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Old 07-12-2012, 13:13   #61
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Re: Is this possible or are we being unrealistic and naive?

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Thank you all for your replies. I am feeling quite down after reading through the thread because the overwhelming consensus is that we do not have enough money to be able to do what we want to do. I cannot see us living and cruising on a monohull. Catamarans are what we know. I do not know where we go from here but it feels like our dream is broken.
A more 'American' response to the advice given probably couldn't have been said!

'I want a car got get me around, but if it isn't a Ferrari then I might as well just stay home!' And as a teenager this is accompanied by a tantrum of some sort!

Really?! I agree, I have seen some Cats that put land based houses to shame.....but I have seen the same thing in a monos as well.

If it is about the heel, well there will come a point went the boat will feel odd because it isn't heeling.......
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Old 07-12-2012, 13:19   #62
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Re: Is this possible or are we being unrealistic and naive?

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Thank you all for your replies. I am feeling quite down after reading through the thread because the overwhelming consensus is that we do not have enough money to be able to do what we want to do. I cannot see us living and cruising on a monohull. Catamarans are what we know. I do not know where we go from here but it feels like our dream is broken.
Hey Bill, let's start over. I haven't seen anything about interest being earned.

Your goal should be living off the interest instead of spending your savings at your age or before your retirement income kicks in.

I'm with everyone else about getting a cheaper boat, while I could buy a Tilti'n Hilton, I refuse to do that, I'm starting off as dirt cheap as I can and still be safe. The dream is being out there, not the value of my boat as I know, no matter what I could buy someone will have a bigger and better one next to me eventually.

If you have to have a cat and you're as handy as you mentioned why not get a smaller fixer in need of some interior work or other minor repairs? Can you repair a boat, use it and sell it at a profit and move up doing the same thing?

I love cats, even thought about trying to build one, then I sobered up. I would not say my dream is broken if I get a 32'/36' mono.

As to real estate, While there are a few ways to invest in real estate and get more than ten per cent, being a landlord and off sailing the world is not a good plan. Stay away from real estate valuation sites, they are not accurate. To invest in RE and not actually work it requires a good knowledge of your market, hands off investing is not for beginners.

Basically, I suggest you not retire yet, you're too young! I retired at 52 from making what I though was tons of money, the first 5 years I continued in the life I was accustom to, big mistake buying depreciating assets/toys. Pretty stupid of me since I'm a finance guy!

Can you work and cruise? Full retirement gets boring and when you're bored you spend money and I see too that some of your cruising areas are pretty expensive from what I've heard. That could get you out there now and allow you to keep most of your savings.
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Old 07-12-2012, 13:20   #63
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Re: Is this possible or are we being unrealistic and naive?

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Hello everyone.

We (my wife and I) have a dream to live aboard our own boat. We both have some sailing experience and qualifications so we are not completely unaware of what we are letting ourselves in for, but I do have concerns about our finances.

We are quite homely people and live very modestly. I am very capable and self-sufficient in terms of skills and there is very little I cannot do myself or learn to do myself. We expect we will live a similar modest and self-sufficient lifestyle when we live on our own boat. We both enjoy sailing and hate motoring. We also dislike marinas and prefer the idea of living at anchor as much as possible. Anticipated cruising areas would be US east coast, Caribbean, northern Europe, maybe eastern Mediterranean.

We are from England and are both approaching 50 years old. We will have to wait until we are 67 before we have any pension income so what money we have will have to last us 17 years.

If we sell the house, car, possessions and add up all our savings we come up with a total of about US $480,000 (converted from British as I know this is mainly an American forum).

We want to have a nice 'home' afloat and want to spend a maximum of $190,000 on a sailing catamaran about 40' in length. This will leave us with $290,000 to live on. My calculations allow for a total budget of $19,000 per year, rising 2.5% per year for inflation. That $19,000 per year has to include everything: boat insurance, maintenance, repairs, fuel, food, clothes, etc, etc. Is this realistic or are we being naive?

My calculations are in the attached spreadsheet.

Attachment 50807

All feedback, thoughts and advice welcome.

Thank you.
We didn't sell the house. We've rented it out, and taken a out a revolving line of credit secured by the house. The rent goes in every week, our expenses come out, less frequently. We only pay interest when our expenses have exceeded our rental income, which isn't often.

Ultimately, we'll probably end up owing a bit on the house, by the time we decide to retire from cruising. That would be time to sell the house and downsize.

We stay out of marinas - you can do that with a cat as they are so comfortable at anchor. We don't motor much because the boat sails. I do all the maintenance. NEVER pay for labour. We live pretty well, but we don't spend much.
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Old 07-12-2012, 13:23   #64
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Re: Is this possible or are we being unrealistic and naive?

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Gotta remember that English is a constantly evolving language, not only with new words but also meanings change / evolve.

Which means that the Brit members get to make stuff up - and then claim it as authentic .

In regard to OP, banking on a 2.5% inflation rate would (IMO) be somewhat optimistic.......

......the dream is perfectly possible, just need to roll back on the boat cost - and given yer intended timescale of ownership will also have to factor in a couple of major refits.
DOJ....are you KIDDING?! In America there is a whole new language being developed and for the life of me I can't figure it out! .....or figure out why!

During a parent teacher conference my daughters English teach said to me, "And dat is da reason, fo wut I been sayin."
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Old 07-12-2012, 13:51   #65
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Re: Is this possible or are we being unrealistic and naive?

Ford Pinto:

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Old 07-12-2012, 13:57   #66
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Re: Is this possible or are we being unrealistic and naive?

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Thank you all for your replies. I am feeling quite down after reading through the thread because the overwhelming consensus is that we do not have enough money to be able to do what we want to do. I cannot see us living and cruising on a monohull. Catamarans are what we know. I do not know where we go from here but it feels like our dream is broken.
Do you dream of owning an expensive catamaran or do you dream of sailing and travelling? Your dream isn't dead it is evolving.
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Old 07-12-2012, 14:02   #67
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Re: Is this possible or are we being unrealistic and naive?

As to the cost of chartering a quick search suggests that yacht charter in the BVIs can be had from $1,695 to $2,999 per week.

Over 10 weeks and doing 5 charters the cost would come out round the $10k mark on published information. Being there on could pick the good weather and negotiate rates so cost may be less. I don't know if short stays are practical, but the concept of taking a break and becoming familiar with cruising yachts is what I was getting at.

One would also need to add in airfares and off boat accommodation and costs so my guestimate is that for around $25k one would get a very good introduction to cruising yachts. Expensive, but not as expensive as selling up and then finding that it's not as imagined.

Interestingly enough charter rates for cats are over double that of monos which is generally in line with comments.
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Old 07-12-2012, 14:07   #68
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Re: Is this possible or are we being unrealistic and naive?

Have a look again at the market I have just seen 3 prout 35 foot snowgooses for 25 to 30,000 stirling. it is a capable old boat spend a year refitting and for less than $100,000 you would have an ocean going boat and money left in kitty for repairs and life
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Old 07-12-2012, 14:20   #69
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Re: Is this possible or are we being unrealistic and naive?

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We're going in four months, in'shallah.

My biggest worry? How I'll feel when the time comes to say Goodbye to the seventeen year old cat and 11 year old St BernardX...
Ditto!! We love our Sophie (and even worse, we've taught her to love us!) How do you deal with that! But at our ages, if we don't do it now we never will. We have found a home for her, but still . . .
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Old 07-12-2012, 14:24   #70
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Re: Is this possible or are we being unrealistic and naive?

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Originally Posted by Bill4 View Post
Thank you all for your replies. I am feeling quite down after reading through the thread because the overwhelming consensus is that we do not have enough money to be able to do what we want to do. I cannot see us living and cruising on a monohull. Catamarans are what we know. I do not know where we go from here but it feels like our dream is broken.
Back in post #3 I was the first to suggest that you would have much more freedom for spending if you purchased a less expensive boat. This would be, and has been, our choice since our retirement at age 55, though we were already living aboard and cruising for many years. Actually, I do believe that a couple can cruise with the income you project; we simply see the size of the boat as an unnecessay expense. When we are out away from the docks there's very little cause to spend money. When we cruise the Bahamas our expensive times are when guests arrive and they want to seek out the marina aminities and the restaurants. A couple can spend very little cruising the East Coast US, Bahamas and Carribean depending on selected locations and activities. We find those that enjoy wilderness sites and exploring by kayak as their main entertainment can cruise for as little as $500/month. We typically spend a few months each year at this budget and then other times spending far more. Someone mentioned in an earlier post that such a frugal lifestyle would be too boring to last,- 'maybe for some. My wife and I do well with a month at a time away from civilization living on stored supplies and anchored out. You have many strategies that would allow you to do well with your plan and only one of them would be to purchase a less expensive boat. One plan would be to spend more time anchored out. Another would be to make your port time at many of the less expensive locations. Monthy liveaboard rates at a marina can vary from about $300US to $2,000US/month and anchored with access to marina amenities can be $50 to $500/month. I mention these rates along with the zero cost of anchoring out becuase of our own habits of spending some months each year at a dock. Much of our dock time is with family in North Florida for a $550/month rate on a 41' monohull.
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Old 07-12-2012, 16:54   #71
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Re: Is this possible or are we being unrealistic and naive?

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A more 'American' response to the advice given probably couldn't have been said!
Really!? Did you read the original post or just jump in with both guns blazing? The OP said he's from England, yet you don't see Americans slagging off the English generally because of this person's perhaps materialistic attitude. I don't understand why it seems that Anglos often carry the worst anti-American attitudes.
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Old 07-12-2012, 18:06   #72
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Re: Is this possible or are we being unrealistic and naive?

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Ford Pinto:

Useless. Can't shag in the back of it. Like the little Grand Prix flags on the door. That woulda made it faster. Bet Ferarri doesn't have them! Can't shag in the back of a Fararri either. Or a motor bike.
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Old 07-12-2012, 18:15   #73
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Re: Is this possible or are we being unrealistic and naive?

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Useless. Can't shag in the back of it. Like the little Grand Prix flags on the door. That woulda made it faster. Bet Ferarri doesn't have them! Can't shag in the back of a Fararri either. Or a motor bike.
Anyone who can't shag on a motor bike simply hasn't given the problem sufficient consideration. (Hint: it helps to park the bike first.)
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Old 07-12-2012, 19:32   #74
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Re: Is this possible or are we being unrealistic and naive?

Bill, your dream is not broken as in shattered. It may be a variation on a theme as Bash eloquently states.

My postion is I have a lovely woman who really wants to sail and I cannot wait to show her what cruising is all about. But due to traumatic brain injury she is unable to accomodate to heeling of a mono. So we are shopping for a sailing cat. This means to afford the higher prices of cats we have to delay our departure as we wait for investments to mature, etc.

In the interim we have decided to do a bit of day sailing on smaller cats and occasionally a mono to test if she can stand the heeling moment of a mono. Remain flexible is my best advice. Well that and never give up. The adage, Where there is a will there is a way rings true.
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Old 07-12-2012, 20:23   #75
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Re: Is this possible or are we being unrealistic and naive?

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DOJ....are you KIDDING?! In America there is a whole new language being developed and for the life of me I can't figure it out! .....or figure out why!

During a parent teacher conference my daughters English teach said to me, "And dat is da reason, fo wut I been sayin."
Here U needa be goin:
Urban Dictionary

You gotses no scusez now!
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