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Old 14-03-2017, 09:31   #31
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Re: Buying my first boat, need some advice after survey.

[QUOTE=buzzstar;2344867]"There is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing as simply messing about in boats." [QUOTE]

Absolutely!

But it's not cool to "mess around" for your personal "free entertainment" on other people's boats who are trying to "SELL" them.

Again, nothing wrong with performing proper due diligence on a boat one intends to "BUY".

If you enjoy talking boats, "LOOK", "BUY", "FIX", "SAIL". Don't get stuck in the "LOOK" stage, or you miss the real education in boat selection.

Don't get me wrong, when I have a boat for sale, I really enjoy talking to newbies who are seriously looking at getting into boating, or an experienced sailor looking seriously to change boats.

I just have no time for "career" boat inspectors with no real intention of buying anything unless they can buy it for pennies on the dollar, regardless how wonderful it checks out.
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Old 14-03-2017, 11:58   #32
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Re: Buying my first boat, need some advice after survey.

[QUOTE=ramblinrod;2346910][QUOTE=buzzstar;2344867]"There is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing as simply messing about in boats."
Quote:
I just have no time for "career" boat inspectors with no real intention of buying anything unless they can buy it for pennies on the dollar, regardless how wonderful it checks out.
If I am in your area, I KNOW where not to shop for boats or deal of any kind. I do not pretend to speak for other, but the matter closed for me.
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Old 14-03-2017, 12:37   #33
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Re: Buying my first boat, need some advice after survey.

[QUOTE=ramblinrod;2346910][QUOTE=buzzstar;2344867]"There is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing as simply messing about in boats."
Quote:

Absolutely!

But it's not cool to "mess around" for your personal "free entertainment" on other people's boats who are trying to "SELL" them.

Again, nothing wrong with performing proper due diligence on a boat one intends to "BUY".

If you enjoy talking boats, "LOOK", "BUY", "FIX", "SAIL". Don't get stuck in the "LOOK" stage, or you miss the real education in boat selection.

Don't get me wrong, when I have a boat for sale, I really enjoy talking to newbies who are seriously looking at getting into boating, or an experienced sailor looking seriously to change boats.

I just have no time for "career" boat inspectors with no real intention of buying anything unless they can buy it for pennies on the dollar, regardless how wonderful it checks out.
Tire kickers.
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Old 14-03-2017, 14:43   #34
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Re: Buying my first boat, need some advice after survey.

Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzstar View Post
If I am in your area, I KNOW where not to shop for boats or deal of any kind.
Business or personal, it behooves the seller to screen out those who intend to waste their time.

One way, is to determine if the "prospective purchaser" is seeking to buy a boat, or just inspecting boats for the "free entertainment" value with no intent to purchase whatsoever (or put another way, finding one in perfect condition for a low price.)

If the latter, it doesn't hurt my feelings one bit if they go elsewhere.
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Old 14-03-2017, 15:25   #35
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Re: Buying my first boat, need some advice after survey.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ramblinrod View Post
Business or personal, it behooves the seller to screen out those who intend to waste their time.

One way, is to determine if the "prospective purchaser" is seeking to buy a boat, or just inspecting boats for the "free entertainment" value with no intent to purchase whatsoever (or put another way, finding one in perfect condition for a low price.)

If the latter, it doesn't hurt my feelings one bit if they go elsewhere.
I appreciate the online postings. Highly unlikely at my age I will buy but who knows? And I won't yank a brokers chain with a senseless inquiry. I hope all have the good sense not to inquire if it is BS.
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Old 14-03-2017, 15:51   #36
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Re: Buying my first boat, need some advice after survey.

Ramblin Rod IS entitled to his opinion, of course, but I'm wondering if he failed to take into consideration the location of the OP.

Imo, it is an unwarranted jump to label him a time waster. The man wants to select a boat that's a good fit for him in an area of the world where woodworking is cheap (so you will find beautiful interiors), but where osmosis repair is not as well done as in New Zealand or Australia, let alone the States.

The issue of the owner being surprised because he had "repaired" some blisters last year, made me think that either those repairs had been purely cosmetic (something I've seen done, with no effort to dry out the hull first), or poorly done. No reason the OP should saddle himself with that boat. That makes him a prudent man, not necessarily a tire kicker.

I have no idea where or how Rod came up with the 6 months figure. It may be well suited to his own temperament, and yachting environment, but need not be so for others, especially in far off places.

Ann
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Old 14-03-2017, 15:56   #37
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Re: Buying my first boat, need some advice after survey.

Good. Not just boat buying, but more frequent types of transactions as well.
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Old 14-03-2017, 16:04   #38
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Re: Buying my first boat, need some advice after survey.

OK, I just read all of this; and I AM an expert on osmotic blistering/delamination and boat surveying/repair in general...

1) Never fall in love with a boat
2) see 1
3) A GOOD surveyor will have access to a range of valuation databases that you don't have access to and their valuation is a good sense of what similar boats have sold for. Asking prices aren't relevant, selling prices are.
4) There are a LOT of boats in your price range; if you were my client I'd tell you to walk away.
5) You aren't my client so this advice isn't costing you anything.. others pay for it so take it for what it's worth.

Good luck in your search.
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Old 14-03-2017, 16:19   #39
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Re: Buying my first boat, need some advice after survey.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadence View Post
I appreciate the online postings. Highly unlikely at my age I will buy but who knows? And I won't yank a brokers chain with a senseless inquiry. I hope all have the good sense not to inquire if it is BS.
It's amazing how many people think nothing of wasting someone else's time inspecting every square inch of countless boats, with no intent (or ability) to ever offer a fair price.

So the first thing the wise seller does is weed these people out, before they ever come to look at the boat.
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Old 14-03-2017, 16:31   #40
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Re: Buying my first boat, need some advice after survey.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate View Post
Ramblin Rod IS entitled to his opinion, of course, but I'm wondering if he failed to take into consideration the location of the OP.

Imo, it is an unwarranted jump to label him a time waster. The man wants to select a boat that's a good fit for him in an area of the world where woodworking is cheap (so you will find beautiful interiors), but where osmosis repair is not as well done as in New Zealand or Australia, let alone the States.

The issue of the owner being surprised because he had "repaired" some blisters last year, made me think that either those repairs had been purely cosmetic (something I've seen done, with no effort to dry out the hull first), or poorly done. No reason the OP should saddle himself with that boat. That makes him a prudent man, not necessarily a tire kicker.

I have no idea where or how Rod came up with the 6 months figure. It may be well suited to his own temperament, and yachting environment, but need not be so for others, especially in far off places.

Ann
Ann, I'm not saying that he shouldn't walk away from that boat.

I'm saying that if he has spent 2.5 years, looking for a boat up to 40 years old, around 33 feet, in the £25k (GPB) range, and he has yet to find something worth buying, he's doing something seriously wrong.
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Old 14-03-2017, 16:36   #41
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Re: Buying my first boat, need some advice after survey.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Berg View Post
OK, I just read all of this; and I AM an expert on osmotic blistering/delamination and boat surveying/repair in general...

1) Never fall in love with a boat
2) see 1
3) A GOOD surveyor will have access to a range of valuation databases that you don't have access to and their valuation is a good sense of what similar boats have sold for. Asking prices aren't relevant, selling prices are.
4) There are a LOT of boats in your price range; if you were my client I'd tell you to walk away.
5) You aren't my client so this advice isn't costing you anything.. others pay for it so take it for what it's worth.

Good luck in your search.
Free advice can be costly, or with a fortune.
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Old 14-03-2017, 18:54   #42
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Re: Buying my first boat, need some advice after survey.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ramblinrod View Post
It's amazing how many people think nothing of wasting someone else's time inspecting every square inch of countless boats, with no intent (or ability) to ever offer a fair price.

So the first thing the wise seller does is weed these people out, before they ever come to look at the boat.

Ramblin Rod or Irritating Sod?

I work 5 week rotations on a small island off Borneo (Labuan) When I have my time off that is spent either flying back home to Scotland or traveling. I only actually fly to Langkawi when I see something on a brokers website actually worth viewing which isn't often but Malaysia is where I want to keep a boat. Tie that in with when I can get time off out of 2.5yrs looking it amounts to less than 3 weeks I've actually been able to view over that period.

2.5yrs looking doesn't mean I've spent literally 2.5yr in a marina.

As for wasting peoples time I hauled the boat for a full survey at the cost of £500 to myself how much time and money do you think I like waisting?
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Old 15-03-2017, 15:15   #43
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Re: Buying my first boat, need some advice after survey.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottie Dog View Post
Ramblin Rod or Irritating Sod?

I work 5 week rotations on a small island off Borneo (Labuan) When I have my time off that is spent either flying back home to Scotland or traveling. I only actually fly to Langkawi when I see something on a brokers website actually worth viewing which isn't often but Malaysia is where I want to keep a boat. Tie that in with when I can get time off out of 2.5yrs looking it amounts to less than 3 weeks I've actually been able to view over that period.

2.5yrs looking doesn't mean I've spent literally 2.5yr in a marina.

As for wasting peoples time I hauled the boat for a full survey at the cost of £500 to myself how much time and money do you think I like waisting?
Everyone has their methodology.

When I get serious about buying a personal boat, it takes about 5 days (elapsed over 3 months) from time of my initial search, through inspections (typically 3 boats) to closing the deal on "the one".

IMHO, there is no unicorn (perfect boat) so there is no point looking for it.

1. Look at a few, pick the best, sail, enjoy.

2. Learn from that experience.

3. Repeat.

Anything else is just looking for the entertainment of shopping or perhaps insecurity (inability to pull the trigger).

Anyone who is not able to pull the trigger after checking out a great boat, should just stop shopping, the problem isn't the boats they're looking at, it's their inability to purchase.

If every boat visited is deemed a dog, increase the budget and stop wasting time looking at dogs. Yer not gonna buy a prize thoroughbred at a mutt price.
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Old 17-03-2017, 12:55   #44
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Re: Buying my first boat, need some advice after survey.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottie Dog View Post
Ramblin Rod or Irritating Sod?

I work 5 week rotations on a small island off Borneo (Labuan) When I have my time off that is spent either flying back home to Scotland or traveling. I only actually fly to Langkawi when I see something on a brokers website actually worth viewing which isn't often but Malaysia is where I want to keep a boat. Tie that in with when I can get time off out of 2.5yrs looking it amounts to less than 3 weeks I've actually been able to view over that period.

2.5yrs looking doesn't mean I've spent literally 2.5yr in a marina.

As for wasting peoples time I hauled the boat for a full survey at the cost of £500 to myself how much time and money do you think I like waisting?
Take all the time you need, it's going to be your boat. Keep in mind RR is in the marine business, and not everyone will agree with his opinion (I don't). Every toy I have ever bought, and to me a boat is a toy and to people in the business it may not be, there is a great deal out there, always.

Nothing worse than spending hard earned money on something and then regretting it the entire time you own it. Take your time. If someone doesn't want to sell to you, someone else will.

If I made my living in the industry, or was planning for it to be my future home for the rest of my days, I would probably agree with RR.

Do what you feel is best, it's your money...
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Old 18-03-2017, 00:15   #45
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Re: Buying my first boat, need some advice after survey.

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Originally Posted by Byrdman View Post
Take all the time you need, it's going to be your boat. Keep in mind RR is in the marine business, and not everyone will agree with his opinion (I don't). Every toy I have ever bought, and to me a boat is a toy and to people in the business it may not be, there is a great deal out there, always.

Nothing worse than spending hard earned money on something and then regretting it the entire time you own it. Take your time. If someone doesn't want to sell to you, someone else will.

If I made my living in the industry, or was planning for it to be my future home for the rest of my days, I would probably agree with RR.

Do what you feel is best, it's your money...
Most boats sell for pretty much exactly what they are worth.

AS in most areas of life, ya get what ya pay for.

Do your homework, determine what you want, investigate the examples that are currently up for sale, and go look at 3 of them that seem like reasonable prospects.

Pick the best out of the 3.

Any more than that, and you won't be able to remember what was what, and by the time you look at the nth, you realize one of the first 3 was the best, and its sold, because someone else wasn't wasting their time "looking".
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