Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 12-11-2017, 20:11   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 7
More Canadian Questions

Long time lurker first time poster. We are pretty young Canadians looking at buying a boat on the west coast of the states and I'm just trying to save a few bucks.

From what I've read I only need to pay the Canadian Tax once I bring it into Canadian waters, but that is something we want to do as we want to start out with mostly local trips and learn the boats ins and outs and get it ready for the south pacific or more depending on cash and how much fun we're having.

I've read the recent threads about Canadians buying boats in the Caribbean but I didn't find the answers I was looking for. The way I see it is we have 2 options and it's the second one that has too many unknowns for me.

Option A:

Motor it up to Vancouver (where we live) and register it upon entry and pay taxes (12%) which could be up to 9k for our price range. (Motoring up because we are not ready for going to Hawaii and back)

Option B:

Put the boat in my GFs name who is Dual citizen and leave it registered in the US. (I am assuming that I can not register a boat in the US as a canadian citizen)

What would I be paying to do that in the states? Cali or Washington tax? 5%?

Does she have to have a residence down there?

She is fearful that they will come after her for income-tax like they are a lot of other Americans not working or living in America, does anyone have experience with this?

How long can we have a US registered boat in canada before we have to leave to reset the clock, how long do we have to leave for?

Any other expenses that I missed?

Thank you in advance for any insight you can provide.





I've been keeping my eye on an Endeavour 42 and a Nelson-Marek 445 but really anything with an aft cabin with a centerline berth catches my attention if it has at least a 'sail area/disp.' of 15 or higher
__________________

__________________
Download7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2017, 20:42   #2
Jd1
Registered User

Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Victoria, BC
Boat: Catalina 36 MKII
Posts: 1,086
Re: More Canadian Questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Download7 View Post
Any other expenses that I missed?
If the boat was not NAFTA manufactured and you bring it into Canada you are looking at an additional 9.5% duty. I assume taxes are on the duty paid price so taxes go up a smitch as well.
__________________

__________________
Jd1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2017, 20:46   #3
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 7
Re: More Canadian Questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jd1 View Post
If the boat was not NAFTA manufactured and you bring it into Canada you are looking at an additional 9.5% duty. I assume taxes are on the duty paid price so taxes go up a smitch as well.
Oh Man they really know how to ding you, Thanks for the heads up.
__________________
Download7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2017, 20:48   #4
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Southern Calif.
Posts: 295
Re: More Canadian Questions

Boats are titled in one of 2 ways here, documented by CG which requires you to be US citizen, or registered by the state Department of Motor Vehicles which can be held by Canadian citizen. California will require "use" tax at same rate as "sales" tax for the county it is purchased in, about 10%. Payable at time you transfer title at DMV or for documented vessels you are responsible to pay to the Franchise Tax Board (State tax agency).
__________________
Calif.Ted is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2017, 20:56   #5
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 7
Re: More Canadian Questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calif.Ted View Post
Boats are titled in one of 2 ways here, documented by CG which requires you to be US citizen, or registered by the state Department of Motor Vehicles which can be held by Canadian citizen. California will require "use" tax at same rate as "sales" tax for the county it is purchased in, about 10%. Payable at time you transfer title at DMV or for documented vessels you are responsible to pay to the Franchise Tax Board (State tax agency).
So I just want to make sure I read that right, If I put the boat in my GFs name and register with the coast guard I still have to pay about 10% tax to the Franchise Tax Board? So it's not a money saver to keep it registered in the states then... bummer

Thank you so much for your help
__________________
Download7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2017, 21:17   #6
Registered User
 
Stu Jackson's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Cowichan Bay, BC (Maple Bay Marina)
Posts: 6,332
Re: More Canadian Questions

Noodle around this site

Visitor Information - Transport Canada

There's visitor information and limits on stays, too.
__________________
Stu Jackson
Catalina 34 #224 (1986) C34IA Secretary
Cowichan Bay, BC, (Maple Bay Marina) SR/FK, M25, Rocna 10 (22#) (NZ model)
Stu Jackson is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2017, 21:57   #7
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 7
Re: More Canadian Questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stu Jackson View Post
Noodle around this site

Visitor Information - Transport Canada

There's visitor information and limits on stays, too.
Awesome Thank you
__________________
Download7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-11-2017, 04:43   #8
Moderator Emeritus
 
GordMay's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Thunder Bay, Ontario - 48-29N x 89-20W
Boat: (Cruiser Living On Dirt)
Posts: 31,507
Images: 240
Re: More Canadian Questions

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, Download.
__________________
Gord May
"If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time/$ to fix it?"



GordMay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-11-2017, 06:49   #9
Registered User
 
Mike OReilly's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Good question
Boat: Rafiki 37
Posts: 4,004
Re: More Canadian Questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Download7 View Post
Long time lurker first time poster. We are pretty young Canadians looking at buying a boat on the west coast of the states and I'm just trying to save a few bucks.
I have to say, given the recent release of the Paradise Papers, this posting is kinda ironic or amusing. Seems like you’re looking to use a loophole to avoid legitimate tax. But whatever...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Download7 View Post
She is fearful that they will come after her for income-tax like they are a lot of other Americans not working or living in America, does anyone have experience with this?
Personally, I would consult a lawyer specializing in this area. I have a good friend who has been fending of Uncle Sam’s tax over-reach for years now. It’s been a major emotional and financial drain. I’d certainly suspect that registering a boat down there would indicated some level of residence, which could very well trigger greater likelihood of insuring the wrath of the IRS.
__________________
Why go fast, when you can go slow.
BLOG: www.helplink.com/CLAFC
Mike OReilly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-11-2017, 18:52   #10
Senior Cruiser

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Nevada City. CA
Boat: Sceptre 41
Posts: 3,735
Images: 9
Re: More Canadian Questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Download7 View Post
So I just want to make sure I read that right, If I put the boat in my GFs name and register with the coast guard I still have to pay about 10% tax to the Franchise Tax Board? So it's not a money saver to keep it registered in the states then... bummer

Thank you so much for your help
The 10% only applies if you register it in California. Oregon has no sales tax and you can register it there. I don't know what the WA state tax is but it should be easy to find with a google search. I live in CA. I bought a boat in Canada and the plan was to sail it south and turn left at the canal. I registered it in MT. I met all the requirements. I did not have to pay $20k in taxes. I'm not sure it was worth it. We sailed as far North as Desolation Sound and as far south as La Paz. The hassle factor was tremendous.
__________________
Fair Winds,

Charlie

Between us there was, as I have already said somewhere, the bond of the sea. Besides holding our hearts together through long periods of separation, it had the effect of making us tolerant of each other's yarns -- and even convictions. Heart of Darkness
Joseph Conrad
Charlie is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2017, 15:06   #11
Registered User
 
fxykty's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Auckland
Boat: Outremer 55L
Posts: 176
More Canadian Questions

Typically registration and import duties are two separate things. Import duties are based on owner residence, so unless you can prove your GF is resident outside of Canada, you will need to import the boat into Canada and pay the taxes, regardless of whether the boat is registered in Canada, a US state, Jersey, Malaysia or anywhere else.

If you’re not planning on going international for a few years, you could just license in Canada then consider registration later.

And regarding giving the boat ownership to your GF, how sure are you that the relationship will last? I would ask the same question if you were married. If things go wrong, at best you would get only 50% ownership in relationship property.

As for bringing the boat up the West Coast, don’t even think about it if you’re not prepared to go via Hawaii. That coast has no safe harbours (without bars) between San Francisco and Vancouver Island, so should be treated as an offshore passage. Study the currents and winds and understand why the sailing route is via Hawaii.

You can hire a professional delivery skipper and go with him or her - an invaluable experience and fastest way to learn your boat and some seamanship.
__________________
fxykty is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2017, 18:41   #12
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Ottawa
Boat: Bayfield 25
Posts: 15
Re: More Canadian Questions

Find a lawyer who will do a “high seas” sale. You motor out into international waters with today’s news paper and a hand held GPS and photograph showing the front page (ie. date), lat/lon, seller and purchaser.

It won’t get you out of all the taxes and duties but some of them.
__________________
B25Matt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2017, 18:58   #13
Sponsoring Vendor
 
groundtackle's Avatar

Community Sponsor

Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Victoria BC/ Same
Boat: Cal 2-46 / Le Comte 35'
Posts: 368
Re: More Canadian Questions

I imported my boat from the US. Contact Marine Documentation Services in Anacortes and they'll help you with the registration.

I used to think my brain was my most important organ then I thought 'wait, who's telling me that?'

Nick
__________________

Ground Tackle Marine offers the highest quality ground tackle products to discerning clients. We are the only North American distributor of the Excel and Sarca anchors manufactured by Anchor Right Australia. Contact us through our website www.groundtackle.com
Chris or Nick will be pleased to help whatever your ground tackle questions are.
groundtackle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2017, 20:30   #14
Registered User
 
travellerw's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Martinique
Boat: Fortuna Island Spirit 40
Posts: 1,681
Re: More Canadian Questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by B25Matt View Post
Find a lawyer who will do a “high seas” sale. You motor out into international waters with today’s news paper and a hand held GPS and photograph showing the front page (ie. date), lat/lon, seller and purchaser.

It won’t get you out of all the taxes and duties but some of them.
Not true at all for a Canadian boat.. It matters not where the transaction occured, taxes are due when the boat enters Canadian waters (if Canadian registered).. Sailing it offshore with a newspaper will gain you ZERO here!

I have no other answers to your other questions, except are we forgetting GST/PST? The tax may be much higher than you think
__________________
travellerw is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 15-11-2017, 08:37   #15
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Ottawa
Boat: Bayfield 25
Posts: 15
Re: More Canadian Questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by travellerw View Post
Not true at all for a Canadian boat.. It matters not where the transaction occured, taxes are due when the boat enters Canadian waters (if Canadian registered).. Sailing it offshore with a newspaper will gain you ZERO here!

I have no other answers to your other questions, except are we forgetting GST/PST? The tax may be much higher than you think
I stand corrected. The situation I was thinking of was of a Canadian selling to another Canadian , the boat was in Florida and with no intention of ever bringing it into Canada.
__________________

__________________
B25Matt is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
More People On More Boats More Often thekiwi Commercial Posts 0 11-06-2014 19:43
Keep Canadian-Registered Vessel in US More than One Year ? wingover Rules of the Road, Regulations & Red Tape 0 11-02-2011 19:14
Canadian buying canadian boat in Florida Rastarea Rules of the Road, Regulations & Red Tape 7 08-02-2009 10:15
Buyiing a Canadian-Registered Sailboat from Another Canadian in Guatemala squarehead General Sailing Forum 2 14-01-2008 06:47



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 14:06.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.