Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 13-10-2008, 14:29   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 6
Buying a used Catamaran and have some ??'s

I'm praying that these economic problems will be overcome by this spring, 1. so I can sell my house, 2. so I can get a loan on a yacht, which now I think would be impossible.
For a US resident, where would the best place for me to buy a catamaran be? I'm looking at Leopard 40's and 47's in the $200-300k range. Is there a tax advantage to buy one in BVI or another country vs. buying one in Florida? I'm currently a Tennessee resident and plan on living/cruising this boat out of country for a few years. Anyone think the tax on buying a yacht will change dramatically as a result of the new president (increase if one gets elected decrease if the other does) starting in '09?
Thanks,
Kug
__________________

__________________
kkugley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2008, 14:44   #2
Senior Cruiser
 
Talbot's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Brighton, UK
Boat: Privilege 37
Posts: 3,579
Images: 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by kkugley View Post
I'm praying that these economic problems will be overcome by this spring, 1. so I can sell my house, 2. so I can get a loan on a yacht, which now I think would be impossible.
I love an enthusiastic optimist

Like you, I am waiting on a house sail, but that not only depends on the economic situation, but also on my ex getting off her butt and selling the place.

Believe me, the ecomomic uncertaintany pales into insignificance!
__________________

__________________
"Be wary of strong drink. It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and miss."
Robert A Heinlein
Talbot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2008, 16:13   #3
Senior Cruiser
 
44'cruisingcat's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,454
Images: 69
South Africa seems a good place to buy with US $ at the moment.
__________________
44'cruisingcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2008, 17:04   #4
Senior Cruiser
 
maxingout's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Fort Pierce, Phoenix
Boat: Privilege 39 Catamaran, Exit Only
Posts: 2,606
There are a couple of things you can do to minimize the tax impact of buying a yacht.

I purchased my first Caribbean sailboat in St. Thomas and registered it in St. Thomas at a friend's address. I paid a few dollars each year to update the registration for the three years that I had it in the Caribbean.

Years later, I did the deal on my catamaran in the Bahamas which meant that there were no taxes, but I had to create and maintain an offshore corporation that owns the yacht. Over time the costs of maintaining an offshore corporation mount up.

Since I had not lived in the USA for twenty years, and since I was going sailing around the world, it didn't make sense to purchase a boat in the USA and pay taxes in the USA on a boat that wasn't going to be in the USA anyway.

If you are headed offshore long-term, then it may make sense to do the deal offshore and register/document the vessel offshore as well. If you are going to be cruising for only a couple of years, then it probably doesn't matter that much what you do.

Living offshore longterm is looking better by the week. I lived on Exit Only for $500 to $1000 per month on my basic expenses. My Freedom Chips go a lot farther when my anchor is down in paradise.
__________________
Dave -Sailing Vessel Exit Only

http://SailingUNI.com
http://maxingout.com
http://PositiveThinkingSailor.com
maxingout is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2008, 18:09   #5
Registered User
 
First Mate's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Puget Sound, WA
Boat: Far From Turtle: 1980 Pearson 424 cutter rigged ketch
Posts: 326
Florida has sales tax

North Carolina, I keep hearing, does not.

Also, Rhode Island. Please correct me if I am wrong.

you could get an address one of those two places for a month if you are purchasing
__________________
First Mate is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2008, 20:01   #6
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 6
Quote:
Originally Posted by Talbot View Post
I love an enthusiastic optimist

Like you, I am waiting on a house sail, but that not only depends on the economic situation, but also on my ex getting off her butt and selling the place.

Believe me, the ecomomic uncertaintany pales into insignificance!
Ah, but I DO understand "the ex factor". I'm celebrating, as tonite, the house deed is souly in my name. The "big D" will be final next week. Life will be good
__________________
kkugley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-10-2008, 21:58   #7
Registered User
 
SelkirkWind's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Sandpoint, ID, USA
Boat: Leopard 46, The Selkirk Grace
Posts: 73
Tax Free States

Quote:
Originally Posted by First Mate View Post
North Carolina, I keep hearing, does not.

Also, Rhode Island. Please correct me if I am wrong.

you could get an address one of those two places for a month if you are purchasing
Be careful here, there be dragons.......
Some states have no sales tax, but they have residency requirements. You have to have been there for a year, or you have to have been there on January 1st, or ..........

The real question is where are you planning to go and what your registry buys you. It is easy and relatively cheap for US boats to go places. Often other US flagged vessels have been there and the local customs officials won't necessarily be making it up as they go along.


If you are interested in a Leopard, the places to go are around the Moorings bases. Belize, Tortola, Abacos, St. Marteen, St. Lucia and St. Vincent. Tortola has the most boats.
__________________
SelkirkWind is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-10-2008, 09:48   #8
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 6
If you are interested in a Leopard, the places to go are around the Moorings bases. Belize, Tortola, Abacos, St. Marteen, St. Lucia and St. Vincent. Tortola has the most boats.[/quote]

I see that these countries do have a lot of Leopards. Is there any tax advantage for an American to buy in one of those countries over another or even versus the US that you know of?
Thanks
__________________
kkugley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-10-2008, 10:33   #9
Registered User
 
kevingy's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Roaming, currently Fernandina Beach, FL
Boat: Under contract. Closing soon.
Posts: 174
I always wondered if the costs acquire a boat on a far-off island would outweigh the savings to be had. Considering airfare, hotel, food, and other expenses to get to where the boat is (probably more than one trip by the end of the process), stay for a while to look and close, and then move the boat home (assuming you're not just going to go from where the boat is).
__________________
kevingy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-10-2008, 14:05   #10
Registered User
 
Sunspot Baby's Avatar

Join Date: May 2003
Location: New Bern, NC
Boat: Prout Manta 38' Catamaran - Sunspot Baby
Posts: 1,521
Images: 14
NC does have a sales tax 3% on boats I believe, but if you bring a documented boat in from out of state they don't seem to pursue you for sales taxes.

They do have a personal property tax on boats but if the boat is out of state on Jan 1 you don't have to pay. They may ask to see that you have paid taxes somewhere else. I figure my Bahamas cruising permit is the tax I pay.

Within the US, there are more used cats in Florida, primarily the Ft. Lauderdale area.

There are often yachts coming out of charter in BVI and other popular charter bases if you want an ex-charter boat. There are pros and cons and you can read some pretty strong opinions in this forum against charter boats, but I know several people who have them and they are OK.

George
__________________
She took my address and my name
Put my credit to shame
Sunspot Baby, sure had a real good time
Bob Seger
Sunspot Baby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-10-2008, 18:22   #11
Registered User
 
SelkirkWind's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Sandpoint, ID, USA
Boat: Leopard 46, The Selkirk Grace
Posts: 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by kkugley View Post
I see that these countries do have a lot of Leopards. Is there any tax advantage for an American to buy in one of those countries over another or even versus the US that you know of?
Thanks
I disagree about buying charter boats. I think they can be a real value. For the most part, modern charter boats are designed for low maintenance, and they can be fairly easily restored. Don't take my word for it though, go talk to the folks on the Yahoo groups site, Leopard Owners Group.
__________________
SelkirkWind is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-10-2008, 21:07   #12
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Melbourne, Florida
Boat: 1995 CATALINA 320 (missing my catamaran)
Posts: 190
Send a message via Skype™ to SurfNRG
When I was shopping for a cat three plus years ago I flew down to the BVI's and checked out several ex-charter boats. After listening to the brokers talk about how they professionally maintain these ex-charter boats to a tee I noticed it started raining. I also noticed the vast majority of these used charter cats that were 4 sale were left open. Here it was raining buckets and the hatches on many of these boats were wide open. And the broker was peering out the window commenting how hard it was raining. No comments like, Hey, let's close those boats up. Hmmm.., It definitely answered my question as to why many of these cats smelled funky with mold as well as signs of worn upholstrey from the extended use, etc.. And the boat I was interested in ended up having the starboard side transmission removed not for the past week like the broker stated but for months. I'm sure you could find a good ex-charter but I'd be more apt in finding one through a private owner who had properly maintained the vessel on a regular basis. And it'll usually will have a lot less wear and tear both cosmetically and mechanically. Just my 2 cents from experience.
__________________
SurfNRG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-10-2008, 06:29   #13
Sponsoring Vendor

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: UK and BC, Canada when not sailing
Boat: 25ft Merlin catamaran, 34ft Romany catamaran
Posts: 116
If you were buying a used car would you a) buy an old taxi, b) buy an ex rental car, c) buy from "one careful lady owner"?

Richard Woods of Woods Designs

Woods Designs Sailing Catamarans
Woods Designs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-10-2008, 07:12   #14
Marine Service Provider
 
Factor's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Brisbane Australia
Boat: Corsair Dash MKII
Posts: 4,084
Really succinctly put Richard. Good guidance
__________________
Factor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-10-2008, 07:37   #15
Registered User
 
SelkirkWind's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Sandpoint, ID, USA
Boat: Leopard 46, The Selkirk Grace
Posts: 73
Ex Rental Cars

Quote:
Originally Posted by Woods Designs View Post
If you were buying a used car would you a) buy an old taxi, b) buy an ex rental car, c) buy from "one careful lady owner"?
Richard has a point, only several hundred thousand people buy used rental cars every year!

The fact is you have three options with Cats:

1.) Build one, the main issues are cost and time. The positive, you may get the boat of your dreams with everything optimized (trade-offs) specifically for you.

2.) Buy one from a little old lady! Everyone loves this one, but the number of people actually able to find a gently used CAT is very small. Finding an awesome Cat like a newer Leopard almost impossible. The truth is that boats who sit and are not used often have more problems than ones that are used regularly.

3.) Buy a charter boat and refit her. Could be some significant cost here, but versus building, probably your best bet. The thing to do IMHO if you want a Leopard is to buy it from The Moorings. The trick is to buy a boat STILL in charter and then walk it through Moorings "phase out" with your own surveyor (You bet Moorings will do this!). Another possibility is buying a charter boat that is being "phased out" for other reasons. There was a boat in St. Lucia recently that phased out after less than a year in service. Remember, these boats are owned by people, not the Moorings. Owners can take the boat and sell it at anytime depending on their personal issues........ They probably get the best deal selling it through the Moorings broker, particularly if they are trading up to a larger boat.

read through the files at LeopardCat : Leopard Catamaran Owners Group
__________________

__________________
SelkirkWind is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Buying in the Med 23windowz Dollars & Cents 10 04-01-2011 02:58
Buying a Catamaran with a Partner? scarab Multihull Sailboats 7 27-08-2009 07:56
Buying a new sail catamaran freetime Multihull Sailboats 15 16-08-2008 11:23
buying new vs used schoonerdog Multihull Sailboats 91 14-05-2008 17:47
about buying into charter... sundog Multihull Sailboats 19 12-11-2007 04:19



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:59.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.