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Old 08-01-2013, 13:32   #16
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Re: BP Will Be Feeling Smug

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Bluefuss,

I guess you ride a bicycle and have an electric car..No wait it takes natural gas to make electricity.
Sailorman375, yes i do ride a bike, or walk, everychance i get. Otherwise I take my 1 ton deisel pickup and head for the oilfields to build pipelines. I am a part of the oil and gas industry, its how I make a living. The point is there is lots and lots and lots of oil besides whats in the Arctic. Maybe 100 years from now when we really need that Arctic oil they will have the technology to extract it without destroying the planet. But they are gonna make one h*ll of a mess trying to do it now.
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Old 08-01-2013, 13:54   #17
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Re: BP Will Be Feeling Smug

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ROFLMAOLOLOLO Now thats Funny stuff!!!

Hmmm, was it 3 thumbs up for BP in the Gulf of Mexico? The Arctic Ocean is going to make extracting oil in the Gulf of Mexico look like childs play.
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Old 08-01-2013, 16:09   #18
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Re: BP Will Be Feeling Smug

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Hmmm, was it 3 thumbs up for BP in the Gulf of Mexico? The Arctic Ocean is going to make extracting oil in the Gulf of Mexico look like childs play.
No what Mimsy said was freaking funny, whats also funny is people thinking they are smarter than those in charge of making decisions for multi billion dollar energy companies. There are dozens of places to Extract oil on our earth, Really doubt it isnt going to be that big a deal or they would focus their efforts in one of dozens of other areas. Also Funny I guess its ok with you to drill anywhere but there? Not sure why you are so worked up about it, would you have been smug had there been death and disaster???? Me personaly I think it was great there wasnt either.
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Old 08-01-2013, 19:00   #19
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Re: BP Will Be Feeling Smug

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You do realize you are on a forum which is largely populated by owners of fiber glass boats (petroleum product), most of which have engines and generators which run on DIESEL , which have electronics which have wiring encased in plastic (petroleum product) etc.etc? Oh and the internet? Yeah- would not exist without fossil fuels.

Unless you are protesting from a hut made of salvaged animal skins using smoke signals as your communications device its rather hypocritical to bemoan big evil oil companies when you are using their products every. single. day.
Agreed.

I have been contracted by BP and other big oil companies to assist in writing HAZOPS (hazardous operations) Plans. I can assure you that few, if any other industries spend the amount of time, money and effort to protect worker's safety and the environment.

To suggest that big oil companies are careless and have no regard for the environment or safety of their personnel is to imply that they have no regard for multi-billion dollar assets, the loss of which cannot be replaced for five years+, which will set back production for close to a decade. Also, keep in mind that BP spent close to 40 billion dollars for the clean-up effort in the gulf. They were almost bought out by EXXON as a result. Think they gave a ****??? I do. Transocean lost it's most productive deep-water asset (TO D/V DeepWater Horizon). Think they gave a ****??? I do.

I know many of the workers who were on the Horizon when she blew out. They lost 11 friends who were as close to them as family. Think they gave a ****?? I do.

These companies and these men take great risks. They invest billions upon billions to make it as safe as humanly possible. **** happens.

It's certainly fair to be upset over an environmental disaster or even potential disaster. It's fair to expect investigations, regulations accountabilty, etc.

It is not fair to claim that these people are reckless or don't care. I can understand your anger. Just try to be more thoughtful about where you aim it.

These aren't reckless cowboys. The people in charge of these assets are the best in the world at what they do. There is no one that can do it any better. You are free to give it a shot if you wish. I can hook you up with a job on the drill floor if you want to see what challenges these men face.
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Old 08-01-2013, 19:20   #20
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Re: BP Will Be Feeling Smug

Its currently the american way to hate big oil companies, but drive your SUV to the protest. On a side note -everyone driving a toyota prius is smug jackass who thinks their changing the world, as they give dirty looks to anyone in a regular gasser, even worse if you drive a classic. How dare you!
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Old 08-01-2013, 19:22   #21
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Re: BP Will Be Feeling Smug

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No what Mimsy said was freaking funny, whats also funny is people thinking they are smarter than those in charge of making decisions for multi billion dollar energy companies. There are dozens of places to Extract oil on our earth, Really doubt it isnt going to be that big a deal or they would focus their efforts in one of dozens of other areas. Also Funny I guess its ok with you to drill anywhere but there? Not sure why you are so worked up about it, would you have been smug had there been death and disaster???? Me personaly I think it was great there wasnt either.
I agree Mimsy is well written. I dont think i'm smarter than those in charge of making decisions for multi billion dollar energy companies, just less greedy. I am not in a position to recieve a multi million dollar bonus for hitting some profit level during my tenure.
And no its not ok to drill anywhere but in the Artic Ocean, thats the whole point. When these decisions to drill, and transport, are made they are based on profitability only, and with our new found abilities to destroy the only home we have, its long past time to factor a few other things into the decision making process. Like can we do it without poisoning our fellow inhabitants. I mean geeezz didnt the Gulf of Mexico teach anyone, anything?
There are other energy projects that are just plain dangerous, the Gateway pipeline from Edmonton Alberta to Kitimat BC being a prime example. Why ship oil to China instead of pipeing it to Texas? Why not pipe it to Eastern Canada where they recieve shipped oil from South America and the middle east? Bigger profits. The Chinese will pay more. Guaranteeing corporate oil excecutive bonuses.The bigger risks are mitigated by insurance and by cozy relationships with politicians, insuring that out of pocket expenses for environmental disasters are "managable".
We need the oil, lets just do this so we can sit back and enjoy the thought of the wonderful future we have guaranteed for the generations following us.
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Old 08-01-2013, 19:29   #22
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Re: BP Will Be Feeling Smug

Flink
I cut my teeth on a drill floor and have seen a few people disabled for life on them too. I admire your faith in the technology involved but its my opinion that it is misplaced. Here they are telling us they have the ability to harvest this oil from beneath the Arctic Ocean floor and they cant even get a rig in place. It MUST make you wonder. Makes me worry
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Old 08-01-2013, 19:38   #23
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Re: BP Will Be Feeling Smug

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I agree Mimsy is well written. I dont think i'm smarter than those in charge of making decisions for multi billion dollar energy companies, just less greedy. I am not in a position to recieve a multi million dollar bonus for hitting some profit level during my tenure.
And no its not ok to drill anywhere but in the Artic Ocean, thats the whole point. When these decisions to drill, and transport, are made they are based on profitability only, and with our new found abilities to destroy the only home we have, its long past time to factor a few other things into the decision making process. Like can we do it without poisoning our fellow inhabitants. I mean geeezz didnt the Gulf of Mexico teach anyone, anything?
There are other energy projects that are just plain dangerous, the Gateway pipeline from Edmonton Alberta to Kitimat BC being a prime example. Why ship oil to China instead of pipeing it to Texas? Why not pipe it to Eastern Canada where they recieve shipped oil from South America and the middle east? Bigger profits. The Chinese will pay more. Guaranteeing corporate oil excecutive bonuses.The bigger risks are mitigated by insurance and by cozy relationships with politicians, insuring that out of pocket expenses for environmental disasters are "managable".
We need the oil, lets just do this so we can sit back and enjoy the thought of the wonderful future we have guaranteed for the generations following us.
Bluefuss,

Oil company executives are concerned with up-stream cost of production. That's what the shareholders pay them for.

When you see oil companies drilling in 8000 feet of water at a cost of 1 million dollars a day, using a 1.7 billion dollar rig, with the average cost of a deep-water well coming in at over 100 million dollars (80% are non-producing wells) why do you think they are doing that?

With all of the tie-backs, sub-sea infrastructure, etc, it cost billions of dollars to bring a deepwater field on-line. That's not counting the years of engeneering, legal hurdles, permits, etc.

The only reason these companies are risking this money and these assets in these harsh environments is because that's where the remaining oil is. Where the oil companies are drilling now is the safest, cheapest place to produce oil. They wouldn't be there otherwise. Do you think oil company executives get fat bonuses for drilling in Alaska? They get paid to produce the oil as cheaply and as safely as possible.

We can can close the deepwater gulf and Alaska to drilling. But when gas goes to 9 bucks a gallon everything else from milk to tennis shoes goes up too.

What's your solution?
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Old 08-01-2013, 19:51   #24
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Re: BP Will Be Feeling Smug

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Bluefuss,

Oil company executives are concerned with up-stream cost of production. That's what the shareholders pay them for.

When you see oil companies drilling in 8000 feet of water at a cost of 1 million dollars a day, using a 1.7 billion dollar rig, with the average cost of a deep-water well coming in at over 100 million dollars (80% are non-producing wells) why do you think they are doing that?

With all of the tie-backs, sub-sea infrastructure, etc, it cost billions of dollars to bring a deepwater field on-line. That's not counting the years of engeneering, legal hurdles, permits, etc.

The only reason these companies are risking this money and these assets in these harsh environments is because that's where the remaining oil is. Where the oil companies are drilling now is the safest, cheapest place to produce oil. They wouldn't be there otherwise. Do you think oil company executives get fat bonuses for drilling in Alaska? They get paid to produce the oil as cheaply and as safely as possible.

We can can close the deepwater gulf and Alaska to drilling. But when gas goes to 9 bucks a gallon everything else from milk to tennis shoes goes up too.

What's your solution?
The United States are about to change from being a net importer, to a net exporter of oil. They are awash in cheap gas. Thanks to hydralic fracking,a new technology. My solution, wait for better technology, its not far away.
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Old 08-01-2013, 20:01   #25
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If we have so much oil, why is diesel 4 bucks a gallon?
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Old 08-01-2013, 20:05   #26
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Re: BP Will Be Feeling Smug

ok bluefuss. And fracing is safer??? Know much about fracing???

We have an old saying here in Texas:

"Never try to teach a pig to sing. It just waists your time and it annoys the pig."

You and I will just agree to disagree. Let's just hope we don't have a disaster up there. That musch we can agree on.

Good day sir and fair winds.
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Old 08-01-2013, 20:13   #27
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Re: BP Will Be Feeling Smug

Flink, if you have read my earlier posts you will know I make my living in the patch, so yep I know something about fracking. And no its certainly not perfect by any means. As for singing ur right, i cant. Enjoyed the discussion tho. Cheers
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Old 09-01-2013, 01:49   #28
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Re: BP Will Be Feeling Smug

I hope lessons are learned from the Kulluk grounding, no doubt there will be a few.
I'm sort of indirectly involved in deep water projects, and in a lot of cases, the oil companies go to extraordinary lengths to ensure a safe operation. But, and this is my observation, I do see them taking less care if they are in an area in which they could get away with taking a few shortcuts. An example a few years ago working with a deep water rig off the coast of west Africa, and they were flaring. Not achieving proper burn, and the sea surface was covered in oil. If it had been the North Sea the whole operation would have stopped and investigations started.
When we move rigs in the North Sea, its normally at least 3 boats of around 200 tonne bollard pull involved. For the tow, 2 tugs will be connected, and quite normal for the third to ride shot gun.
I'm happy to see that the Kulluk was dragged off the beach with little to no environmental impact, but I'm pretty sure that the next tow will be under much more stringent guidelines.
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Old 09-01-2013, 05:12   #29
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Re: BP Will Be Feeling Smug

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On a side note -everyone driving a toyota prius is smug jackass who thinks their changing the world, as they give dirty looks to anyone in a regular gasser, even worse if you drive a classic. How dare you!
I don't have a Toyota Prius, nor will I ever get one - but very popular locally as Taxis, and they ain't bought on sentiment or for a feeling of smuggness!

IMO they are (a small part of) "changing the world", even if not for the reasons many owners think (mainly that carbon footprint is larger than most conventional cars - let alone for a classic )........but nonetheless they are an important part in moving both electric technology forward as well as the marketplace (IMO both as important as each other)........my belief (and hope!) is that Electric Vehicles are a large chunk of the future for personal transport (won't of course replace oil powered vehicles for every application), and not for any environmental reasons (I truly don't give a sh#t about penguins etc - indeed I would run a vehicle by burning live Penguins if I could, just because it would be funny ).....I just think EV is way cool , it simply seems more efficient to produce power centrally and to distribute using existing infracstructure according to the needs of each (I think it's called Socialism ) and also because I am lazy (why would I ever want to visit a gas station?).
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Old 09-01-2013, 05:36   #30
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Re: BP Will Be Feeling Smug

DOJ, if you look at the electrical supply needs of a future EV, you would be ripping up every supply to every house to install 3 phase. Plug-ins are a dead end technology.

Ultimately it will have to be automatically replaceable recharged battery packs, so in your EV youll be visiting plenty of "filling stations" and being releived of as many bucks as you are today ( The gov will have its tax one way or the other).

Remember the UK Nuclear power slogan "too cheap to meter", Yeap. right.....

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