Are you a Pacific Coast Sailor?

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by Steve Bean

Farmers used to plow the beaches with horse-drawn rakes for Pismo clams to feed animals. Pismo clams were harvested in large quantities for sport and commerce.

Yeah the graph I posted pretty much shows that, long before the otters returned. But in my case I do not want to see the otters return because they are cute and fuzzy. My own personal selfish reason has to do with the Channel Islands and restoring the ecosystem there to its natural balance, and yes that will probably mean less of something for some fishermen. And every time I dive in the urchin barrens I wish for a few hungry otters to clean it up and rebalance nature.

[Training Wheels]

It might not be accurate, but I've always heard that sea otters have never been indigenous to the Channel Islands. I do remember them transplanting Otters to the C. I., but I believe they all ended back up North of Conception.
Isn't one of the reasons for all the urchins the virus that killed the starfish, a natural predator of the urchins?

[Cheechako]

sea otters, then vs now

[Jd1]

Originally Posted by buzzstar

I will also say this again: There are too many people, not too many otters

Ok folks, there you have it, put a bounty on people and all our problems will be solved
<going back to lurking>

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by Training Wheels

It might not be accurate, but I've always heard that sea otters have never been indigenous to the Channel Islands. I do remember them transplanting Otters to the C. I., but I believe they all ended back up North of Conception.
Isn't one of the reasons for all the urchins the virus that killed the starfish, a natural predator of the urchins?

Historically they were there. I do recall the urchin lobby talking about that years ago, that they were never there, but there is no evidence to support that claim.
The infection of starfish is a pretty recent phenomenon. In any case the starfish (Pisaster) we have are not, I believe, predators of urchins but mussels. They aren't really fast enough.
There was an effort to establish a colony of otters at San Nicolas Island. As I recall they discovered that otters do not want to stay in colonies they haven't established themselves. I think about half of them tried to swim back north and disappeared. Other than those, by law, until four years ago, the otters were required to stay north of Conception. Any found to have strayed were trapped and shipped back north. That program has ended, and the otters are now free to expand their range on their own, in large part because the government recognizes the otters need more range due to high mortality rates from disease and pollution where they are. They are not "out of the woods" especially when you consider the otters we see now originated from a very small band that had escaped extinction by living on a particularly rugged part of CA cost. They do not have a healthy genetically diverse population; any specific genetic weakness could wipe them all out.
Now I don't mean to insult anyone here, but I continue to be concerned, and I don't think it is an irrational fear, now that as otters move down around the corner there may be a fisherman or two who decides to take matters into his own hands and eliminate the competition, the otters. For the sake of the islands as a whole I hope that does not happen.

SAN NICOLAS ISLAND / Federal experiment to relocate sea otters to remote island fails - SFGate

https://www.fws.gov/ventura/endanger.../info/sso.html

http://www.otterproject.org/what-we-...no-otter-zone/

[CLady]

Originally Posted by Don C L

Great! Do you remember the date roughly?

It was June 2014. They are so cute floating on their backs. They look like a furry rectangular plank and seem to not have a care floating like that.

[desodave]

yes - balance is a tricky word. What is a natural balance? At a point in time when one species has already been obliterated by humans? Or at a previous point? Or after humans have wiped out a feedstock? Or in warming oceans? Personally I am delighted to see otters and have spent hours watching an otter family in Desolation Sound on an October cruise. We also have them in our marina, and they especially love my finger of the dock. They crap on my lines and on the deck of the finger, and use my dinghy full of water as a fresh water bathtub. I make sure the boat is locked up and keep the hose handy for cleanup. Big deal !! Glad I can contribute to their enjoyment of life for a change.

[Scout 30]

Originally Posted by Jd1

Ok folks, there you have it, put a bounty on people and all our problems will be solved
<going back to lurking>

Might not solve our problems but every other living thing on this planet would surely rejoice.

[Sea Dreaming]

Originally Posted by Don C L

OK, I'll bite. I too have dived Monterey, learned there in 1975, many dives from Monastery Beach, Cannery Row and Point Lobos. I too have dived the islands. Point Lobos and Monastery Beach have a tremendous diversity of life that is not a whit threatened by otters, it is in fact protected by the otters.
The Southern Sea Otter is native to entire the west coast of the United States to Baja. The otters evolved with the ecosystem and play a crucial role in it to maintain a healthy balance of all life there. Otters prefer to eat urchins and abalone, but paradoxically, they could have HELPED the abalone population around the islands locally when they were all struck by the disastrous infection that came up with warmer waters in the 80s. The otters eat urchins (are you an urchin diver?) and the the urchins eat algae and especially kelp holdfasts. Otters help ensure kelp forests remain present and healthy. Had the otters been present to keep the urchin population in check, those few abalone that survived would have had a BETTER chance at recovery with a greater supply of food algae. Abalone are eaten by otters but not threatened by otters.
Surely if you have dived the islands you know that what you say does not quite match the facts. Yes, the north coast of Santa Rosa island still has kelp beds, and that is where urchin divers prefer to collect urchins. But as I am sure you know, they only collect the big ones. The little ones are left and they keep eating. You must be aware of the term "urchin barrens" that refers to those areas scoured and eaten clean by juvenile urchins, which ends up starving all the other members of the ecosystem, since they all to some extent, directly or indirectly, depend on kelp. Surely you have dived the north coast of Santa Cruz island with its huge expanses of bare rocky ocean floor covered only by small, immature urchins. If allowed to, otters would come in, clean up that mess, and help restore a balanced, healthy kelp forest ecosystem which benefits finfish and all shellfish alike, INCLUDING abalone, by giving them more habitat with food and less competition from urchins.
In 1978 I volunteered briefly at the Natural History Museum cleaning skeletons wash up on local beaches. The FIRST one I was given to prepare was an otter that had washed up near Isla Vista with a .22 bullet hole in its head. Those were the early days of the boom of the urchin business to supply the Japanese market and angry urchin divers wore t-shirts showing an otter devouring an urchin boat and they came loaded for bear to local hearings.
I am sorry to hear of your otter fear, but my feeling is: that has to stop, and should have stopped 40 years ago.

So anyway, anyone been around Conception lately?

Excellent Don C L !

[Don C L]

New posts and members in the group, check here:
Cruisers & Sailing Forums - Pacific Coast Sailors

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by Don C L

It occurs to me that many folks here don't know about the social groups because any posts there don't show up on "new posts." So, unless there is a thread that links to the group, the group seems to go quiet for years. However, there is a group for us Pacific Coast (of Mexico, U.S. and B.C. and beyond I guess!) folks.
Cruisers & Sailing Forums - Pacific Coast Sailors

To be updated on group, go to link above and find the "Group Tools" button and select "subscribe to group." When you log in. hit the "User CP" button above and you will see a link to the group and any recent activity.

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by gjordan

I must be doing something wrong. I went to the Pacific Coast group and it only shows 11 threads and almost no response to any of them. There are a dozen responses to this thread, but the group shows zero for this thread. What am I doing wrong to not see all of it? _____Grant.

Hi Grant, not sure but maybe you are looking at "discussions" in the group which have a few posts (not many!) while the thread here has its own collection of posts. This thread is not listed in the discussions in the group. That was actually why I added the "link to the thread" in the discussions at the group.

[buzzstar]

Time to close this thread.

[senormechanico]

Originally Posted by Lancerbye

We have a number of Sea Otters up in our area on Vancouver Island. They are nice to watch so long as they stay in the water or on the rocks near shore. They are not so nice when they climb up on the docks or into boats and use these places as their own personal bathrooms. I like watching them.

I'll say the same thing about River Otters. We often see them in the PNW.



I've not seen a Sea Otter around here though.

[redhead]

Otters are still on my list of "Things I Must See". Since moving to the PNW I've seen my first bald eagle, my first coyote, my first bear, my first seal. Otters both salt and fresh water have moved to the top of the list.

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