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Old 23-04-2012, 23:36   #16
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Re: One More Question About Personal Property Tax

In Louisiana we pay sales tax , and a Doc. boat pays 24 dollars for I believe 4 yrs registation, no numbers required, only a decal, most of the money gos to the fish and game dept, some to the parish where the boat resides Works out pretty well for us ! as our Ins rates are pretty low and dockage is super cheap! and the gulf cruisin is right here ! Just our 2 cents
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Old 24-04-2012, 10:22   #17
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Re: One More Question About Personal Property Tax

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Was that state, Washington, as listed in your profile?
Yes it was! I suspect I could have registered it if I hadn't told them it wasnt in state. However, in the end Fl sales tax was cheaper than Wa state.... and I had a Fl address I could use... It's like a Catch 22.... if you dont have an address in FL you cant title it there, if it's not in your home state you cant title it there!
This is one area I wish the Fed would get involved and starighten all the mess up making one uniform rule. You should be able to title your boat in any state and travel to any state for as long as you want.... just like with your motorhome or car.... Supposedly its a "free country"...... unless you own a boat!
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Old 24-04-2012, 10:47   #18
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Re: One More Question About Personal Property Tax

And then we have California.
Property taxes are levied by Counties, and some counties will charge you back taxes when you return. Uhless you can prove that your boat was not in their county ie. Custom forms detailing every place your boat has been.
Marinas are required to submit a list of boats each year
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Old 24-04-2012, 11:10   #19
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Re: One More Question About Personal Property Tax

All my boats were USCG documented but home ported in Nevada where the personal property tax was non-existent. I Did have the boat in CA for a while (about 3 weeks) as I was passing through on my way to Mexico, I got nailed for property tax because I kept a slip, NOT the boat, in San Diego. When I explained the boat was not in CA and submitted marina receipts and fuel receipts from Mexico to prove this fact, I was told to pay the tax and was threatened with legal action by the state. They told me up front that they were willing to spend thousands on attorneys, place a lein against my boat and generally make life difficult for me if I didn't pay their tax even though I could prove I wasn't in the state. That was the last time I spent time in CA and will do everything I can to discourage boaters from visiting or buying any goods from CA.
It is a poisonous state with little redeeming qualities other than nice weather. Capt Phil
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Old 24-04-2012, 11:42   #20
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Re: One More Question About Personal Property Tax

When we were there we had to pay property tax for the boat, AND property tax for the City-Owned slip. Pretty amazing to have to pay tax on something you are renting... but CA is always on the cutting edge Nevada usually follows close behind CA in most things
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Old 24-04-2012, 11:44   #21
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Re: One More Question About Personal Property Tax

Capt Phil,
I worked computers in Silicon Valley from 1968 thru 2000, and lived on a boat from 1988 thru 2000 in Alameda.
Worked for me.
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Old 24-04-2012, 12:09   #22
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Re: One More Question About Personal Property Tax

We abandoned Taxifornia in 1992 when we relocated to Florida. Our boat had been in the basin adjacent to our club in Long Beach, Alamitos Bay Yacht Club where we continued as non-resident members for many years after we moved. I continued to get personal property tax notices and threatening letters from the LA County Tax Assessor for 7 years after we left, even though, when we got them, we'd send the assessor a copy of our Florida registration. I once asked one of the people at the LA Tax Collector's office why they kept sending out such notices when they knew damned well that we had no obligation to make such payments and she laughed and said that I'd be amazed at how many people actually continue to pay on demand despite having moved out of state for fear that something might show up on their credit report.

FWIW...
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Old 24-04-2012, 12:18   #23
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Re: One More Question About Personal Property Tax

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Originally Posted by Capt Phil View Post
All my boats were USCG documented but home ported in Nevada where the personal property tax was non-existent. I Did have the boat in CA for a while (about 3 weeks) as I was passing through on my way to Mexico, I got nailed for property tax because I kept a slip, NOT the boat, in San Diego.
CALIFORNIA VESSEL TAXES

Any vessel staying in California for 90 days or longer is subject to tax, regardless of Hailing Port.

Tax rolls are routinely complied by DMV files, USCG Documentation files and local Marina reports of vessels currently berthed. Less common, but also used are Law Enforcement Tickets, gas receipts and Safety Inspection Reports to add vessels to the Tax Rolls.

Purchasing a new or used vessel in California and taking an "Off-Shore" delivery may exempt you from CA Taxes, but you must remove the vessel within 90 days of purchase, with no grace periods for mechaical failures, weather delays, etc...

In California, you are subject to a annual State Mandated "Unsercured Property Tax" of 1% of the boat current value, plus any other county taxes like 9-1-1, schools, libraries, etc... The tax is paid to the local County Assessors Office and is assessed on any boats in California as of Dec. 31 each year (RV's are taxed the same way). The tax bill usually comes out in the Spring and the Tax is due in August.

You can request the County Assessor re-value the boat every year... Some will do it over the phone and some demand written requests. They use a standard Yacht Blue Boat when doing this, which can give you some wiggle room to lower the value more and thus pay less taxes.

In addition, you are subject to Sales Tax when purchasing a vessel in California. On a new vessel it is paid immediately at the point of sale, not where you live, if they are in different counties. If you purchase a used vessel, you either pay the sales tax at the DMV, if register it with the State DMV, or wait for a bill from the tax collectors office, if it is USCG Documented. The later is the best, becaise the USCG is slow to report the sale and it usually takes about 4 months for the Sale Tax Bill to finally arrive and another 30 day grce to pay it.

In Marinas that are owned by the local City instead of private owners, you are alo subject to another UNsecure Property Tax or "Hole in the Water Tax" on the slip. This is done since the City doesn't pay taxes on the slip. In a a private marina the owners would pay the tax and figure it into your monthly slip fees. My 40' slip in Berkley, CA cost about $100 per year.

Finally, if you decide to leave California or the County you are paying taxt too, go to the local Tax Assessors Office. They have a form that tells them you are leaving the County/State with the vessel and releaves you of the Tax.

They key to this is contact them before the vessel leaves the State and make sure to do it before Dec 31st or you will own the tax for the following year.

Like all other property tax, the County will place a lein on your vessel if the Tax isn't paid. If you leave the country, but didn't tell them you left, most counties will tax you and it will be on you to prove the vessel was not in the county, which in some jurisdictions is not easy.

As for the qouted writter, more than likely San Diego decided that since he maintained his slip, he planned on returning and was still subject to tax. Only the Tax Assessor knows for sure.
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Old 25-04-2012, 11:02   #24
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Re: One More Question About Personal Property Tax

Very concise explaination, jeremiason, thank you for that. I got caught up in the maze by trying to hang on to my slip in SD in a private marina and paid slip fees while I was in Mexico for an extended period of time as slips were very difficult to secure at that time.
Regardless of the Mexican marina receipts, fuel and repair bills from Mexico, Zarpes and dispatchos from Mexican ports, etc., the tax folks said tough... we have more time, money and lawyers than you so pay up! Just another example of the arrogance and shitty attitude these guys have... and they work for us??

On another issue, I bought a boat in Washington State, took her to Canada and cruised Desolation Sound and many other senic areas in BC before coming down the coast and settling once more in San Diego (big mistake!!). Lived aboard there for 5 more years or so, paid my taxes every year then sold the boat. Two years after the sale, the CA Franchise Tax Board came after me for not paying the sales tax on the boat when I bought it 7 years prior in Washington State even though I kept her out of CA waters for over 6 months. I was forced to fly to Canada and request receipts from marinas, shops, fuel docks, etc SEVEN YEARS after the fact, an almost impossible task. They finally accepted my receipts and and stopped bugging me.
One of my main objectives in life now is to find ways to screw CA financially to try and get some revenge for what they put me through. Revenge is best taken cold and enough time has passed that I'm relaxed about finding ways to get even but it is still on my bucket list to cost the state at least as much trouble as they put me through. Capt Phil
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Old 25-04-2012, 12:26   #25
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Re: One More Question About Personal Property Tax

OMG it seems that I am not alone in being beaten to death fiscally in the "Golden" State.....in response to "John A" above...all I can say that was then...this is now. CA is a good place to be "from".
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Old 25-04-2012, 12:34   #26
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Re: One More Question About Personal Property Tax

Capt. Phil brings up another good point...

States are hard up for money and at some point, some Tax Assessor in yor new state will wonder if you paid sales tax on the orginal sale.

If it is DMV registered, they will ask when you move into the new state, but if you are documented it could take years for someone to ask the question.

If you purchase a vessel in another State and pay sales tax on it, keep the receipt... I suggest for as long as you own the boat though I am sure there is some time limit, like 7 years, but that probably varies from state to state as well.
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Old 25-04-2012, 13:00   #27
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Re: One More Question About Personal Property Tax

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OMG it seems that I am not alone in being beaten to death fiscally in the "Golden" State.....in response to "John A" above...all I can say that was then...this is now. CA is a good place to be "from".
Sad but true. One of my intense delights is that I left on my cruise in October of 2000 and was gone for 10 years. No TV or news, the internet was to expensive to waste time on news blogs, no facebook , twitter or texting! No cell phone! Ignorance was truly bliss.

Upon my return the trasformation that ocurred has taken alot of effort on my part to understand.
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Old 25-04-2012, 13:26   #28
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Re: One More Question About Personal Property Tax

I think I've finally figured out how to beat the 'system'... do not own anything in your name, never give your SS# to anyone for any reason, do not have traceable income or pay federal taxes, pay cash for everything, do not have a drivers license for the state in which you reside, no bills in your name, no credit cards, no magazine subscriptions, etc. It take a little work but it can be done.
In todays' controlled and inquisitive environment, best to keep as low a profile as possible because big brother/sister is watching every move you make. Yes, I'm paranoid but that is only because I'm being watched! Capt Phil
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