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Old 04-01-2019, 12:32   #91
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Re: Beware people who say they have a Captains License but do not.

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Originally Posted by ninethlife View Post
The most incompetent I have encountered through the years (but adored by insurance co's) are the 'all ocean/all tonnage' fully licensed captains. They qualify because of their decades of dedicated service as an engine wiper or cooks assistant aboard a freighter. Totally clueless and bluffing.
I tried to make a point earlier that apparently was poorly presented. A license says someone can ride on a boat and pass a relatively simple test but not much about a persons seamanship abilities, whether it's a six-pack, unlimited oceans or none at all. Over the years I've sailed with some damn fine seaman, some had licenses and some not. I don't believe it's fair to lump people together based solely on one part of the whole. On of my best friends who is unfortunately now passed on carried a master unlimited oceans license after fishing the Grand Banks for years on schooners, being torpedoed twice in the North Atlantic while serving as captain and was credited with saving many lives, then went on with a varied, honorable and successful career at sea. We are all a jumble of different things it would be nice to judged as an individual and by the totality of who we are.
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Old 04-01-2019, 12:40   #92
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Re: Beware people who say they have a Captains License but do not.

I am a licensed Master of 100-ton vessels in Near Coastal waters. I was required to get a TWIC the last time around the licensing bend. Now, scuttlebut is that TWIC is no longer required.
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Old 04-01-2019, 12:41   #93
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Re: Beware people who say they have a Captains License but do not.

On another related topic, some Captains have minimal real experience. One captain in San Diego was helping a new boat owner to park his two engine 50 foot boat because the owner was afraid to try.


The Captain ran the boat up on the dock, not in the slip, on the walkway. Turns out it was the first time he had driven anything but a sailboat.


Taking a Captain's course does not make you a real Captain, but a Captain in training in some cases.


Never hurts to see a resume if you are hiring a Captain to do anything serious.
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Old 04-01-2019, 13:02   #94
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Re: Beware people who say they have a Captains License but do not.

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Originally Posted by CaptainDana View Post
I am a licensed Master of 100-ton vessels in Near Coastal waters. I was required to get a TWIC the last time around the licensing bend. Now, scuttlebut is that TWIC is no longer required.
Reference to the USCG policy letter when exemptions apply from the need to first obtain a TWIC before issuance of a MMC. http://https://www.dco.uscg.mil/Port...twic/11-15.pdf

Snipets of portions of the USCG policy letter pictured below.

For those that do not require a TWIC they still need to apply for one and pay the fees but don't need to pick it up or carry it with the MMC, because apparently the TWIC is the method the USCG has for obtaining biometric data [i.e., a fingerprint]. Seems like they should just let you send in a beer bottle with your finger prints on it and avoid having to go into the bureau. So this begs the question how do you get an initial MMC if you don't have fingers?

Forever hold your TWIC.
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Old 04-01-2019, 13:44   #95
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Re: Beware people who say they have a Captains License but do not.

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I'm confused a bit. Isn't the lowest level captains (or whatever you want to call it) license for 6 pack? And would one have that passport looking certification for that? How high up the "captains" ladder can you go before you get the "passport" and what do those lower licenses look like?
I hope this will clear up any confusion.

The MMC (merchant mariner credentials) is the booklet/Passport.
Inside you will find the details of what credentials that person holds.

If you have a Operator of Uninspected Passenger Vessels License (OUPV 6 pack) you will have a MMC with the details inside saying your credentials are for OUPV 6 pack.

If you have a 100 Ton License you will have a MMC with the details inside saying your credentials are for vessels no larger then 100 Tons.

If you have a Towing endorsement it will be listed in the MMC
If you have a Sailing endorsement it will be listed in the MMC.

No matter what level Captain you are you will have a MMC with the details inside.
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Old 04-01-2019, 13:47   #96
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Re: Beware people who say they have a Captains License but do not.

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Originally Posted by Montanan View Post
Reference to the USCG policy letter when exemptions apply from the need to first obtain a TWIC before issuance of a MMC. http://https://www.dco.uscg.mil/Port...twic/11-15.pdf

Snipets of portions of the USCG policy letter pictured below.

For those that do not require a TWIC they still need to apply for one and pay the fees but don't need to pick it up or carry it with the MMC, because apparently the TWIC is the method the USCG has for obtaining biometric data [i.e., a fingerprint]. Seems like they should just let you send in a beer bottle with your finger prints on it and avoid having to go into the bureau. So this begs the question how do you get an initial MMC if you don't have fingers?

Forever hold your TWIC.
Thank you the info.
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Old 04-01-2019, 14:24   #97
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Re: Beware people who say they have a Captains License but do not.

Yes TWIC is for security purposes, as in Homeland / TSA, nothing to do with boats specifically, all transportation professions needing access to secured areas.

As a side effect, will (should) work as REAL ID more generally.

I guess it's conceivable a skipper could go their whole career using the credentials in their MMC, without ever using (qualifying for?) the TWIC
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Old 04-01-2019, 16:29   #98
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Re: Beware people who say they have a Captains License but do not.

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Originally Posted by Captain Graham View Post
I hope this will clear up any confusion.

The MMC (merchant mariner credentials) is the booklet/Passport.
Inside you will find the details of what credentials that person holds.

If you have a Operator of Uninspected Passenger Vessels License (OUPV 6 pack) you will have a MMC with the details inside saying your credentials are for OUPV 6 pack.

If you have a 100 Ton License you will have a MMC with the details inside saying your credentials are for vessels no larger then 100 Tons.

If you have a Towing endorsement it will be listed in the MMC
If you have a Sailing endorsement it will be listed in the MMC.

No matter what level Captain you are you will have a MMC with the details inside.

Thanks CG Great info. So the 6 pack license is basically entry level? Is there anything lower?
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Old 05-01-2019, 09:25   #99
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Re: Beware people who say they have a Captains License but do not.

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Thanks CG Great info. So the 6 pack license is basically entry level? Is there anything lower?
Yes the OUPV 6 pack license is a step down from the Masters License.

Most Training Companies have you get the OUPV 6 pack first.
Then they have another class to upgrade to the Masters License.
This means you have to schedule 2 classes and you get charged for 2 classes.

The company I work for only does the 100 Ton Masters Classes for one price.
So we teach you the material for the 100 Ton Masters license in 1 week.
After you pass our USCG approved Test if proves you have the book knowledge.
Then based on your Sea Service info the USCG will issue a MMC with the tonnage you qualify for.
100 ton, 50 ton, 25 ton etc.

PS The extra training required between a OUPV 6 vs Masters is only 1 day.
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Old 05-01-2019, 11:30   #100
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Re: Beware people who say they have a Captains License but do not.

Very clever Montanan but I only offer to show my TWIC to girl long shore-persons and Teamsteretes.

Good info in the rest of your post though.
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Old 05-01-2019, 11:47   #101
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Re: Beware people who say they have a Captains License but do not.

Good info Capt. Graham. School curricula varies but the USCG approved school I went to their program was OUPV up to 200GRT in one class. Depending on the documented sea time of the student they would walk out eligible to be granted an OUPV, 25, 50 100 or 200GRT.

The 200 Ton applicates (3 ex Coast Guard guys) had two extra days on stability and other engineering calculations.

I told that an OUPV has an automatic exemption for vessels up to 100GRT as long as there only six passengers aboard, no cargo is carried and the purpose of the voyage is for the personal benefit of the paying passengers (fishing, diving, etc.).

If anyone else knows anything about this chime in please. Does this mean my 50GRT is good for a 100GRT vessel if I have only six pax onboard for fishing or diving?
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Old 05-01-2019, 13:28   #102
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Re: Beware people who say they have a Captains License but do not.

6 Pack, never leave port on a charter without it.
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Old 05-01-2019, 13:34   #103
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Re: Beware people who say they have a Captains License but do not.


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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmschmidt View Post
Very clever Montanan but I only offer to show my TWIC to girl long shore-persons and Teamsteretes.
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Old 05-01-2019, 14:29   #104
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Re: Beware people who say they have a Captains License but do not.

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Originally Posted by jmschmidt View Post
Good info Capt. Graham. School curricula varies but the USCG approved school I went to their program was OUPV up to 200GRT in one class. Depending on the documented sea time of the student they would walk out eligible to be granted an OUPV, 25, 50 100 or 200GRT.

The 200 Ton applicates (3 ex Coast Guard guys) had two extra days on stability and other engineering calculations.

I told that an OUPV has an automatic exemption for vessels up to 100GRT as long as there only six passengers aboard, no cargo is carried and the purpose of the voyage is for the personal benefit of the paying passengers (fishing, diving, etc.).

If anyone else knows anything about this chime in please. Does this mean my 50GRT is good for a 100GRT vessel if I have only six pax onboard for fishing or diving?
BE VERY CAREFUL
If you are looking for a loop hole in the rules, that loop hole might turn into a noose.

Lets review
1. The Operator of Uninspected Passenger Vessels License (OUPV 6 pack) is restricted to
Uninspected Vessels up to 100 Tons AND no more then 6 passengers

2. The 50 Ton License is restricted to
Uninspected Vessels up to 100 Tons AND no more then 6 passengers
Inspected Vessels up to 50 Tons with as many passengers the vessel is permitted to have.

So if vessel of any size has been classified as an inspected vessel and has a USCG Certificate of Inspection, OUPV License can not used.
If this vessel is 50 Tons or less the 50 Ton License would be good.

If a 100 Ton or less vessel has been classified as an Uninspected vessel then both the OUPV or the 50 Ton License can be used.

So the real question is when do you need to get the USCG Certificate of Inspection.

I do not know all the rules for when you have to get a USCG Certificate of Inspection, maybe someone else can explain.
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Old 05-01-2019, 14:58   #105
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Re: Beware people who say they have a Captains License but do not.

Thanks again Capt. Graham, again good info. I forgot to differentiate between "inspected" and "uninspected." Very costly to have a small boat converted from uninspected to inspected.
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