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Old 18-09-2009, 16:32   #16
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I added my boat liability insurance to my automobile policy
You might want to make sure it is truly marine liability coverage - in addition to covering liability to your guests, other boats & their passengers, & marinas, it should also include:

1. Jones Act liability to any paid crew
2. Longshoreman & Harborworkers Compensation, for instance for a mechanic working on your boat
3. Pollution Liability
4. Wreck removal
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Old 18-09-2009, 17:44   #17
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Don't know if you plan on finacing your boat or not, but I doubt if you would be able to get a high deductible.
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Old 18-09-2009, 20:51   #18
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The answer to the first question is "somewhere between 1/2 of a percent to 3.5% of hull value". Which is kind of meaningless- that's a huge range. What makes the difference?

Yes that range is between "doable" and "show stopper"... Don't have the boat yet, but leaning towards a Lagoon 420 with Diesels... Coastal crusing until comfortable than perhaps Med for awhile who knows after that... vessel will probably cost $400kish... not planning on financing it...could live with a $20k deductible or perhaps even more... I know this is not the forum to get insurance quotes... I am just trying to find a budget that might work... it's depressing and I am not poor, or at least I didn't think I was until I got serious with the numbers... $5k here $13k There, $7k over there...and these are todays dollars what happens when all these expenses continue to get higher while my Pensions and passive income don't... Sorry just venting.... When I get ready I will reach out to you and see what can be done...

Thanks for all the great responses...

Cheers
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Old 25-09-2009, 05:59   #19
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Just got quotes back today

Quote:
Asian Waters

Quotation for Yacht Insurance Quotation Ref. No.
Owner built/Modified Simpson Slipstream 15 Power catamaran
Hull Insurance Agreed Fixed Value (Sum insured):$720,000.00
Cruising Area Waters between 20 North and 10 South and between 90 East and 160 East.
Policy Excess: $ 5,000.00
After deduction of any No Claims Bonus (see below) the net annual premium is
$ 16,848.00
Terms & Conditions Cover is based on Pantaenius Yacht Hull Clauses.
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Australian Waters

Quotation for Yacht Insurance Quotation Ref. No.
Owner built/Modified Simpson Slipstream 15 Power catamaran

Hull Insurance Agreed Fixed Value (Sum insured): $720,000.00
Cruising Area Australian coastal waters up to 200 nm off the coast
Policy Excess: $ 4,000.00
After deduction of any No Claims Bonus (see below) the net annual premium is
$ 6,912.00
Terms & Conditions Cover is based on Pantaenius Yacht Hull Clauses.
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Old 25-09-2009, 07:12   #20
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Originally Posted by cat man do View Post
Just got quotes back today

Wow, those range from expensive to non-starter.... 200nm off shore is not a huge sailing area for $7k/yr in insurance.... I do hope you find better offers.... let us know...

Cheers
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Old 25-09-2009, 07:45   #21
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Wow, those range from expensive to non-starter.... 200nm off shore is not a huge sailing area for $7k/yr in insurance.... I do hope you find better offers.... let us know...

Cheers
200nm offshore for a less than 1% premium is pretty standard stuff over here
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Old 25-09-2009, 08:16   #22
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- - Cat man do's quotes are quite "reasonable" - as he said the "local" sailing is "less than 1%" and the Asian waters (I assume that is all of the islands of the Middle and south Pacific?) - is only 2.3%, which according to what we pay in the Caribbean is right in the middle.
- - What may be spooking some people is that his vessel is valued at $720K which puts him up there in a very top end of the average cruisers boat value. I do hope that he can get a "iron clad" highly reputable surveyor to agree to that value as he seems to be building a "home-built" vessel. There is little argument when the vessel is from a mainstream manufacturer (e.g. Beneteau, Catalina, etc.) but with a "home-built" or "custom-built one-off" vessel that is lots of room for argument about its "market value" when it comes time to collect on a claimed loss.
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Old 26-09-2009, 06:03   #23
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I do hope that he can get a "iron clad" highly reputable surveyor to agree to that value as he seems to be building a "home-built" vessel. There is little argument when the vessel is from a mainstream manufacturer (e.g. Beneteau, Catalina, etc.) but with a "home-built" or "custom-built one-off" vessel that is lots of room for argument about its "market value" when it comes time to collect on a claimed loss.
Plenty of home built Schionnings, Orams, Fusions etc over here and it's never been a problem before getting them insured.
I am a boatbuilder by trade, not that this makes a difference because I can assure you the clowns working in a production line boatbuilding facility (Beneteau, Catalina) mostly are not.

I did just pluck a number for a quote, but replacement value is what they are after, and tell me how much is a 50 ft Schionning/fusion style powercat is worth?



What do I replace it with?
There is no of the shelf replacement so what do you insure it for?
What would it would cost to replace?

Heres 56 ft
Powerplay - Powerplay 56 - Power catamaran : motor-yacht > 50' - Free classified ads - Used boats

Heres 40ft
Fusion 40 Powercat: Power Boats | Boats Online for Sale | Grp | Queensland (Qld) - Gold Coast, Australia
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Old 26-09-2009, 08:02   #24
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- - I agree that "getting" insurance is not much of a problem. It is the "collecting" after a loss that I was talking about. Agreed value policies if substantiated by a good survey are the least painful way to assure you get what you paid for in the insurance. The other "normal" policy they will try to sell you is keyed to different things including "Market Value" and not usually "replacement value" unless the policy specifically is written that way. Insurance is a tricky thing because after all, the insurance company is in the business of taking in money, and does not like to pay it out. Other threads have extensively discussed policies and companies ranging from "never pay out a claim" to "efficient and reasonable payments."
- - I am just suggesting that you document "six ways to Sunday" whatever the value of the boat is when you finally get it "in the piss" - is that an Aussie expression? Derived from all the great beer you guys have?
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Old 29-09-2009, 09:42   #25
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Osiris,

Obviously I am not an Aussie, but I have always wondered about "in the piss" as well.

While waiting for a real OZ explanation, I found this thru Google.

Importing Piss

Isn't the internet great?

Fair Winds,
Mike
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Old 29-09-2009, 19:12   #26
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"In the piss"
is
"in the drink"
is
"In the water"

I fail to see why there is confusion, it's not as if I can launch a 50 foot cat into a sea of rum, beer or champagne, though it would be nice.

Just for you guys, I will change it so as it is more easily understandable for those with less imagination.
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Old 29-09-2009, 19:29   #27
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Just got quotes back today
So, regarding the above quotes I asked why the huge difference between both areas
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Email 1
Thanks for that

The Quote for Australian waters is about what I expected but I have to ask, Why is the Asian waters so much more expensive?
What reasons do you base the increase on?

I look forward to a response,

Quote:
Reply 1
Dear Dave

Thank you for your email.

Underwriters set a minimum premium for each cruising area based on many factors that will determine the difference between premiums. These will include the level of risks that a client may face, claims history data for that area and the availability of competent and professional yacht repair facilities.

Please do not hesitate to contact us should you require any further information.

Kind regards
Quote:
Email 2
Hi

Thats exactly what I was after, this further information that makes the premium so much more expensive.

Cost of repair are considerably less than Australia and there are quite a few good yards run by expats,
Piracy fears are almost non-existent for private vessels (can you show me any cases ?)
There are occasional dinghy and outboard thefts, if unsecured, just like anywhere in Australia (we will lift the dinghy out of the water every night)
about the only thing I could think of that "May" be worse is rubbish that can get tangled around the props.
During cyclone season I'll be taking the same precautions I do in Australia (we get cyclones here as well)

What else would there be?

Kind regards
Quote:
Reply 2
Dear Dave

Thank you for your email.

Underwriters have noted your comments but advise that the premium offered is that minimum rate for that cruising area.

Please do not hesitate to contact us should you have any further queries.

Kind regards

Friggen insurance riddles and gobbledygook.

Seems to me they have no reason apart from gouging because they can.
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Old 01-10-2009, 19:34   #28
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It's the recent rash of piracy. Plain and simple. Whether or not the risk is real or imagined matters little, as there have been documented cases of an increased risk of piracy, so the underwriters need to mitigate what they see as a larger risk by upping the premiums.

They don't stay in business and make big profits for their shareholders when they have to pay out claims because they insured your $700,000 boat for a few thousand dollars and it got taken away by a couple of teenagers in a leaky old dinghy toting AK47's.
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Old 11-10-2009, 19:17   #29
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My insurance premium is due this week, and I was about to pay it with a bit of grumbling until a friend mentioned that the market value of boats has dropped dramatically in the past year. Think it's worth a C&V survey to reduce costs?

For that matter, I wonder if the annual tax to the State of Washington can be adjusted on the basis of market value, or if I'm forever committed to a number based on purchase price...

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Old 11-10-2009, 19:45   #30
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