California communities suing for polluters to pay for storm damage

[buzzstar]

Originally Posted by Exile

Due to the now decade-long domestic production boom, recent stats show imports down to 25%, and over 40% of that comes from Canada, a country that I think is still friendly towards the US.

Even with the whistle, you need to read the posts thoroughly; when the contributing Canadians are referrrrring (as in brrrr, as in cold) to the USA it does not seem friendly.

[SecondBase]

Originally Posted by bgallinger

AMEN! Bring on the flat tax!!

That's right. Flat Tax and put a word count limit on the tax code just like a term paper.

Less words = Less favoritism

[SV THIRD DAY]

Originally Posted by Exile

Why are you guys still talking about US dependency on foreign oil? Due to the now decade-long domestic production boom, recent stats show imports down to 25%, and over 40% of that comes from Canada, a country that I think is still friendly towards the US.

https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=32&t=6; https://www.eia.gov/petroleum/weekly...twipprint.html; https://www.forbes.com/sites/rrapier.../#7b3f6841264c

The US is now the 3rd-largest oil-producing nation and likely to move up. So US imports probably have more to do with oil being a worldwide commodity and less to do with the type of dependency that we saw in previous decades.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...oil_production

So Much for the Peak Oil Myth...it died along with Paul Ehrlich Population Bomb Lie. The doomsayers always leave out human ingenuity to solve problems when they forecast their Doom.

[Exile]

Originally Posted by Exile

Why are you guys still talking about US dependency on foreign oil? Due to the now decade-long domestic production boom, recent stats show imports down to 25%, and over 40% of that comes from Canada, a country that I think is still friendly towards the US.

https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=32&t=6; https://www.eia.gov/petroleum/weekly...twipprint.html; https://www.forbes.com/sites/rrapier.../#7b3f6841264c

The US is now the 3rd-largest oil-producing nation and likely to move up. So US imports probably have more to do with oil being a worldwide commodity and less to do with the type of dependency that we saw in previous decades.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...oil_production

Originally Posted by a64pilot

There has to be a limited amount of it, I have no idea if we have 10 years, or a million years at present consumption, but there has to be a finite amount. It doesn't seem to make sense to just burn what has to be a very important raw material, out of which a lot of our modern world is made from, and I don't just mean plastics.
Just seems conserving a finite resource is in our best interests.

Of course, and I couldn't agree more. But for better or worse fossil fuels are not discretionary, and are likely to be the dominant source for energy and all sorts of other products the world now depends on for the foreseeable future. That the US's newfound reserves are the dominant contributor to the recent glut of supply won't influence worldwide demand. Fossil fuels are a worldwide commodity that are a necessity not a luxury, and I kinda doubt that the number of Prius' vs. SUV's on the road is going to change the equation appreciably. This is also why many are dubious about the prospect of a 'carbon tax' or artificially inflated $10/gal. fuel. While it could very well promote some level of increased conservation, it will also necessarily & disproportionately hurt those least able to afford it. There is always a cost to every perceived benefit.

With the US now a dominant source of supply, however, what will change is the world no longer having to be beholdent to bad actors like those in the Middle East, Russia, Venezuela, etc. And ironically, much of the newfound wealth will much more likely go towards funding the technologies to help wean the world off fossil fuels, as opposed to funding the buildup of military arms, terrorism, oppression of civilian populations, and opulent personal wealth of dictators & autocrats.

My comments are not intended to be some sort of cheerleading exercise in support of the virtues of fossil fuels or the US fracking industry, but rather a statement on the the world is now as opposed to how we may wish it to be. This is the real problem I have with many who have co-opted the climate change mantle. On the pure merits of the issue I suspect there would be much agreement, although few on either side really understand the actual science. The controversy arises with proponents who are using the science to advance an entirely different social or political agenda that others find disingenuous if not repugnant. If the last US election is any gauge, I think a lot of people are tired of all the moralizing, virtue signaling & negativity this inevitably brings to most discussions of the issue.

[Exile]

Originally Posted by buzzstar

Even with the whistle, you need to read the posts thoroughly; when the contributing Canadians are referrrrring (as in brrrr, as in cold) to the USA it does not seem friendly.

Nah, while some of our Canadian shipmates disagree with our politics, I've never found them to be disagreeable. Besides, it seems that all too many of them enjoy drinking good beer.

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by SV THIRD DAY

So Much for the Peak Oil Myth...it died along with Paul Ehrlich Population Bomb Lie. The doomsayers always leave out human ingenuity to solve problems when they forecast their Doom.

I'm 60.... all I care about is the next 25. Beyond that.... it's someone else's problem to sort out.

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by markpierce

I'm unhappy being required to subsidize people buying electric cars. If they are such a great idea, they should be able to sell on their own.

What i find quite amazing is Tesla has a market cap similar to GM yet Tesla sells under 10,000 cars a year (at a loss i should add) and GM sells hundreds of thousands.

My point is musk is the worlds greatest saleman, he mananges to get billions of dollars invested into his company , from individuals and the government yet fails to make a profit EVER! Prior to "bubble world" only companies that made profit stayed around!

Im just envious, wish i was this good.

[SV THIRD DAY]

Originally Posted by daletournier

What i find quite amazing is Tesla has a market cap similar to GM yet Tesla sells under 10,000 cars a year (at a loss i should add) and GM sells hundreds of thousands.

My point is musk is the worlds greatest saleman, he mananges to get billions of dollars invested into his company , from individuals and the government yet fails to make a profit EVER! Prior to "bubble world" only companies that made profit stayed around!

Im just envious, wish i was this good.

Ding Dong....thats so right on.
Welcome to the New World where results are second to Sales Hype. The Billions in free taxpayer money can take you places these days!

[Exile]

Originally Posted by daletournier

What i find quite amazing is Tesla has a market cap similar to GM yet Tesla sells under 10,000 cars a year (at a loss i should add) and GM sells hundreds of thousands.

My point is musk is the worlds greatest saleman, he mananges to get billions of dollars invested into his company , from individuals and the government yet fails to make a profit EVER! Prior to "bubble world" only companies that made profit stayed around!

Im just envious, wish i was this good.

The govt subsidies might make slightly more sense if Tesla made a lower priced car geared more for the masses. Instead, you've got all these subsidies -- during the Obama years no less -- for a car that's sold to the demonized 1%'ers of all people! So in this case it winds up being the masses paying through their tax dollars to help make a luxury car more affordable for wealthy people!! WTF is up with that?!

[brantleychuck]

Originally Posted by SecondBase

As you allude we can't prognosticate global warming from the varying number of storms in one year. Average ocean temps on the other hand are really hard to fake and equally easy to both re-measure and to peer review.

Ocean temps = rising

Warmer oceans = more and larger storms

Which hurricane season will be busier 2017 or 2018?
No idea but the trend is clear and pointing in one direction.

Slower jetstream = more rainfall from pinned rotating storms

I believe CAFE standards are, like most legislation, unable to keep up with technology. Electric & entrepreneurs will get us there.

"Electrification is coming, whether automakers make pledges to update their fleets or not. Tesla's flashy all-electric vehicles have built up massive hype in the automotive scene, while legislators around the world are working to promote the use of electric cars and even ban OG gas engines for environmental reasons. Daimler is taking a step into the future with its commitment to electric cars — but it's a step that all carmakers will eventually have to take to stay on the road."

http://feeds.mashable.com/~r/Mashable/~3/cI3jZKnQe8I/

Will taking the manmade contribution down to zero stop global warming? Not likely but if the Pentagon is saying our planet is going to crack we should at least try.

What caused the little ice age? We still don't agree 500 years later. So yeah some of this well-intended science is overstated but both the intention and conclusion are positive.

" average ocean temps are hard to fake". I did a bit of research on how average ocean temps are arrived at. It looks to me like a giant guessing game with endless variables to guess about. To me , if one had a agenda or belief, very to fudge the numbers

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by Exile

The govt subsidies might make slightly more sense if Tesla made a lower priced car geared more for the masses. Instead, you've got all these subsidies -- during the Obama years no less -- for a car that's sold to the demonized 1%'ers of all people! So in this case it winds up being the masses paying through their tax dollars to help make a luxury car more affordable for wealthy people!! WTF is up with that?!

One of the games that was played a few years ago when the tax breaks were very high for electric vehicles is a few wealthy in my town bought new golf carts, claimed them as electric vehicles for the tax break and not only got a free taxpayer paid for golf cart, but I believe reduced their tax bill as well.

Very often well intended rules are taken advantage of and the end result is not at all what was intended.

Myself the day the cash for clunkers was enacted, I drove my old 93 Z28 down to the Toyota dealer and bought a Prius.
I would have hoped the deal would since it was US taxpayer money, would have specified an automobile that was at least made in the US, but it didn't.

As far as SUV's vs Prius and or others like it not reducing fuel consumption. It's my belief that it would cut it by at least half, and that is I believe a conservative estimate.

It's about 392 Million gallons per day, every day. That is not a drop in the bucket.
https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=23&t=10

[brantleychuck]

Originally Posted by zeehag

what rich boren said. yes.
if going solar do it yourself . i saw the shingles being purchased for use in mexican housing back in 2001 in san diego. yup do it yourself.

what i wanna know, and it itches my brain in the most annoying manner, is~~~(drum roll please)
when the biiiiig earthquake hits cali damaging both sf and la as well as tickling richie rich sin diego, who the hell are the californikators going to sue for causing the quake???!!!~~~~~~~~~
and will the quaking be blamed on global warming and who gets sued for that.~~~~
shake rattle and roll, baby. surf that sidewalk and donot stay in any tall buildings.

something gotta be happening soon as mexico has 2 tectonic plates and a san andreas actively playing with added volcanic changes.
as bye bye californikasha is spozed to happen in about a million years, mebbe we should not yet hold our breath.
chikkin little would look better in the crock pot than running around wringing hands. makes more sense as well. just dont park your mobile home on the damned beach in a storm area and donot build permanent edifices in a flood plain or caldera. mazatlan builds permanence in lagoons.. oopsy....
i remember my chemical engineer dad checking for that and more with my mechanical engineer grandpoppa when we were kids.

" who will the quake be blamed on". The closest Fracker of course!

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

One of the games that was played a few years ago when the tax breaks were very high for electric vehicles is a few wealthy in my town bought new golf carts, claimed them as electric vehicles for the tax break and not only got a free taxpayer paid for golf cart, but I believe reduced their tax bill as well.

Very often well intended rules are taken advantage of and the end result is not at all what was intended.

Myself the day the cash for clunkers was enacted, I drove my old 93 Z28 down to the Toyota dealer and bought a Prius.
I would have hoped the deal would since it was US taxpayer money, would have specified an automobile that was at least made in the US, but it didn't.

As far as SUV's vs Prius and or others like it not reducing fuel consumption. It's my belief that it would cut it by at least half, and that is I believe a conservative estimate.

It's about 392 Million gallons per day, every day. That is not a drop in the bucket.
https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=23&t=10

Z28 traded for a Prius? Did your Prius come with the standard feature "coexist" bumper sticker?

[a64pilot]

No, I bought the 93 Z28 in 93 specifically to take to Germany to run the Autobahn. We had a VW Diesel Golf then, and I didn't want to take that to the land of the Autobahn.
93 was the first year the HP really came back, the 93 Z 28 was both the quickest and fastest Camaro produced until that time.
Then we came back to the US, kept the car, it got old, wife got herself first a new SS Camaro, one of the last built, and then later a CTS-V Cadillac, but we kept the old Z as it wasn't worth much, but was still in excellent shape, it just gathered dust for years in an aircraft hanger. My wife likes fast cars, I have always had a love for the American V8 muscle car myself, although I throughly enjoy "real" sports cars too, currently driving a Mazdaspeed Turbo Miata.
Plan was to find a nice place in Fl to park our 5th wheel, leave the old Z at the local airport and fly down on weekends.
However due to types of students at the school she was teaching (death threats and the back window car being busted out), she took a job in a small town 50 miles away, meaning of course more than 100 miles a day drive, and the CTS-V was not an economical car to drive, tires alone were a grand and lasted maybe 10,000 miles.
After owning a Prius for seven years and more than 200,000 miles, I can tell you from experience that nothing is more economical than a Prius. Everything from maintenance, to tires and Insurence, it's cheaper to operate than even a motorcycle

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

No, I bought the 93 Z28 in 93 specifically to take to Germany to run the Autobahn. We had a VW Diesel Golf then, and I didn't want to take that to the land of the Autobahn.
93 was the first year the HP really came back, the 93 Z 28 was both the quickest and fastest Camaro produced until that time.
Then we came back to the US, kept the car, it got old, wife got herself first a new SS Camaro, one of the last built, and then later a CTS-V Cadillac, but we kept the old Z as it wasn't worth much, but was still in excellent shape, it just gathered dust for years in an aircraft hanger. My wife likes fast cars, I have always had a love for the American V8 muscle car myself, although I throughly enjoy "real" sports cars too, currently driving a Mazdaspeed Turbo Miata.
Plan was to find a nice place in Fl to park our 5th wheel, leave the old Z at the local airport and fly down on weekends.
However due to types of students at the school she was teaching (death threats and the back window car being busted out), she took a job in a small town 50 miles away, meaning of course more than 100 miles a day drive, and the CTS-V was not an economical car to drive, tires alone were a grand and lasted maybe 10,000 miles.
After owning a Prius for seven years and more than 200,000 miles, I can tell you from experience that nothing is more economical than a Prius. Everything from maintenance, to tires and Insurence, it's cheaper to operate than even a motorcycle

That is true , but I just can't see myself driving one . I'm waiting for them to allow the diesel smart car into the CONUS . but by then I will likely be an expat or dead of old age.