Annual Live Aboard Budget ?

[KaptainKen]

I've been running a similar set of calc's as Weyalan for a similar purpose. Here is a link to an "Annuity Calculator" that has helped me with the problem.

http://www.moneychimp.com/calculator...calculator.htm

I'm not suggesting an annuity (many financial advisers say it is a bad investment) but it will work for any liquid investment. My personal retirement money is in mutual funds. I simply plug in the value of my portfolio, expected growth rate (4% to 6% is safe) and how long I want it to last ... in my case 30 years. It returns an annual withdrawal that will bring the principle to zero in the time specified.

Experiment with different numbers and it gives you a general picture how much you need invested to get what you need on an annual basis.

KaptainKen

(Postscript: there are a bunch of other financial calculators there too.)

[RandyAbernethy]

Some current interest rates:
One Year TBill: 5.22% (6 mo is 5%)
One CDs are as high as 5.5%
Citibank has a checking account that pays 5%

Business Week Reports the average return of all bond funds in their universe (which is fairly representative) from 1995-2004 to be 6.6%

Seems like with the right selection of products a good financial advisor should be able to get you north of the average bond fund.

[Boracay]

While I have not cruised I have taken extended holidays and worked overseas while renting out my house.
At the moment I am renting out my house interstate while living in Sydney.
I have always taken great care to find a good agent.
That is an agent who understands that the long term suvival of their business depends on how effectivly they select and monitor tennants.
As the landlord I have always found it better to have a lower rent and to be selective about my tennants.
I did find myself in one circumstance where I decided that due to the location it would not be possible to get a good tennant so I sold the property. No regrets.
Some places do have laws that offer tennants very good protection and this should form part of your considerations.
I've only had one problem in thirty years of part time landlording.
Never, never, never rent to junkies.

[Lostmt]

I would have to disagree with the third post on this thread.

"The older you get when you start the more stuff you need."

When you have lived a life as a ranch hand your income is below the Welfare requirements. You have learned to live without much. So at 61 almost 62 with little SS to plan on (no retiremant or investments) we do plan on spending the rest of my life as liveaboards somewhere on the west coast. A 28' to 30' will work great for us. As we have live in a 17' camp trailer on one ranch for many months with one child still at home. Now that there is just the 2 of us we can live is a small space. 26 years and we still like each other.
With rent, utilities, gas prices (we travel 100 miles a day to work) it will be a lot cheaper to make a boat payment, slip fee and the other expenses. We don't have paid tv, cell phone, wallet full of credit cards, no health or life insurance. Most people would ask how do they survive? We have and are surviving. I am the sort that would carve a prop for the wind generator out of a 2x4 or rebuild the starter if need. What ever it takes I'll try to do. I'll find me a fix her upper and go from there as long as it not ready to sink. We can work on her as needed.

I would think for most it would be hard to make a liveaboard change and go cruising. Too use to the finer thing in life. I would also think that those that are living aboard on modest incomes are enjoying some of the finer points of life.



Just my humble thoughts

Lostmt. I do not really disagree with you, but the fact is, as we get older, there are certain creature comforts that we are just less willing to do without. In my thirties, we lived off the grid up in the mountains on very little. We hauled in our water. Heated water on the stove, used ice for refrigeration, and owned old Volkswagens that required daily repairs. That was after a divorce that took me from a nice home, $75000 a year income, and most of life's conveniences. At that time, I enjoyed the simplicity. As I got older, the water jugs got heavier, I got tired of working on the cars, and cold showers got really old. Can you do without? Sure, but the willingness to live life that hard is what changes.

[Lostmt]

Hi Nai Nui,
My point was that if I could and have lived that hard for 90% of my life then those that are worried about not having enough money to survive cruising could see that it is possible to do so just on SS. Ok you can say I have no experiences in this matter that is true. But I do know that one can live on a whole lot less. I would not wish a life like mine on anyone.

I would have no idea what it would be like to have a $75000.00 a year income and a nice home. I've never owned a home or much of anything else so if I buy a sailboat from eBay it would be home and I would do what every home owner does. Fix her up. If I have to bust my can to get the boat hauled out for some reason I'll do it.

What I am trying to say is that if it's your dream to liveaboard and cruise then go do it. Don't put it off until you feel you have enough money cause you never will. There will always be tomorrow and tomorrow never comes it's always today.

Go sail and enjoy life.
David

[RandyAbernethy]

If there is one thing that I have learned in preparing for our trip and interacting with folks here and in other places, it is that the world has within it people with every possible kind of means and perspective. There is no one plan that suits all yet everyone has the means to live a life at sea. What is irresponsible to one is happiness and bliss to another.

[Pblais]

Living aboard a boat is just a different house. What ever else it might be is really up to you. I don't think changing your house is enough all by itself. That seems to be the part you are left to work through however you like. It would be nice if you were happy but you might not be.

Lostmt, like I said, I do not disagree. The one point you make that is very important is that if you wait until everything is perfect, and the cruising kitty is exactly what you want, you will probably never go. On that point, I couldn't agree more.

I gave up on the idea of "budget" after having the boat for about a year... I just try not to look at the account.

Bob, It's only money. Isn't that what you big time media mogals say?

[exranger]

David, you are SOOO right! You'll never have enough. I used to make a whole lot more than I do now. And know what? Spent it. My lifestyle (my ex's, at least, lol) always grew with the income. Now, i concentrate on spending time with my kids, fixing my boat and, guess what? I make enough to live on and I am MUCH happier than before. I suspect a better person to be around, too!

[exranger]

Kai Nui, you are right about getting older and being less willing to rough it (kind of paraphrasing it here). We've had similar experiences. I think it's a matter of figuring out what IS a convenience to you, and what's just another toy. It's different for all of us, and that is what makes the budget question so hard to answer. I read the Lin and Larry Pardee's books and columns, and as I get older, the less I "cool" it seems to have no toilet in my boat, if you know what I mean!

[ssullivan]

We are still in our 30s (mid) and 20's. We actually pride our selves on the hardships we experience living aboard. The reward is health. Our philosophy is - why have a 12V windlass when we can just crank up the anchor on a manual windlass? We get exercise that way.

Also, we find that many people we meet when we go ashore now are weak and doughy. Even the "tough guys" you see with gym muscles. They are large, but couldn't lift up a heavy bag of potatoes.

We also notice how lazy and wasteful most citizens of the United States are. They have no harships, so they will never be prepared if there were to be one - say a terrorist attack, a global economic crisis, or something like that. They need warm showers with a million jets spraying, wasting 100's of gallons of water. They need to have lights on all night. They need to have everything comfy and cozy.

I know... I used to be like that too!

David is absolutely right. You can life up to a very ripe old age without many of the conveniences of modern life. In fact, you will probably live much longer.

[Dunkers]

I've had a pleasant few minutes reading the posts here. The points of view are very interesting and give lots of food for thought. I have to side to with David and Sean. As one post said we have to decide what we need and what we want. I have been away for a couple of weeks on our new boat and my wife and I were as happy as larks. My 13 year old stepson was happy enough but spent a great deal of time with all the electronics that he brought with him - portable DVD, PSP, CD and tape players etc. Once ashore we had to spend money which we didn't really want to just to keep him sweet (by the way this parenting lark is very new to me!).

My wife and I just wanted to go to pick up a mooring or anchor and listen to a play on the radio or even better read a book. Unfortunately we managed neither in the two weeks cruise. The boy just could not understand that silence can be enjoyed much more than the tinny sound coming out of his headphones. But that's a generational thing I suppose and I'm sure that at 13 I would have been the same if these gizmos had been around in those days.

Howsever, this illustrates the two extremes of the debate here. We are both in our mid to late 50's and wanted to enjoy the simple life but our boy would have none of it and needed entertainment all the time.

I spent two and a half years in the Caribbean living on first a 24 footer and then, luxury, a 29 footer. I was in my late 30's/early 40's when joints bent a little better than now! Despite the high price of almost everything, compared to UK or the US, it was possible to live on a small budget. I and other boats used to go to Venezuela two or three times a year to fill the boat to the gunn'ls with as much foodstuff because it was so cheap there. The main expense was attending the happy hours in the Boatyard bar in Prickly Bay, Grenada.

Basically those of us long term cruising were all careful with our money but managed to have a good time. Everyone looked after everyone else and shared our expertise when the inevitable problem occured. If someone came in who was really broke we could always find the price of a cold beer for them.

We have our plan for three years time to set off again but I do worry a lot about my stepson because he has no concept of a four week passage across the Pond and how he can keep himself amused. Still perhaps he will by then have learned to read a book rather than listen to one and realise the pleasure he has missed.

Sorry, I've realised that this is very disjointed and that I may be responsible for a sudden rise in the suicide rate!!

However, you can do the cruising you want on a limited budget if you stay out of expensive marinas, use an internet cafe to send an email rather than make expensive international calls and eat out only on a special occasion.