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Old 14-05-2014, 12:52   #271
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re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkJ View Post
From you earlier post quoted from RBs blog:




Cause and effect?
That's what I'm wondering.
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Old 14-05-2014, 12:54   #272
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re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)

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How do some of you keep track of all the posts on this thread in order to come up some petty comeback post????????????? I can not even separate key takeaways from crap on the thread anymore.
The "ignore' feature helps me tremendously !
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Old 14-05-2014, 12:57   #273
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re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)

In my much less than expert opinion, the qtr ends at around where that fender is and the back stay attaches to the stern.

Just my 2 cents.

This discussion is similar to how many angels dance on a pin. Since Eric doesn't know where the water was coming from and if it was the area of the chainplates, it would have been pretty obvious, then I think it's unsolvable.
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Old 14-05-2014, 13:00   #274
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re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)

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The "ignore' feature helps me tremendously !
thanks
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Old 14-05-2014, 13:05   #275
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re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)

Heres a pic
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Old 14-05-2014, 13:05   #276
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re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)

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Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
Since Eric doesn't know where the water was coming from and if it was the area of the chainplates, it would have been pretty obvious, then I think it's unsolvable.
Eric posted earlier that he tried 4200 and 5200 to stop the leak and it washed away from the leak site. So it appears he did know where the leak was but was unable to stop it using the methods he wanted to invest time in.

My impression is that he thought it was a lower-order issue and he had higher priorities because the ingress rate was low and he was able to de-water easily.

Perhaps he'll give a better description of the damage/it's location and his observations and thoughts on this aspect at some point. It'll only happen when he's ready.
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Old 14-05-2014, 13:07   #277
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re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)

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Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
In my much less than expert opinion, the qtr ends at around where that fender is and the back stay attaches to the stern.

Just my 2 cents.

This discussion is similar to how many angels dance on a pin. Since Eric doesn't know where the water was coming from and if it was the area of the chainplates, it would have been pretty obvious, then I think it's unsolvable.
Yeah - you may be right. But here's RH's description:

Quote:
Originally Posted by rebel heart View Post
And if you want to throw a bullshit flag that's your business, but keep in mind the 129th guys saw the water coming in over the starboard quarter bulkhead and helped pump for the days they were onboard.

So maybe we had a natural mountain spring develop there and nice pure crystal water we could have bottled was coming through.

Or maybe a tiny little gnome sat in the overhead, with a very active bladder.
So where would that "starboard quarter bulkhead" be? A few feet aft of the chainplate?

What else could have ripped open the boat in this area? He said the stanchions where still on. So was it those cracks he mentioned? Rot? What?
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Old 14-05-2014, 13:13   #278
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re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)

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Heres a pic
That is a nice looking boat, Mark (Bob's a great designer, eh?). It reminds me a lot of the PSC37 I did some off-shore racing on (double-ender cutter) - some of it in some fairly sporty conditions. Fun, solid boats.
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Old 14-05-2014, 13:26   #279
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re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)

Maybe I've lost track, but where is this thread going? So the leak was somewhere in the starboard quarter. Maybe Eric knows exactly where or maybe it was coming from that area but couldn't see the exact failure point. I am all for analyzing any accident so that I may learn from it but this seems to be getting a bit nit picky.

Also if you want to pick apart every word Eric has said maybe you should read up on something called the fog of war. I am sure from the minute the accident happened until the minute he got onboard the navy vessel his adrenaline did not stop once. His mind was probably on survival of his family and not on which teak board he should pull up to find the exact failure so that he could fill us in on how many inches from the transom the crack was. He assessed the situation, he found it was not repairable, he found it was not life threatening and he moved on to his next of 100 problems.

To me it seems there are one or two people that want to discredit Eric on everything he has said. But then again maybe I am missing something.

To Eric: I am thrilled you and your family are healthy and safe. Please don't read too much into the smelly stuff that that seems to be getting thrown around by some people.
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Old 14-05-2014, 13:29   #280
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re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)

Heres the layout showing the quarter bulkhead. Its miles aft than the chainplates except the backstay chainplate.
Actually there are two bulkheads there, one at the foot of the pilot berth and one at the head of the pilot berth.
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Old 14-05-2014, 13:31   #281
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re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)

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Originally Posted by ontherocks83 View Post
Maybe I've lost track, but where is this thread going? So the leak was somewhere in the starboard quarter. Maybe Eric knows exactly where or maybe it was coming from that area but couldn't see the exact failure point. I am all for analyzing any accident so that I may learn from it but this seems to be getting a bit nit picky.

Also if you want to pick apart every word Eric has said maybe you should read up on something called the fog of war. I am sure from the minute the accident happened until the minute he got onboard the navy vessel his adrenaline did not stop once. His mind was probably on survival of his family and not on which teak board he should pull up to find the exact failure so that he could fill us in on how many inches from the transom the crack was. He assessed the situation, he found it was not repairable, he found it was not life threatening and he moved on to his next of 100 problems.

To me it seems there are one or two people that want to discredit Eric on everything he has said. But then again maybe I am missing something.

To Eric: I am thrilled you and your family are healthy and safe. Please don't read too much into the smelly stuff that that seems to be getting thrown around by some people.
My sentiments exactly ! Thanks
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Old 14-05-2014, 13:32   #282
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re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)

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Originally Posted by colemj View Post
I can't imagine a deck made from teak screwed into plywood which is screwed onto wood beams. There is no way RH could have lasted that long without the deck rotting into the cabin. Even in San Diego. However, I have seem many boats with only an outer skin of fiberglass, while the underneath (inside) of the deck is not glassed. Perhaps Eric was just mistaken on this point because he can see the inside? The outside glass wouldn't be visible without tearing up the teak.

If not, that would have to be mighty high-quality plywood that has seen almost no rain or salt water in its life.

Mark
Well, as a guy who owned the boat for eight years, did a bunch of deck work, pulled up beams, drilled holes through for deck fills and vents, I can assure you that yes indeed it was teak over plywood over beams.

Basically every boat built before fiberglass had the construction of wood over wood over wood, and plenty of boats kept that up into the 1970's. Here's a picture of my boat, starborad foredeck. Plank pulled up, you'll note the wood directly underneath.

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Old 14-05-2014, 13:36   #283
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re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)

Quote:
Also if you want to pick apart every word Eric has said maybe you should read up on something called the fog of war. I am sure from the minute the accident happened until the minute he got onboard the navy vessel his adrenaline did not stop once. His mind was probably on survival of his family and not on which teak board he should pull up to find the exact failure so that he could fill us in on how many inches from the transom the crack was. He assessed the situation, he found it was not repairable, he found it was not life threatening and he moved on to his next of 100 problems.
Ditto that!
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Old 14-05-2014, 13:38   #284
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re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)

OK, forgive me if this has already been covered, and I've simply missed it...

From first hearing of the broach and the resultant damage, my first thought was 'How, exactly, was the boom being prevented?'

If it was done as some do, more or less vanged vertically from mid-boom to the rail or a deck attachment point somewhere amidships, might that have caused the damage? Frankly, that's the only likely way I can imagine dipping the boom might do so... So, again, do we know whether the damage was anywhere near the possible 'point of prevention'? :-)

I really dislike preventers rigged in that fashion, they're a recipe for breaking either a boom, the tackle employed, or deck gear... The forces involved - especially with a low aspect rig and a longer boom like on RH - are enormously higher and more leveraged than what seems a more 'proper' arrangement, namely rigging the preventer from the end of the boom, and taken forward to the bow...

Again, my apologies if this has already been clarified or addressed, I'm a bit late to this party :-)
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Old 14-05-2014, 13:39   #285
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re: Call for Help/ This American Life (Merged)

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Heres the layout showing the quarter bulkhead. Its miles aft than the chainplates except the backstay chainplate.
Actually there are two bulkheads there, one at the foot of the pilot berth and one at the head of the pilot berth.
Gotcha. So should we assume the forward or aft bulkhead? From what I saw in the pics on his blog, the solar panels were mounted on the stern-rails (is it still a "push-pit" on a double ender?). In this case, if the stanchions were still on as he said - and the panels and outboard got ripped off - maybe the stern rail ripped up the deck? But I thought he also mentioned ingress at the cabin-top - which would put it forward of that. I'll keep looking.
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