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Old 19-11-2015, 13:10   #16
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Re: Buying in NZ - What about GST & Duty?

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Originally Posted by royelliot View Post
Wow; firstly I want to say a massive thanks to everyone for taking the time to help. I am literally astounded and excited that I am joining this community.

In terms of the CAT 1 this is sort of a red herring by the sounds of it as I am fully intending as others have suggested to get a boat that has been offshore and is CAT1. I completely agree with what others have pointed out about S&R and do not want to skimp myself; more my question was more aimed at advantages of registering elsewhere so the yacht is more attractive to purchase when I sell.

Spot on advice with the GST - that has put my mind to rest there.

I feel less clear on the importing bit - my wife is only british and I could enter NZ on my british passport on visiter visa so could likely avoid the Kiwi card needed to be played.

Perhaps an example as I recently looked at a Dutch yacht and it has just arrived in NZ. It is $200k, sounds like GST can be avoided. But could anyone hazard a guess at what the cost would be 'all in'? Using numbers may help me (I can be slow and I am very very new to this!)

Again, can't tell you how much I appreciate and respect the responses, you are all top in my book.
Be aware that you can enter Australia visa free on a NZ passport, but (unless it has changed recently) a British passport requires a visa to enter Australia.

A friend traveling to Australia from NZ on a British passport was turned away from boarding at AKL airport as she didn't have an Australia entry visa even though she had lived in NZ 50 years. She had to get a rushed visa ( extra fee?) and catch another flight a day or so later.

It's only going to get tougher following Fri 13 Paris.

Australia detained and then deported several New Zealand (only) passport holders who have historic Aus. convictions even if they had been living in Australia 30 years married with children. A plane load of a dozen arrived in AKL from the Christmas Island detention center yesterday and were processed by the NZ police. They had been detained for at least a couple of weeks before Fri 13.
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Old 19-11-2015, 13:49   #17
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Re: Buying in NZ - What about GST & Duty?

Check with customs.govt.nz. Anyone with residency (automatic with a NZ passport) importing goods including ships and aircraft who has owned them for personal use overseas for more than 21 months is not liable for duty or gst on those goods.
It is quite common for foreign cruisers to change plans or be forced by ill health to sell their boats in NZ. The duty and gst then has to be paid, or factored into the sale price for the buyer to account for it.
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Old 19-11-2015, 14:29   #18
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Re: Buying in NZ - What about GST & Duty?

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Check with customs.govt.nz. Anyone with residency (automatic with a NZ passport)..........

It is quite common for foreign cruisers to change plans or be forced by ill health to sell their boats in NZ. The duty and gst then has to be paid, or factored into the sale price for the buyer to account for it.
All correct. In reality a boat will be sold at market price, which is usually a lot lower than asking price so it won't be sold for 15% more. It will be the vendor who has to pay to IRD the GST component of the sale price because they originally imported it without paying GST. If they imported it and paid GST then, they don't need to pay GST again.

However any liable GST component will have to appear on the sales invoice, and it is the sellers responsibility to pay it to IRD. If GST is not shown on the invoice and if the seller leaves the country without paying it you could be liable. But not liable if GST is shown as "000.00", because the vendor writes the invoice and is responsible for GST. A yacht broker should be aware of all that, but so should a buyer. None of all this applies to secondhand NZ owned boats, although it would be a safeguard to show nil GST on any invoice.

It's similar to when I sell a business car that I had claimed back the GST on, a few years ago, I have to repay the GST component of its depreciated sale price. It is not the buyer who has to pay GST.

( I can claim back GST on my business expenses, (only) as my business is GST registered. When companies are making a profit, they are paying GST to the IRD on that profit, put simply. That makes me and all other NZ businesses de facto tax collectors. That's why we don't have to put a stamp on the envelope when we mail in a return)
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Old 19-11-2015, 14:39   #19
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Re: Buying in NZ - What about GST & Duty?

Actually the stamp thing stopped a few years ago Graham. You do get a free envelope though, with the logo on the front "Stamp Here". I've just been reading the thread about sales tax on boats in different states in the US. The Revenue men will chase the stone for the last ounce/gram. :-)
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Old 19-11-2015, 14:58   #20
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Re: Buying in NZ - What about GST & Duty?

This is my thoughts and very basic knowledge being an AU citizen.
If an AU citizen owned vessel is sailing in waters outside Australia, it is required to have AU federal registration. Although somehow not a legal requirement. Read that somewhere.
So any vessel purchased OS by an AU citizen is required to get AU federal registration. No duty or Gst 5 and 10 % is payable then , but on return to AU it must be paid before the boat leaves the customs warf. Why come back to inflated living costs at all, I often ask myself. If it wasn't for some of the best cruising grounds in the world/ family etc you simply wouldn't , as some cruisers are now bypassing AU all together because of the cost alone.
However , if a NZ/AU citizens can enter without visas, why would you even need to go to customs on return , other than of course quarantine . That's where they catch you of course.
Why though, couldn't a AU citizen then just leave the NZ registered boat ( if purchased there ) with NZ rego/ duty /Gst that has been paid and maybe no duty and Gst is then required on return. Is this at all possible.
I mean who can now afford to purchase OS anyway, with the bad AU and NZ - US dollar .
What we all really want to do is purchase OS, and not have to pay duty and Gst anywhere, on a vessel we purchase OS, especially if the vessel has already paid all there duty,s in that country.
It's not always that cruisy is it!
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Old 19-11-2015, 15:04   #21
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Re: Buying in NZ - What about GST & Duty?

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Originally Posted by Xpress View Post
Actually the stamp thing stopped a few years ago Graham. You do get a free envelope though, with the logo on the front "Stamp Here". I've just been reading the thread about sales tax on boats in different states in the US. The Revenue men will chase the stone for the last ounce/gram. :-)
Quite correct I've posted in an estimated 102 returns in the previous 17 years. The last one around a month ago.
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Old 19-11-2015, 15:51   #22
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Re: Buying in NZ - What about GST & Duty?

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Originally Posted by PeeWee View Post
This is my thoughts and very basic knowledge being an AU citizen.
If an AU citizen owned vessel is sailing in waters outside Australia, it is required to have AU federal registration. Although somehow not a legal requirement. Read that somewhere.
So any vessel purchased OS by an AU citizen is required to get AU federal registration. No duty or Gst 5 and 10 % is payable then , but on return to AU it must be paid before the boat leaves the customs warf. Why come back to inflated living costs at all, I often ask myself. If it wasn't for some of the best cruising grounds in the world/ family etc you simply wouldn't , as some cruisers are now bypassing AU all together because of the cost alone.
However , if a NZ/AU citizens can enter without visas, why would you even need to go to customs on return , other than of course quarantine . That's where they catch you of course.
Why though, couldn't a AU citizen then just leave the NZ registered boat ( if purchased there ) with NZ rego/ duty /Gst that has been paid and maybe no duty and Gst is then required on return. Is this at all possible.
I mean who can now afford to purchase OS anyway, with the bad AU and NZ - US dollar .
What we all really want to do is purchase OS, and not have to pay duty and Gst anywhere, on a vessel we purchase OS, especially if the vessel has already paid all there duty,s in that country.
It's not always that cruisy is it!
They have no way of knowing you are 'Strayan 'til they have had a look at you and checked your papers......
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Old 19-11-2015, 15:53   #23
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Re: Buying in NZ - What about GST & Duty?

Re bring back a 'ship' duty and GST free after time O/S... I think the devil is in the detail...
'small ship means a ship that is either of the following:
(a) a sailing vessel that—
(i) in the sailing condition does not exceed 2.5 metres in width at any section; and
(ii) does not exceed 1,000 kilograms unladen weight; and
(iii) does not incorporate any device for propelling the vessel by power (for example, an auxiliary motor); and
(iv) is not of the deep keel type:
(b) a powered vessel that—
(i) does not exceed 7 metres in length; and
(ii) does not exceed 2.5 metres in width at any section; and
(iii) does not exceed 1,250 kilograms all up unladen weight (ie with driving units and transmissions) or 800 kilograms unladen weight when imported without driving units and transmissions'

that's from here.. http://www.customs.govt.nz/news/reso...oncessions.pdf
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Old 19-11-2015, 15:58   #24
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Re: Buying in NZ - What about GST & Duty?

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Originally Posted by PeeWee View Post
This is my thoughts and very basic knowledge being an AU citizen.
If an AU citizen owned vessel is sailing in waters outside Australia, it is required to have AU federal registration. Although somehow not a legal requirement. Read that somewhere.
So any vessel purchased OS by an AU citizen is required to get AU federal registration. No duty or Gst 5 and 10 % is payable then , but on return to AU it must be paid before the boat leaves the customs warf. Why come back to inflated living costs at all, I often ask myself. If it wasn't for some of the best cruising grounds in the world/ family etc you simply wouldn't , as some cruisers are now bypassing AU all together because of the cost alone.
However , if a NZ/AU citizens can enter without visas, why would you even need to go to customs on return , other than of course quarantine . That's where they catch you of course.
Why though, couldn't a AU citizen then just leave the NZ registered boat ( if purchased there ) with NZ rego/ duty /Gst that has been paid and maybe no duty and Gst is then required on return. Is this at all possible.
I mean who can now afford to purchase OS anyway, with the bad AU and NZ - US dollar .
What we all really want to do is purchase OS, and not have to pay duty and Gst anywhere, on a vessel we purchase OS, especially if the vessel has already paid all there duty,s in that country.
It's not always that cruisy is it!
You'll have to lobby Malcolm Turnbull on that one.

NZ is now going to make all internet purchases liable for GST. Companies selling in NZ from overseas will have to be registered and make a return. That's as I understand purely from radio news reports.

Say I bought a new laptop in the SF Apple Store, I would have paid sales tax there. When I bring it back to NZ I am expected to declare any overseas purchases (over I think an allowance of $400) Then Customs will want a GST payment on the value of the laptop less $400. If i don't declare it and they check my credit card statement, or which NZ shop I might pretend I had bought it in I will be fined and lose the laptop. That's even though I would have paid sales tax whatever rate it is in CA, or anywhere else.
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Old 19-11-2015, 20:00   #25
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Re: Buying in NZ - What about GST & Duty?

I just happened to pull out a copy of my 'Import Entry ( Temporary )' to give to some bloke doing a bit of work for me.

I note that it says, amongst other stuff,
''this vessel will not be be sold or offered for sale or otherwise disposed off in New Zealand without the permission of the Chief Executive of Customs...'
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Old 20-11-2015, 16:01   #26
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Re: Buying in NZ - What about GST & Duty?

With respect to El Pinguino's research, you have to read the whole Customs working tariff document. There is a section covering the "small ships" he mentions, but a class of vessels otherwise dealt with includes vessels that are sailed to NZ by their owners, and that encompasses small craft up to superyachts (for which incidentally, temporary entry permits may now be granted for up to two years allowing cruisers to do major refits).
The concession stands: Duty and gst free if the owner has been offshore for 21 months or more, brings back the goods as a resident and does not sell for two years. If the two year bond is broken duty and gst are payable on an assessed value which has a lot of variables. It is worth noting that if duty is payable Customs have been thorough in the past in assessing not only the purchase price of a boat, but also any added equipment or repairs. Cruisers visiting NZ are well advised to keep all receipts and documents. I gather from a NZ citizen friend who sailed a US purchased boat to Australia, where he lives, that the rules are similar there. Work he had done to prepare for the voyage was included in the assessment when he arrived in Oz.
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Old 20-11-2015, 18:08   #27
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Re: Buying in NZ - What about GST & Duty?

I have dual passport Australian and UK and only show one at a time depending on which nationality i wish to be.. So if the Kiwi govt are going to sting you for import tax straight away then flash the UK one.. Only answer yes and no questions.. Its not illegal to be one or the other..
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Old 20-11-2015, 18:48   #28
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Re: Buying in NZ - What about GST & Duty?

Also around the NZ coastline in strategic spots there are Customs recruited Coast Watchers that advise of any out of place looking vessels that may be trying to come in undetected. They may be farmers or residents overlooking bays. It's mainly to look out for drug smugglers, even people smugglers etc but you can be sure any foreign looking vessels will be reported. That's more or less how the French, Rainbow Warrior bombers, (1985) were first detected in their Beneteau 32 charter yacht stolen from Noumea, and then their abandoned Zodiac just after the bombing.
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Old 20-11-2015, 20:02   #29
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Re: Buying in NZ - What about GST & Duty?

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I have dual passport Australian and UK and only show one at a time depending on which nationality i wish to be.. So if the Kiwi govt are going to sting you for import tax straight away then flash the UK one.. Only answer yes and no questions.. Its not illegal to be one or the other..
Yes, you are perfectly entitled to use either passport if it's an advantage (mostly for consular protection I would have thought). But the choice is not really relevant to the issues Roy raised about duty/gst. On the UK passport he would not be entitled to the duty concession unless he was granted permanent residency and could show he qualified otherwise--owning/using the goods for more than 21 months and bringing them in under bond not to sell them for at least two years.
As a NZ passport holder he can enter/return home with the owned/used goods and claim the duty-free concession, subject to bond.
Using his UK passport would be relevant if he wished to sail off again in his foreign vessel. He wouldn't need to have a Category 1 safety clearance.
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Old 20-11-2015, 20:30   #30
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Re: Buying in NZ - What about GST & Duty?

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Yes, you are perfectly entitled to use either passport if it's an advantage (mostly for consular protection I would have thought). But the choice is not really relevant to the issues Roy raised about duty/gst. On the UK passport he would not be entitled to the duty concession unless he was granted permanent residency and could show he qualified otherwise--owning/using the goods for more than 21 months and bringing them in under bond not to sell them for at least two years.
As a NZ passport holder he can enter/return home with the owned/used goods and claim the duty-free concession, subject to bond.
Using his UK passport would be relevant if he wished to sail off again in his foreign vessel. He wouldn't need to have a Category 1 safety clearance.
Since the Lebanese business 10 years ago I think holding an Australian passport does you no good at all if you are in the other country that you are a national of..hope that makes sense.
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