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Old 27-12-2009, 16:09   #196
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oops

I didn't realize that location or destination was a defacto difference in cruising and day-sailing.

Now I more understand the absoluteness of the $500 cruisers(day-sailors?) and $2000 or so cruisers.

For me, I have almost no interest whatsoever to cruise or day-sail into foreign water. Manly because I think American(and Canadian) territories offer a lifetime of cruising opportunities for anyone who wants to investigate them.

I venture to say a person could spend a good number of years sailing the Great Lakes and enjoying the cruising life immensly.

I don't need to eat Conch(sp) in Bahamas when I can eat shrimp in Mississippi or Blue Crab from the Chesepeake.

My plan is to eventualy "cruise" the Great Lakes during the warm months and sojourn to the intercoastal fo the winter.

Maybe a cruise to the Key West, Tortogas or Bahamas wouldn't be out of the question, but I don't think I have it in me to sail to the South Pacific or across either of the great oceans.

I'm pretty certain that, for me, sailing is in and of itself, enough enjoyment for me.

As far as what is evidently accepted as "cruising" as opposed to maybe, what might be called long-term day-sailing, too would have to admit that tight budgeted cruising would be a foolish venture.

BUT . . . in all fairness, there should be an absolute, definitive distinction between the two types of cruising just to ensure that we're not talking apples and oranges without realizing it.

I would not consider a 3-4 month cruise, for the sake of argument, on the Great Lakes to be "day-sailing". It would most definatly be something more than a "day-sail".

I've always considered day-sailing to be, basically a "day's" sail . . . something akin to a "one-tank-trip".
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Old 27-12-2009, 17:26   #197
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oops

Now I more understand the absoluteness of the $500 cruisers(day-sailors?) and $2000 or so cruisers.
Well, if you mean ironically, then YES.

Otherwise, cruisers are sailors who cruise. Maybe cruising is that expensive (2k a month per head). If so, then why not sail more, cruise less? For some of us the DESTINATION and BEING there is what counts. For others (also for me) it is the VOYAGE and GETTING there that counts. I like exploring destinations too, but I value the days spent at sea above those spent exploring.

So all those who have the dream of sailing far and away and seeing remote and interesting places - DO NOT give up your dream: as said elsewhere, I have sailed round the world with the 500 (or so) budget and I have met people who made it with way less money (and in much smaller a boat than my 26', 25 y.o. double-ender). I sure met many more people who sailed on and hell beyond the 2k budget. One can spend as much as they have. And more (if you still have a credit card;-)).

But the 500 budget (USD a month per person) is OK if what you want is adventure and the marginal lifestyle is what you will accept. If what you want a huge boat with all imaginable systems, then agents and servicemen to do everything about the boat and then also you want to live in marinas and eat in restaurants, then the 500 budget is not realistic. How could it be.

My only reservation is that the Panama Canal (and, to nationals of a few countries, the French Polynesia bond) is something that will make it difficult to meet the lower budget. The bond is returned but the canal fee is something one has to allow for if planning to use that route. The good news is that if we were to sail via the Magellan Strait then it would last much longer and in fact cost us way more.

b.
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Old 27-12-2009, 19:06   #198
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Just to clarify my previous post re:Panama Canal,I used the word THOUGHT as i wasn't sure re:speed capabilities but was pretty certain You had to have a motor ie: no sailing allowed,interesting that You get a discount the faster You can motor...question for those who have transited,Do they check fuel capacity?
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Old 27-12-2009, 19:26   #199
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Just to clarify my previous post re:Panama Canal,I used the word THOUGHT as i wasn't sure re:speed capabilities but was pretty certain You had to have a motor ie: no sailing allowed,interesting that You get a discount the faster You can motor...question for those who have transited,Do they check fuel capacity?
See.....I knew the M26 had its place..
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Old 27-12-2009, 21:12   #200
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I like exploring destinations too, but I value the days spent at sea above those spent exploring.
barnakiel, you have spoken to the kernal of the matter.

$500 is enough if, you have a good boat and don't push it too hard, are lucky and, most importantly, love sailing. Living in realtime and performing without a net, is a game for youngsters, with their quick reflexes and sense of immortality, or it has evolved into a habit and become an art.

How much is enough, may be the essential philosophical question of our time. Especially if the PTB keep insisting first world wages must come down into equilibrium with third world wages. How much is enough is increasingly germane to my boat search. Go soon, go small? Go heavy, for old man comfort? Go long, go fast, w/higher maintenance?

But being older, I'm fortunate to have more like $500 a week w/a cushion, so should be able to save half of that for those eventualities. I love to sail, but know little about owning and maintaining a boat. But CF is helping enormously with my education in those departments. cheers, Jon
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Old 27-12-2009, 21:35   #201
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If I wanted to transit the canal on anything under 30ft I'd be looking for a local with a truck.
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Old 27-12-2009, 22:09   #202
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After much reflection and consideration from all the valued imput to this thread...I have conceded to the fact that a 500.00 per head cost basis on a boat for long term crusing is possible after all...

The formula however as to how many head it will take to maintain a shipshape and seaworthy craft for ones chosen boat is whats left up for further debate... but with out consulting my wife first, I have come up with some preliminary numbers.

Please consult the chart below for my findings for my particular vessel and you will find I have arrived at a figure of 500 times 5 or 2500.00 per month should be adequate....
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Old 28-12-2009, 00:35   #203
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Stillraining...they're gonna cost more than 500 per month each prob more then that just in "products"
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Old 28-12-2009, 01:02   #204
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Stillraining...they're gonna cost more than 500 per month each prob more then that just in "products"
How much for 1/2 hour!
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Old 28-12-2009, 01:12   #205
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During our Caribbean cruising experience 1995-2002 yachties often "ran south" for the hurricane season to Trinidad/Tobago or Grenada. One was then on the hook from June to-end October before heading North again.We anchored one year in Man O'War Bay on Tobago fished,snorkelled and did a bus trip to Scarborough the biggest town, once a week re some provisions, the rest we got locally in Man O'War Bay.We had a windcharger/solar panels and ran the engine 1 hr/day as we watched the ocassional video, so life was pleasant, we also had get togethers with other yachties and this was all inside the $500 p/mnth budget (as a couple), dingy was a 8ft rib with 15hp motor.When on Grenada most yachties anchored at Hogg Island,some 50+ yachts every year for the 5 month hurricane season. Most caught a bus once a week to the capital re shopping,there was a get-together once a week ashore at a bar/barbaque site etc Again we lived fine within the same budget.Obviously people with larger alcohol consumption,socializing on each others' boats every night would have a larger budget but many yachts lived similar to us, healthy simple food, swapping videos etc.
Original question was can this be achieved again today
Then apply this livestyle to the Chesapeake, is it possible there
I am not knocking anybody who can afford a larger budget-good for you,but for some we have constraints unfortunately and must budget accordingly.
Also realize major maintenance can be a downfall. We had 2 older yachts in that period, sailing South Africa to Caribbean and then 7 years in Caribbean. We had no major problems in that period except for hurricane damage 3 times. SO hyperthetically if the boat is well prepared and the older engine gives no problems, can it be done again. There are some yes votes out there and some no votes, the scoffers don't count
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Old 28-12-2009, 01:55   #206
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Springbok,
I've found this thread interesting in one aspect. It seems to me the person best suited to answer this question is the one posing it. *You* cruised for 7 years, on an average of $500 a month, and you did it less than a decade ago. It really shouldn't be all that difficult for you of all people to make a few phone calls and check a few prices and have your answer, or atleast a pretty rough guess. I would wager that many of the folks responding to this thread couldn't and wouldn't have cruised on $500 a month during the 90's (or the 80's for that matter.)
Perhaps the best way to express your question would be "Has the cost of cruising the carribean and the ICW changed in the last 7 years, and if so in what ways?"
On the other hand if it were posed that way we wouldnt be having nearly as much fun would we?
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Old 28-12-2009, 03:03   #207
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with other yachties and this was all inside the $500 p/mnth budget (as a couple),
= $250 EACH.... in the caribbean? Remarkable...

Quote:
We had 2 older yachts in that period, sailing South Africa to Caribbean and then 7 years in Caribbean
... So you did replace your boat a couple times. Once you had the boat replacement costs, what did the monthly come out to?

Nice story btw, you two must have had fun!
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Old 28-12-2009, 05:03   #208
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1995 sailed 58ft Sampson Sea Strutter, Durban (South Africa ) to Caribbean stopping at St Helena,Ascension Isl.,Fernando De Nora,Barbados,St Lucia,Donomica,St Maarten.Damaged in Sept '95 Hurricane Luis,sold Dignity after hurricane in '96, bought Yamaha 33 and kitted her fully for cruising.Went thru 4 more hurricanes with Rocket, took damage twice.Ran South twice as described and lived well on $500 p/mth sometimes less. Did we have FUN YES Swimming,snorkelling,sight-seeing,fishing etc are fun to me. We ate well,socialised,watched videos etc.Maybe others have other ideas for fun, so be it.Also helped each other fix,maintain,improve things on our boats.Great friends were made. What more do you need. If cruising is getting from A to B a marina,restaurants,shopping,drinking then you are in a different category of cruising Well enjoy that cruising and the fun it brings
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Old 28-12-2009, 05:54   #209
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Interesting thread..........a mixture of different aims & lifestyles - as well as opinions . So here's mine

As me profile says, me tied to the dock - so no long range extended cruising experiances to share. But used to spend extended periods (from weeks to months) onboard me father's boat around and about in nearby France from ages of 2 foot tall to teenage years, plus the usual "doesn't count" short term voyaging since.......and a fair old bit of extended land based travels to far flung places, over many years.

The main money related travel thing I learned was: "You pay for the luxury of ignorance". And the non-optional kind mainly comes from visiting new places - as it takes time to learn what's what and who's who........for your needs. Many times their won't be any great item that impacts on your budget, just overall not as cheap as it could be (and will be if you stay long enuf).

Guide Books / Internet / fellow visitors are all useful resources but no substitute for your own boots on the ground.......wandering up a couple of side streets, hopping on a bus or talking to the locals. And on the latter, talking is not the same as simply asking - and IME is a time related thing, the longer you are somewhere the better you know people and the more you can get out of simply talking. As a broad rule, the longer you know somewhere (not neccesarily by staying permanently - returning over many years works well) the cheaper a place is for you - especially if (aka when!) things do not go smoothly.......getting boat (or yourself!) fixed when away from home port, let alone foreign is a challenge. and can easily be very costly for the simplist of things through lack of options.

On a RTW voyage the whole purpose is of course a succession of new places, countries and continents - many (most?) of which you will never revisit, so no avoiding the "paying for ignorance" premium endlessly - not a criticism, after all, that's the whole point!

But for others, the cruising area / circuit / period chosen can be an important factor in reducing monthly costs from that of a RTW style voyager........if you are prepared to revisit places / areas you have already learnt, especially if re-visiting also for a financial reason (cheap haulout, bargain rum or to replenish stores or undertake repairs - at places / with people you already know) and doesn't have to be a totally closed or endlessly repetitive loop - with ocean(s) or without.........or going for a period where an engine rebuild or major re-rig can be scheduled upon return to shore (& paid work!), whether 1 or 3 years later. or simply dealt with by a sale after return

BTW not saying that USD500 is acheivable (I ain't even tried ) or desirable (I ain't even sure I want to travel extended period by boat - whether 1st class or steerage!).......certainly though working on a tight budget requires more thought than not - but thinking is good for you .........although I did also enjoy my extended travels where no thinking was required thanks to budget. The bits I can remember.........

But an Apples and Oranges kinda discussion anyway...........
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Old 28-12-2009, 06:03   #210
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To add to David's perspective about local knowledge, in many places you'll find that the local vendors (fish, produce, manual labor) will have one (higher) price for "tourists" and a different (lower) price for locals. If you can establish a relationship with a trustworthy local who can help you get access to the "local" prices, you can lower your costs significantly.
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