Your Opinion, Please, on Subcontracting

[Chief Engineer]

Originally Posted by MoonlightSailor

Now the electrician wants to be paid on a daily basis for his work!? Why didn't he tell me this before he started? This was not agreed on before he started the work. Where I come from, the work is done and the job is paid for in the end. I know of a job he just finished and he didn't ask for payment until the job was done.

Been there done that.

[Mark Zarley]

Yea I remember the type, whether a lawyer or a christian with god on his side or just your tipical pompus ass. These people always signed the work order, then when the job was done complained about the "hourly rate" or time spent on the job. They set themselves up as judge and jury over what we made per hr and when it exceeded what they thought was adequate for people of a lower station in life they bitched. What they wanted was an adjustment in their favor. The man is not Sears. We solved the problem by not working for any of them. Pay the bill.

[Chief Engineer]

Yeah......I find PhDs (of Education) are the worst.

My worst one though was a Basket Ball Coach (Nationally Known "Diplomats") who just refused to pay for a complete rewiring of His Bertram 28.....Took the boat away from the marina

I just took it as a tax writeoff and informed the Marina and Broker that this guy was a deadbeat

[Sailmonkey]

The service company I worked for had a list of boat names and owners (people and organizations) hung on the wall. This list was photocopied time and time again for other contracters in the area......those who thought they knew better than the pro, or wanted it done only their way but wouldn't have the nerve or skills to do it themselves and complained endlessley about every aspect of the job were "blacklisted" by just about every contracter.

[Chief Engineer]

Originally Posted by Chief Engineer

Yeah......I find PhDs (of Education) are the worst.

My worst one though was a Basketball Coach (Nationally Known ) who just refused to pay for a complete rewiring of His Bertram 28.....Took the boat away from the marina

I just took it as a tax writeoff and informed the Marina and Broker that got the boat that this guy was a deadbeat

That is how the "jungle drums" work

[Jim Cate]

Say... I think that this thread has set an all-time record for unanimous opinion: each and every response has been in the line of "pay it and shut up your whining"... except for MarkJ, of course!!

Moonlight, maybe there is a group message there that you should listen to...

Cheers,
Jim

[Doodles]

Originally Posted by Sailmonkey

The service company I worked for had a list of boat names and owners (people and organizations) hung on the wall. This list was photocopied time and time again for other contracters in the area......those who thought they knew better than the pro, or wanted it done only their way but wouldn't have the nerve or skills to do it themselves and complained endlessley about every aspect of the job were "blacklisted" by just about every contracter.

I think a certain 65 footer from S.D. may have just made such a list.

[MarkJ]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Say... I think that this thread has set an all-time record for unanimous opinion: each and every response has been in the line of "pay it and shut up your whining"... except for MarkJ, of course!!

Jim

And I reckon theres nothing wrong with daily payments either!

That way you can clearly remember every nuance of the days work and costs. When on a budget it may well be easier to account like that.

It would also help to work out where the 'extra' hours go.
When I was in Sydney I was quoted $98 per hour to look at sommit on the boat and I said fine rock on over so it will be just $98? He said, no it will be $98 per hour including the travel time of about one hour each way.
So I as able to stop that little job in time
I finally got it fixed 3 months later on the Gold Coast by a person charging $80 per hour and no traveling time.

The only other thing that I do that might be different to some is that I work with the tradesperson like their little helper. Their head is in a hole and mine is right there too asking questions so I can learn to do it next time: "Whats that big black think with Yanmar writted all over it?"


For me $100 is a big expense. I get my dollars worth


Hey, by the way, if the electrician waits while the Xantrax guy fixes the unit at $80 +$20 markup does that hour cost me $200?

[MarkJ]

One final point......


I think the relationship with the electrician is now tainted and after paying the bill I would be using a differnt electrician.

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by Mark Zarley

They set themselves up as judge and jury over what we made per hr and when it exceeded what they thought was adequate for people of a lower station in life they bitched.

LOL

When it's "you" earning good money it's the freemarket / marketforces and therefore "fair" - even (and especially?!) when the money earned is out of proportion to the effort / skill required. When writing a cheque it's a different perception. Suddenly "fair" comes into it - and self judged, naively.

IME "Professionals" as employees do tend to have an inflated sense of self worth financially - and a lack of understanding of how business (even there own field) actually works. Can really be quite bizarre

Not just on this thread, but internet has been an eye opener over the years about how many people truly do not understand how the western style capitalist marketplace works - and that includes those who politically worship the idea Plusses to that one of course

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by MarkJ

it will be $98 per hour including the travel time of about one hour each way.
So I as able to stop that little job in time
I finally got it fixed 3 months later on the Gold Coast by a person charging $80 per hour and no traveling time.

Both times you were paying for travelling time. It's a cost that the business cannot physically avoid. In the second example the rate was therefore way lower than $18 an hour - no matter what the invoice said.

I suspect in the first case you were dealing with someone who had other work they could have been being paid for in that travelling time. In that case why would someone give up that cash?

The only other thing that I do that might be different to some is that I work with the tradesperson like their little helper. Their head is in a hole and mine is right there too asking questions so I can learn to do it next time: "Whats that big black think with Yanmar writted all over it?"


For me $100 is a big expense. I get my dollars worth

I have heard it a few times over the years, 2 rates - one for owner helping and one for owner not. the second is the cheaper

Interesting that you expect a free lesson as part of the deal.........punters

[MarkJ]

Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey

I have heard it a few times over the years, 2 rates - one for owner helping and one for owner not. the second is the cheaper

Interesting that you expect a free lesson as part of the deal.........punters

LOL I hope new cruisers are reading this thread

Some may wonder why most long term cruisers say they do all their work themselves.


Mark

[Doodles]

Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey

I have heard it a few times over the years, 2 rates - one for owner helping and one for owner not. the second is the cheaper

Yea, I've heard that many times. I do like to watch in hopes I'll learn something, but I make it a point not to be in the way and not to ask questions to the point of being annoying or slowing the guy up. Basically, don't be a pain and don't come across like you're checking up on the guy. And I'll help, but only if asked.

So far, its worked fine for me.

[captain58sailin]

I won't work for free (unless it is on my own boat) & I don't expect anyone else to either. As the customer you have the right to expect good work for your money. Instead of back dooring the guy, you might try laying your cards on the table and explain to him your dissatisfaction with the bill, in a calm non confrontational manner and see if there is a middle ground in there somewhere. If the guy is a pro then you might find a compromise. The other thing is if you lead with your wallet, there are those out there whom are plenty willing to lighten it for you. Ask more questions next time, make sure you have clarity about what is expected and what will be charged. At this time you have an obligation to pay the man. How much time have you spent on this thread? What is your time worth to you?

[Seahunter]

Considering electrical fires are the #1 cause of loss of life and property on the water, one might be inclined to just pay up. By the way Hart/Xantrex have a great technical support system that I've used a number of times. That said, if you've got no clue how your boat's electrical system works (and have no desire to learn) stop griping and pay the bills unless you want to become another statistic on the water.