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Old 01-04-2015, 14:19   #31
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Re: Marina Charging What They Want?

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Originally Posted by rwidman View Post
As often is the case, we are getting only one side of the story here. We don't have the actual contract to examine and we don't know the OP's interaction with marina management.


I suspect there is more to this than has been revealed. I don't think a marina and especially a publically owned marine would keep a boat "hostage" just to collect additional storage fees.
They never said they were holding the boat hostage. The owner simply failed to schedule a launch date in a timely manner and with all the launch dates filled up, that pushes him beyond the end of the winter storage contract and agreed storage prices for summer storage kick in.

It's fun to talk about lawyering up and small claims court but unfortunately it sounds like talking nicely has gone out the window...I'd be very interested in hearing how this story ends. My bet is the new owner pays the $400 with a secondary possibility of he takes them to small claims court and loses at which point any good will is shot and that boat better start up and motor smoothly out of the marina with issues or any and all possible charges will get tacked on for helping him out of the marina.
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Old 01-04-2015, 15:44   #32
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Re: Marina Charging What They Want?

More than 30 days isn't "timely"?
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Old 01-04-2015, 23:09   #33
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Re: Marina Charging What They Want?

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More than 30 days isn't "timely"?
Exactly, the boat was probably hauled some time around September and not requesting a haul out date until the end of march is way beyond timely.

If they have a yard full of boats with owners who made timely requests for haul out dates plus there are always last minute repairs and fixes the crew needs to attend to, it could easily be a month or more before they have an open slot. We have stayed in a number of marinas around the great lakes and spring is always a madhouse for the staff trying to get everything done.
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Old 02-04-2015, 07:13   #34
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Re: Marina Charging What They Want?

valhalla360
as rwidman said regarding all of us not knowing the "facts", you too, like us are filling in unknown facts, based on how you see it, or perceive it. It just goes to show we're all just being human by trying to ring in on things we "really", don't know, based on unknown facts we conjure up in our own minds to result in a scenerio that fits our needs.

ANYWAY ... I will say this about launching ... most of the marinas on the west basin are still completely iced-in ... virtually no one is going to get their boats in, before the end of March(gone), or even a week or two into April.
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Old 02-04-2015, 08:19   #35
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Re: Marina Charging What They Want?

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valhalla360
as rwidman said regarding all of us not knowing the "facts", you too, like us are filling in unknown facts, based on how you see it, or perceive it. It just goes to show we're all just being human by trying to ring in on things we "really", don't know, based on unknown facts we conjure up in our own minds to result in a scenerio that fits our needs.

ANYWAY ... I will say this about launching ... most of the marinas on the west basin are still completely iced-in ... virtually no one is going to get their boats in, before the end of March(gone), or even a week or two into April.
Yes and no. True we don't know all the facts but we know some and we also know common practice. Therefore we can put a pretty good picture together. If we use the argument that we don't have all the information to avoid answering questions, the forum would be devoid of ANY and ALL responses as there is always missing information.

It's fairly safe to assume that if the original owner had scheduled a launch back in September or if the new owner had tried to schedule a launch back in January, we would have been corrected by now on that assumption.

The fact it is a particularly cold winter with a late start to launches supports the marina position that they aren't holding the boat for ransom but that he failed to schedule in a timely manner. Had he scheduled a mid april launch well in advance and the weather stopped them from launching until summer storage rates kick in, we would have a much different scenario.

Assuming he hasn't threatened the marina with legal action or otherwise been unpleasant towards them and goes in with a good attitude, there may still be options. As suggested earlier if he can forego the need to be present, they may be able to launch him if someone misses a scheduled launch or the crew has some unexpected free time available.

If he goes in with a take no prisoners attitude and in the highly unlikely event, takes them to court and eliminates the summer storage fees, they could easily get revenge by convienently not having a free launch date until mid July or having him arrive only to have some hold up require him to drive 5hrs a few days later (lifts break down, another job ran longer than expected, any number of very reasonable excuses can be used). For the issue as he's described so far, it just doesn't pay to play hardball.

While we can go on about how we dont' know with certainty, I would be shocked if the marina is purposely holding his boat with the intent of running up the storage fees.
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Old 02-04-2015, 10:06   #36
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Re: Marina Charging What They Want?

Holding the boat "hostage", per se, I agree that no one is "purposely", holding the boat hostage.

But it doesn't have to be "purposeful", if the result is the same.

As far as getting dates for launching ... I don't know what world is out there where boaters get launch dates in January, when no one knows what the weather's going to do and heaven forbid the boat cannot be launched, only to sit on the ice for a few weeks, until it breaks through and floats(or sinks).

I have been in many marinas and I have never(not once), ran into a situation where, for whatever reason, the marina cannot get the boat launched, that the marina then begins tacking on fees for storage, unless the owners is actually planning on leaving the boat, at the marina, on the hard. I'm sure it happens, but I've never seen it.

Now, I've work in government and with government for over 30 some years. I think it was said or alluded to that the marina is now being run by a government entity. I can "easily", imagine a government "clerk", or secretary ... well, let me just say it ... a government "hack", of which there are many, stating the line-item, black & white, rules, which often, don't apply because of the reality of the situation ... "reality" ... a term that governments and government workers sometimes do not understand ... or care to understand.

Still, I'd like to know more of the facts and how this situation eventually plays out.
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Old 02-04-2015, 10:15   #37
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Re: Marina Charging What They Want?

Doesn't it all depend on where this boat is in the yard stacking order ? If there are 70 boats in the yard in front of this one then launch #71 seems about right. All yards launch the nearest boats first.

If you want to launch early then you have to haul out late.
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Old 02-04-2015, 10:41   #38
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Re: Marina Charging What They Want?

I rest my case!!! The free market would never tolerate such abuse.
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Old 02-04-2015, 13:07   #39
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Re: Marina Charging What They Want?

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As far as getting dates for launching ... I don't know what world is out there where boaters get launch dates in January, when no one knows what the weather's going to do and heaven forbid the boat cannot be launched, only to sit on the ice for a few weeks, until it breaks through and floats(or sinks).

.
We usually schedule launch around the time we are getting hauled out. Definetly by January. That allows them to position our boat so they can get to it for an early spring launch.

We've wintered in half a dozen marinas and most ask when hauling out and send out email reminders around Christmas to get on the schedule.
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Old 02-04-2015, 13:27   #40
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Re: Marina Charging What They Want?

I just checked with my marina and was told a couple people have asked for a day for splashing, but that basically, with the winter and spring the way it was that they think most everyone's waiting ... for now.

Maybe the west basin of Lake Erie marinas are generally more lax with such things ...
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Old 02-04-2015, 15:30   #41
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Re: Marina Charging What They Want?

Well, the OP hasn't done us the courtesy of posting the terms of the last winter storage contract, and he hasn't got a clue (since he's five hours away from the marina) of what the posted or published rules of the marina are.


Kinda makes all debate useless, doesn't it?


So he's got a choice, follow the standard rules, which probably are in the winter storage contract or available at the marina office, and which probably say "if you don't keep it here in the summer, you're gonna pay dry storage till it is gone".


Of course the OP HAS a much better option available. Bring in a cargo helo, drop two slings, and just get it out of the marina by himself before any storage comes due. Or if it really is at the edge of the parking lot, just show up with a trailer if he can't handle the airlift rates.


But if the OP doesn't want to tell us the rest of the story, further WAGs as to the marina's contract and posted rules are a total waste of time.


Sorry, dude, that's just the way it is. You didn't do your homework. Get over it.
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Old 02-04-2015, 15:37   #42
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Re: Marina Charging What They Want?

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Doesn't it all depend on where this boat is in the yard stacking order ? If there are 70 boats in the yard in front of this one then launch #71 seems about right. All yards launch the nearest boats first.

If you want to launch early then you have to haul out late.
I guess we are spoiled in the PNW. launch most anytime you want within a day or two, seldom any blocking... just not the way business is done.
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Old 02-04-2015, 17:45   #43
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Re: Marina Charging What They Want?

Only a really big yard in RI could do that. NEB can launch boats out on the point like that but you have to be OK with getting blasted by whatever bad weather comes along. On the point most boats face the road. Even there if you want a spot inland a bit near the main road you have to wait for the guys in front to launch unless you are in row #1.

When I was in Hinckleys, which is almost as big as NEB, four boats had to launch before I could get out.
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Old 02-04-2015, 21:20   #44
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Re: Marina Charging What They Want?

Think of those 30 days as a blessing. As others have stated $400 is a bargain. Get down there and evaluate what you can maintain on the boat during those 30 days. I bet after you sit down and work through some items you may well find you have 3 or more months of work to do on the boat.

Never be in a hurry to get back in the water unless you are SURE you know everything is done. Have you looked at your stuffing box, shaft, bottom paint, through hulls, rudder gudgeon, top side paint, etc. etc.? This is a good time to go spend the weekend on the boat with a heater and work out a plan of attack.
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Old 03-04-2015, 07:20   #45
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Marina Charging What They Want?

I have used the whitby marina, and found them to be very helpful, and accommodating.

A few years ago I bought my boat in New Jersey and had it trucked up in December. I had arranged to join the Whitby Yacht club ( right next door), however, due to logistics, they couldn't store my boat in their yard right away. The WYC called the marina and made arrangements to store my boat there. The marina was full, but squeezed me in. I was very grateful.

When launch time came, I had no idea how swamped they would be, and ended up waiting a while for my launch date. It was no big deal, I had so many projects to do. You really do have to book a launch date early. I was told that people start booking dates in February.

Don't be fooled by the visible boats you see and think that's all they have to do. They have a contract with Swans marine ( indoor and outdoor storage) next door to launch their boats too. They also have masts to put up on many boats.

At the WYC we remove our masts every fall. My mast is big and heavy and I hate removing it. I approached the marina this past fall and asked if they would remove and store my mast for me. They turned me away. No room to store the mast, and no time to do it. They are at absolutely full capacity that they won't even take my mast. Let that sink in, they turned away easy money.

Not sure who you spoke to, but the managers name is Keenan. He is very friendly and helpful. He went out of his way to help me, and I've seen him do the same for others.

I don't believe they are intentionally abusing you. As others have said, we don't have access to your contract so I can't speak to that issue. Book a launch date, and use the extra time to work on the boat, I'm sure there is plenty to do.

Finally, yes they are government employees. They work 8 hours a day with lunch and coffee breaks. They also have to navigate the busy yard with the travel lift, and of course safety is always a priority which slows things down. Not sure how many boats they launch per day, but it can't be too many.


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