Annual Live Aboard Budget ?

[Soft Air]

Originally Posted by Allan S

Money wise, it is the instant gratification mentality that is the hardest to overcome. Change the way your mind works and you'll do fine.

We will apply this magnificent and enlightning philosophy for when we actualy begin cruising and hope that our asses don't get handed back to us in a sling...lol

Smart, very smart

[Cacique]

One of the most expensive things about owning a boat is paying someone else to do the work for you.

Thats why I try to de everything.

[Brent Swain]

Originally Posted by Cacique

One of the most expensive things about owning a boat is paying someone else to do the work for you.

Thats why I try to de everything.

That's like paying someone to have all your fun for you. A friend once said "I realized that I'm never happier than when I am working on my boat."
I find I get a lot more done in some peaceful, deserted anchorage with no distractions. And it's far more enjoyable.
Brent

[Soft Air]

I second Brent

I will be able to live in my boat in the San Blas Islands with just two hundred us a month yupi

[MoonlightShadow]

43ft boat. 20 years old. Initial cost $210,000. Boat on purchase in general good order.

Re-fit costs: Watermaker, New Genset, Sat phone TV gear, some rigging replacements and general wear and tare replacements/repair $45,000 (Budgeted - but still spending!).

Budgets (Annual): (Just me on the boat).

Berth/Slip/Moorings: $4,500
Insurances $2,600
Fuels $5,000
Food etc. $3,600
Maintenance $12,000
Misc. Shore supply $1,000 (Eg. Elec, Water, Waste disposal)
Statutory fees $1,000

Total budgeted annual costs: $29,700 (£20,000)

Sold/Selling previous small boat and all assets built up over life including House & children to buy and fit-out boat. Some of refit costs include work-related comms suite so can still do my normal job while away with reduced but continued salary which just covers budgeted costs.

Am I off target here?

I may need to reduce costs as I get older, as income from work is not guaranteed for ever.

[Hudson Force]

Since we've been living aboard a long time, since '72, we had times of more money and less; more crusing and less; more expenses and less. The question of the expense of living on a boat is no more definitive that to ask, "How much does it cost to live in a house?" Some can have conditions where they are in the "black" at 10k/year and others can be in debt at 100k/year. 'take care and joy, Aythya crew

[Brent Swain]

Originally Posted by MoonlightShadow

43ft boat. 20 years old. Initial cost $210,000. Boat on purchase in general good order.

Re-fit costs: Watermaker, New Genset, Sat phone TV gear, some rigging replacements and general wear and tare replacements/repair $45,000 (Budgeted - but still spending!).

Budgets (Annual): (Just me on the boat).

Berth/Slip/Moorings: $4,500
Insurances $2,600
Fuels $5,000
Food etc. $3,600
Maintenance $12,000
Misc. Shore supply $1,000 (Eg. Elec, Water, Waste disposal)
Statutory fees $1,000

Total budgeted annual costs: $29,700 (£20,000)

Sold/Selling previous small boat and all assets built up over life including House & children to buy and fit-out boat. Some of refit costs include work-related comms suite so can still do my normal job while away with reduced but continued salary which just covers budgeted costs.

Am I off target here?

I may need to reduce costs as I get older, as income from work is not guaranteed for ever.

Intereasting quotes
My current boat cost me $6,000 to get sailing and living aboard.
Moorage? Haven't paid it in 25 years .I anchor out.
Insurance ? Never bothered since launching my first boat.By the time I lost her in Fiji, I would have spent more on insurance than it cost to replace her.
Fuel? I drastically reduce fuel consumption by staying longer in each anchorage , waiting for fair winds and motorsail when it is too light. I average about $20 a month for fuel.
Food ? $3600 a year sounds reasonable , but can be reduced.. I hunt for my meat. Gave up canned goods and paying people to put it in cans for me years ago. Now I know what I am eating.
Maintenance? I spend considerably less than $100 a year on maintenance. I do all my own work . I have done two haulouts in 25 years , both in Tonga, where there wasn't enough tide to paint the bottom, and I had 5,000 miles , mostly to windward, to sail home.
Misc? I make my own electricity, dump my composter in the bush and have very little garbage, as I buy bulk. Garbage goes in litter barrels where I pay for it in the form of municipal taxes of local businesses, on anything I purchase in that particular town.
Statutory fees ? I don't have any at home and steer clear of places that charge to much offshore.
Yes, you can reduce your costs drastically.
Brent

[Sam Plan B]

I recently got reserved a slip in London for the winter of 2009/20010. The cost is about $600 per month. I have found this tends to be the general going rate for marinas anywhere with normal ammenities such as shower, laundry, electric and phone service.

You should add annual maintenance of 10% of your boat's value. In my case that would be $5,000. This is not only to keep your boat maintained in its present condition but would also cover the cost if insurance and miscelaneous government fees.

However, boaters do tend to want improvements. So add ann additional 10% for new toys. This could be an instrument upgrade, new cockpit coushins, etc. Again, in my case this would be $5,000.

$7,200 slip fees
5,000 maintenance
5,000 improvements
17,200 per year / 12 = 1,433 per month. I remember hearing that commercial fishing boats take 50% of the value of the catch for maintenance and upkeep. If that rule applies to cruisers, you would need about $3,000 per month in income from all sources to keep the lifestyle going.

[eric the viking]

So Brent, you are saying that we shouldn't ensure we have an equal annul income to what that 40 hour week is providing us, during the time we will be sailing?
You mean, we don't have to have a washer and dryer, and 5k watt inverter on board to run our entertainment center, and video games while we are sailing between marinas? Are you really saying that we can cruise on something less than a brand new Swan with $500k worth of extras?
Brent, I appreciate your breakdown of how you do it. The fact is, too many people are waiting until everthing is perfect. The upside to that logic is it provides many low priced lightly used boats for the rest of us.
Seem to me that being self sufficient, and creative from the day you buy or build the boat would be a benefit through the day you need to fashion a rudder at sea.

[Sam Plan B]

I am 58. There will come a time when I am not physically able to live the cruising life. I may go the way of Joshua Slocum. That is, have an incapicitating illness at sea, founder and drown. Or not.

A more forward thinking approach calls for planning for advanced age. Draining savings, mutual funds, CD's etc. to stay afloat doesn't seem like good seamanship. So, yes, one does need to have some kind of earnings to keep adding to the retirement kitty in anticipation of the day when we pass the sea bouy for the last time.

Some people write magazine stories. Some people write travel books. Some people have portable skills and move with the seasons. It doesn't take big money to keep going but it does take money.

[Cacique]

Hi Brent
I have read your post with interest how do you keep maintanance to under $100 a year? I have just spent $100 on a new battery (literally today) and will have to spend quite a bit cleaning off and antifouling very shortly. I am in the UK and it costs aprox about $50 just to dry out in the harbour between tides to clean off and antifoul, and the antifoul paint will cost about £75 which I guess is approx $120 US.
Anyone else have any comments on reducing anual costs?

[Extemporaneous]

Originally Posted by MoonlightShadow

Budgets (Annual): (Just me on the boat).

Berth/Slip/Moorings: $4,500
Insurances $2,600
Fuels $5,000
Food etc. $3,600
Maintenance $12,000
Misc. Shore supply $1,000 (Eg. Elec, Water, Waste disposal)
Statutory fees $1,000

Total budgeted annual costs: $29,700 (£20,000)

Am I off target here?

Opinions/Questions
Opinion based on NO real experience.
Questions based on curiosity.

"Berth/Slip/Moorings: $4,500" Sounds about right if you don't want to stay on the hook.
"Insurances $2,600" Okay.
"Fuels $5,000 " Is this a sailboat or a motor boat? Must be a motor boat.
"Food etc. $3,600" Okay.
"Maintenance $12,000" How would you possibly spend this Yearly?
"Misc. Shore supply $1,000 (Eg. Elec, Water, Waste disposal)" I'll buy that.
"Statutory fees $1,000" What is this?

I'm most interested in how your going to spend $12,000.00 a year, Every Year.

Best Regards,
Extemp.

[MoonlightShadow]

Originally Posted by Brent Swain

Intereasting quotes
My current boat cost me $6,000 to get sailing and living aboard.
Moorage? Haven't paid it in 25 years .I anchor out.
Insurance ? Never bothered since launching my first boat.By the time I lost her in Fiji, I would have spent more on insurance than it cost to replace her.
Fuel? I drastically reduce fuel consumption by staying longer in each anchorage , waiting for fair winds and motorsail when it is too light. I average about $20 a month for fuel.
Food ? $3600 a year sounds reasonable , but can be reduced.. I hunt for my meat. Gave up canned goods and paying people to put it in cans for me years ago. Now I know what I am eating.
Maintenance? I spend considerably less than $100 a year on maintenance. I do all my own work . I have done two haulouts in 25 years , both in Tonga, where there wasn't enough tide to paint the bottom, and I had 5,000 miles , mostly to windward, to sail home.
Misc? I make my own electricity, dump my composter in the bush and have very little garbage, as I buy bulk. Garbage goes in litter barrels where I pay for it in the form of municipal taxes of local businesses, on anything I purchase in that particular town.
Statutory fees ? I don't have any at home and steer clear of places that charge to much offshore.
Yes, you can reduce your costs drastically.
Brent

Thanks for that Brent. You cheer me up with stuff like that. I imagine however, that you are younger and fitter than I am. Hunting my own meat, for example, would be a bit problematic for me, as my native Englishians are a bit touchy about guns an stuff (don't want to make this a gun thread ). Seriously though, I wouldn't cut the insurance, as it gives me a peace of mind in many ways, knowing that if I lost the boat, I would at least be able to replace it with something. All the things I have worked for in my life are tied up in this boat. It was my dream from when I was a teenager. Sure, I could have left then, and probably had a better standard of life with a smaller cheaper boat without the gensets, dish-washer and stuff. But, like a fool, I married and settled down and had kids. Do I regret it? Well, possibly I do. But we make our own beds as they say.

My dream when I was younger was to tramp around the South Pacific. Now I am older though, realism suggests I may never get there, and not sure now If I even want to. I might - I have no itinery as such. But I have no urge to remove myself from my comfort zone now. Hence the trappings. Having said that, I have in the past, lived on a minimum budget, and probably could again if I had to. Not sure, however, that I choose to. I don't plan to travel from Marina to Marina, that's why I have tried to make the boat as self-sufficient as I can. But I have allowed funds for it just in case.

5,000 miles to windward - that fair boggles my mind! That's cool. Doubt I'll ever be able to say that, but ya never know.

I have just read through my post and it kinda looks like I am trying to justify myself. Thought provoking!

Clearly, I can cut my costs. You give me confidence in that direction. I'm happier now. But, do I need to remove myself from so-called "developed World" to do it, I wonder.

[MoonlightShadow]

Originally Posted by Extemporaneous

Opinions/Questions
Opinion based on NO real experience.
Questions based on curiosity.

"Berth/Slip/Moorings: $4,500" Sounds about right if you don't want to stay on the hook.
"Fuels $5,000 " Is this a sailboat or a motor boat? Must be a motor boat.
"Food etc. $3,600" Okay.
"Maintenance $12,000" How would you possibly spend this Yearly?
"Statutory fees $1,000" What is this?

I'm most interested in how your going to spend $12,000.00 a year, Every Year.

Best Regards,
Extemp.

Pilot House Sail boat. 90hp. Fuel here is $7 a gallon. Underpower burns 1.5/2 galls an hour. So that's about 14 gallons a week, to run main engine, 7.5kVa Genset, heating, cooking etc.

Statutory fees include Licences, annual Coding survey etc.

Maintenance: You will see many references on this and other sites, where annual maintenance costs are estimated at between 6 and 20% of vessel capital costs. I have estimated at the lower end of that scale, based on previous ownership costs. It's a 20 year old boat - things are gonna need fixing now and then. Some, I may be able to fix myself, others may be specialist jobs. If I earn say $18 an hour doing what I do for a living, and it takes me 10 hours to do a job that a yard can do in two hours at $35 an hour (for example), then the yard will get the job.

[eric the viking]

MoonLightShadow, nice post. I would place Brent in the catagory of mountain man of the sea. His accomplishments are attainable by some, but serve better as an example of what could be done, than of what the norm would be. Still, he has made some very good points. There are two that stand out. Do your own work on the boat, and you can be comfortable with less.
As difficult as it is sometimes to realize one's own limitations,, when planning an adventure, it is often more difficult to accept one's own abilities.