind and down. Yesterday, for instance, we were in no hurry to get home and just relaxed. I joke that the only work left on our boat is taking the mainsail cover off and putting it back on!


Your boat, your choice.
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Old 04-12-2015, 11:29   #14
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Re: First solo sail on the ICW

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Originally Posted by Stu Jackson View Post
thomm, the C22, as I mentioned in reply #2, is a MASTHEAD rig. The larger driver is the JIB. I've owned three Catalinas, all mast head rigs. It IS how they work. I really don't want to argue with you, I'm just pointing out that generalities may apply in some cases, but NOT in his case.

Here's an example:

A gybe with a main is a PITA. Not an issue with just a jib. Sure is nice to not have to worry about the boom. In heavy air you just have to make sure the jib doesn't go flying around the forestay. We had a friend sail his boat down the coast of California. He told me that had big trouble around Point Conception, a notoriously heavy wind area. "We were running with just the main up and we had a lot of trouble turning back upwind to drop it." All I asked was if they were able to do it. What I was going to say, before I realized it would sound rude, was "What the hell were you doing going downwind in heavy wind and seas with only your main instead of just your jib?"

For a new sailor, sailing with just the jib is way easier. And as I get older and lazier, I do it many times, since the only "work" left on my boat is taking the cover off the mainsail!!!

and here's another:


We learned to sail jib only back when we had our C22 on Clear Lake, a few hours north of here. We'd trailer the boat up for the summer and leave it in the water, made for great weekends. One day after a race, the winds picked up BIG time. We had a 110 jib and only a single reef in the main. I asked one of the old pros and he said: "Sail on only one sail or the other. With your mast head rig, you'll sail better on your jib since you have to go upwind. The main would do, but it's slower." A few years later we were in the BVIs with heavy Christmas winds, and we sailed the Endeavor 32 with just the jib for a few days. Just yesterday we sailed from San Francisco back to our slip on just the jib, although the winds were mild and we were still doing 4 knots at 9 knot apparent wind on a reach. We do it a lot, both upwind and down. Yesterday, for instance, we were in no hurry to get home and just relaxed. I joke that the only work left on our boat is taking the mainsail cover off and putting it back on!


Your boat, your choice.
That's nice and I get being lazy.

I was talking the proper way to sail a boat upwind. Didn't mean to insult anyone.

Yes, running downwind in heavy wind you only need the jib.

To efficiently sail a boat upwind with less wear and tear on the boat use the main. Main and jib together is best but this guy asked about sailing with only one sail.

The jib forces the boat away from the wind!

Think of your rudder as a trim tab. Think of sailing your boat with the sails only. The best way is to be balanced so you do not get so much rudder (drag) Too much weather helm caused by the main or too much lee helm caused by the jib can force the driver to have to overcompensate with the rudder
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Old 04-12-2015, 12:03   #15
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Re: First solo sail on the ICW

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thomm, the C22, as I mentioned in reply #2, is a MASTHEAD rig. The larger driver is the JIB.
It's nice that it's a masthead rig, but that larger driver jib is still going to drive the bow away from the wind going upwind.

You'll be lucky if you can point within 90 degrees of the wind if it's blowing at all with the jib alone
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