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Old 27-07-2011, 04:01   #31
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Re: A Little Boat

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Originally Posted by stratosailor View Post
Glad I could help, marcodnn!

I do not know the Trapper 300. I did look it up online and it's a very nice looking boat. Fin keel, fairly light for a 28' boat at only 2000 kg.s, most likely designed for racing. I read a couple of favorable reviews by owners. Might be a good boat for you. I would suggest finding all the information you can online and by talking to people who have actually owned or sailed one. One thing I did notice is that it has a rather high capsize screening ratio of 1.95. But anything under 2.00 is supposed to be good for going off shore (Keep in mind the capsize ratio is not the only variable that will determine whether a boat will capsize or not. There are many variables that would go into that scenario).

Also, since you're living in Ireland, many of the boats we Americans have access to may not be as readily available to you. So boats like the Pearson Ariel that I said were quite easy to find might not be so plentiful on your side of the pond. Doesn't matter though. There are plenty of great boats built over there too. Some of which are rather rare over here. You just need to do your homework and you will be able to find just the right boat for you.

You know, that Etap 22 you were talking about might be an excellent boat for you to start out on. Unless you're planning on crossing oceans right away, which I wouldn't recommend until you have plenty of sailing experience under your belt, you could sail the little Etap for a year or two and then when you're ready you could move up to a bigger boat. Just a thought.

Whatever boat you decide on, please let us know. Good to hear from someone in Ireland, too!

Best of Luck, marcodnn.
Thank u again,
the etap 22 was sold the following day, it was a good price.
Im looking at the trapper 300 and a pioner 9 at the moment, and yes, i will spend a couple of years learnin to sail.

Chat to u soon

Marco
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Old 27-07-2011, 04:17   #32
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Re: A Little Boat

I would start with where you are going to moor her (might be surprised on cost / availability)....but if that is sortable I would suggest a Halycon 27 (or Invicta 26) - same ballpark as a Contessa 26 (world capable - skipper / equipment permitting), except cheaper .......but if you need bilge keels then a Westerly Centaur is hard to beat.

But if budget is important (it usually is for everyone ) then, especially as a first boat, I would not be over fussy on the boat model - but get the best condition for the money you can find (will still be plenty of things to fiddle around with onboard ).

Not sure how the boat market is in Ireland, I beleive it might be a bit pricey compared to the UK - FWIW the boats in North Wales do seem to be a bit cheaper than the Solent etc, I found the reason for that when boat hunting - North Wales is a 3 day round trip from the South, by road and a week or so by water.......but could be an option for accross the water to ireland.
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Old 30-07-2011, 13:13   #33
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Re: A Little Boat

Hi Guys
im looking for informations about the westerly pembroke 26'!
I was assured it is very reliable and in good conditions!
Is 9.500 euro a fair price?
Many thanks
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Old 30-07-2011, 19:17   #34
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Re: A Little Boat

marcodnn, I've heard some great things about the Westerly's also. Unfortunately I have no first-hand knowledge. Again, I think you can find all the info you need by searching online. Look for reviews of that boat, discussions about the boat in various forums, etc. As far as the price is concerned, I would check to see what Westerly's have sold for online and in your area and if you really like the boat, and it's worth it to you (that's the important thing) then go for it!

Best of luck.
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Old 31-07-2011, 02:26   #35
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Re: A Little Boat

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Originally Posted by stratosailor View Post
marcodnn, I've heard some great things about the Westerly's also. Unfortunately I have no first-hand knowledge. Again, I think you can find all the info you need by searching online. Look for reviews of that boat, discussions about the boat in various forums, etc. As far as the price is concerned, I would check to see what Westerly's have sold for online and in your area and if you really like the boat, and it's worth it to you (that's the important thing) then go for it!

Best of luck.
Yes, im looking for information online...and also on this forum, thank u

Marco
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Old 31-07-2011, 02:54   #36
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Re: A Little Boat

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Originally Posted by marcodnn View Post
Hi Guys im looking for informations about the westerly pembroke 26'! I was assured it is very reliable and in good conditions! Is 9.500 euro a fair price? Many thanks
Yes that's a pretty good price and likely to be priced to sell in a depressed market at the moment.

The bilge keel version is the Centaur of which there were 3000 made seem to go for 10 - 12k depending on condition. One recently did the Azores and back single handed race, called Pipedream I think. The owner took it slowly and carefully but didn't have any real problems by all accounts.

Could be a better choice than the lighter Trapper given your location. I would have no qualms crossing the Irish Sea in one. Excellent Owners Association too.

Oh and they are not little boats, when built they were a good size, just marketing has made folk believe they need 40 feet to sail out of a harbour.

Photo for the benefit of our US forumites.

Pete
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Old 31-07-2011, 05:32   #37
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Re: A Little Boat

Pete7, I'm glad you stepped in and gave your opinion because I see you are located in the UK where these boats are built and enjoy great popularity. I agree with your point about marketing convincing a lot of people that they need a huge boat. In America, we have the same problem with homes as well as boats. People seem to think they need a Huge SUV, a Huge Boat and a Huge HOME. And of course we eat too much so we ourselves often become Huge! I think that people should really think about the advantages of downsizing, whether it's our automobiles, our boats, our homes or our bodies!

Very nice looking boat you have there Pete7. Is that a steel boat? I only ask because of the chines. How does she sail?

By the way, marcodnn, the more I hear about these Westerlys the more I like them! Let us know if you get one!
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Old 31-07-2011, 06:37   #38
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Re: A Little Boat

No she isn't my boat but might belong to Marcodnn in the future . I posted the pic because it a Westerley Pembroke is probably unknown state side just as your Cals are unknown over here.

The hull is heavy GRP laid up when an "extra layer to be sure" was the order of the day and of course it now pays dividends for later owners.

The knuckle was incorporated to give a little more room in the bow and to deflect spray and those sloppy waves that always seem to just climb up and land on board a sharper hull shape.

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Old 31-07-2011, 07:01   #39
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Re: A Little Boat

We've been extremely happy with our Columbia 8.3.. Like any boat just make sure that you get one that has been extremely well maintained.
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Old 31-07-2011, 07:20   #40
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Re: A Little Boat

Pete7, O.K., I got mixed up. I thought that was a Moody 31. Well, it is a nice looking boat. I like the "knuckles" and the fact that they add room to the interior as well as the other benefits you mentioned, and they don't appear to be overly aggressive. I like this boat. It looks very traditional and seaworthy.

You should post a photo of your Moody sometime. I like to see boats from the UK and Europe. Some of the best boats definitely come from there.

Take Care
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Old 31-07-2011, 13:36   #41
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Re: A Little Boat

Thank u pete7 and stratosailor and also everybody else who answered my post.
I have an appointment arranged for wednesday to see this westerly, anything i should be looking for? Any fault in particular?
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Old 31-07-2011, 15:01   #42
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Re: A Little Boat

Yes, but in no particular order. Westerly head linings were foam backed and glued on. So after 20 plus years the foam breaks down and the head linings fall down leaving the glue and some foam behind. A horrible time consuming job to sand the glue away before re-fixing the head linings. However, for the main cabin some 1/4" batten sprung into place will hold it in place.

The engine is getting on a bit and won't be cheap to replace, so warrants a good look over. However, our Volvo 2003 is now 22 years old and I am expecting it to go on for some years yet, so don't right it off if it runs well.

The early Centaurs had a problem with the a chain plates that support the sides of the mast were placed above a one of the square forepeak port holes which caused cracking. Later Centaurs had the problem resolved possibly by different shaped ports. That said the pembroke appears to have the chain plates through further back on the main cabin top. Something to read up on the owners association perhaps.

Then there is the general stuff. The extra sails could be useful so open them up and the ones on the mast to check condition. Crispy white is good, soft is not, as there is a resin that is lost with age in dacron sails.

The electronics look a little dated but will get you going and could be changed long term, just make sure they work by turning them on, in fact do it to all the electrical items.

Taste the water out of the tank, drinkable is good.

Fuel tank steel by chance? good condition or a rusty mess? 400 plus for new one.

Lift the carpet and the sole and have a look at the bilges. Probably full of water and if so why? the stern gland and leaks are the answer. Does the boat feel damp? any mildew? not the end of the world but needs sorting by ventilating and removing water. Do take a torch and mirror and look in every single locker and behind panels with the mirror. Flush the loo!

Is the life raft included? when last serviced? when was the rigging last changed, factor 1200 if its over 10 years.

Those cushions don't look original, could be a bonus, foam is really expensive.

If you can talk to the owner ask about insurance and mooring costs etc.

Now, having said all that, for the price it looks a good buy. Your inspection plus that of a surveyor at 400 should confirm that.

Finally take a camera because it will record details you will forget in the excitement.

Pete
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Old 31-07-2011, 17:26   #43
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Re: A Little Boat

As already said, basically a Westerly Centaur - but with a fin rather than bilge keels. The Centaur seems to have been way more popular than the Pembroke (predates the UK Marina explosion I guess?).......they always seem to be priced a bit less than a Centaur - EUR9,500 sounds in the ballpark, but at that age it is all about condition and equipment (and location), so that could either be a bargain price or..........not.

Not sure if you have googled accross this link:-

Westerly Pembroke archive details - Yachtsnet Ltd. online UK yacht brokers - yacht brokerage and boat sales
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Old 01-08-2011, 06:00   #44
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Re: A Little Boat

Samuel L Morse makes a very sweet little 28 foot boat, called a Bristol Channel Cutter with a long bowsprit. Many have gone around the world. But not inexpensive.... http://www.samlmorse.com/
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Old 01-08-2011, 07:03   #45
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Re: A Little Boat

Whatever boats you look at look for one with good "bones" everything else is fluff. Ive seen so many folks get sucked in by good electronics,a nice dodger etc,etc only to realize after they have bought the thing that they have core issues,blisters etc. Weve all seen the ads that state, good electronics, 20 bags of sails etc. Most of those sails are crap and should have been disposed of years ago. My point is that you can always add the electronics you want,a new sail or two,as needed but if you find you need your deck recored you are in for real money or a nasty job if you do it yourself.
Steve.
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