New fighting fire product

[crabcake]

Before I would even consider this product I would want to know; 1) the full chemical composition and, 2) its origin [not who/where the distributor was located, but the exact origin of manufacture] Also, has it undergone US/Canadian testing for safety (UL/CSA/EU)?

If this product does in fact come from China, I would point out their abysmal chemical safety record.

[Rustic Charm]

Originally Posted by crabcake

Before I would even consider this product I would want to know; 1) the full chemical composition and, 2) its origin [not who/where the distributor was located, but the exact origin of manufacture] Also, has it undergone US/Canadian testing for safety (UL/CSA/EU)?

If this product does in fact come from China, I would point out their abysmal chemical safety record.

I might point out that U.S./Canadian testing is not the only rigorous testing standards. The chemical composition would be available on any msds sheet. There is a tinge of ethnocentricism going on here I think.

[Rustic Charm]

http://www.fireknockout.com/download...4T_1.6_5.6.pdf

[Muckle Flugga]

Originally Posted by Rustic Charm

I might point out that U.S./Canadian testing is not the only rigorous testing standards. The chemical composition would be available on any msds sheet. There is a tinge of ethnocentricism going on here I think.

Look, definitely NOT this. There is nothing ethnocentric about knowing that a LOT of very dangerous, counterfeit, counterproductive and understandard products have come out of China recently. My boat was nearly burnt to the waterline last year because of a Chinese made dive light LI ION battery charger overcooking and blowing the battery up like a grenade in my saloon. Burned 7 deeply charred marks inches wide into the sole boards and woodwork in under five seconds and filled the boat with smoke and debris. Thing went off like a GRENADE. What stopped it? A mexican made CO2 operated swifly by yours truly. The video of the fire suppression device discussed here was actually vaguely reminiscent of the event itself. I know that if there is a fire aboard my vessel I will immediately take action to fight it, and I don't want something like this blowing up in my face in the process. Oh, and just so you know, I have also nearly been killed by a failed shackle blowing, Chinese "steel". The chandleries in Thailand and elsewhere are at pains to stress that their stainless isn't "316 C" (as in chinese) and these are usually owned and managed by ethnic Chinese! Several years ago Hammar, the world's leading manufacturer of hydrostatic liferaft releases was forced to put out an alert because there were useless counterfeits coming out of China which were all but indistinguishable from their main product, which had found their way into thousands of chandleries worldwide! The only way that they could be distinguished is by examination of the manufacturing injection marks in the thermoplastic.

So… ethnocentrism? Please.

[Rustic Charm]

Originally Posted by Muckle Flugga

Look, definitely NOT this. There is nothing ethnocentric about knowing that a LOT of very dangerous, counterfeit, counterproductive and understandard products have come out of China recently. My boat was nearly burnt to the waterline last year because of a Chinese made dive light LI ION battery charger overcooking and blowing the battery up like a grenade in my saloon. Burned 7 deeply charred marks inches wide into the sole boards and woodwork in under five seconds and filled the boat with smoke and debris. Thing went off like a GRENADE. What stopped it? A mexican made CO2 operated swifly by yours truly. The video of the fire suppression device discussed here was actually vaguely reminiscent of the event itself. I know that if there is a fire aboard my vessel I will immediately take action to fight it, and I don't want something like this blowing up in my face. Oh, and just so you know, I have also nearly been killed by a failed shackle blowing, Chinese "steel". The chandleries in Thailand and elsewhere are at pains to stress that their stainless isn't "316 C" (as in chinese) and these are usually owned and managed by ethnic Chinese! Several years ago Hammar, the world's leading manufacturer of hydrostatic liferaft releases was forced to put out an alert because there were useless counterfeits coming out of China which were all but indistinguishable from their main product, which had found their way into thousands of chandleries worldwide! The only way that they could be distinguished is by examination of the manufacturing injection marks in the thermoplastic.

So… ethnocentrism? Please.

So, your suggesting this product might be a counterfeit? Is that what your suggesting?

[Muckle Flugga]

Originally Posted by Rustic Charm

http://www.fireknockout.com/download...4T_1.6_5.6.pdf

From your linked document (I did not notice any certification board approval notes):

"Eye contact: Causes eye irritation due to ethylene glycol or propylene glycol content.

First-aid measures : Remove victim to fresh air and provide oxygen if breathing is difficult. Get medical attention.
Inhalation Indigestion:     Give one or two glasses of water and induce vomiting. Get medical attention.

Skin contact: Clean with water and soap.

Eye contact: Immediately flush eyes with plenty of water for at least 10 minutes while holding lids open. Get medical attention."

So causes severe eye irritation, at least. And is explosive. And refers to a person who comes in contact with its products as a "victim". I know for SURE I wouldn't want this going off in my face as I was trying to put out a fire on board by conventional (and proven effective) means.

[crabcake]

Originally Posted by Rustic Charm

I might point out that U.S./Canadian testing is not the only rigorous testing standards. The chemical composition would be available on any msds sheet. There is a tinge of ethnocentricism going on here I think.

Well, here is the most recent report of the continuing saga of issues with Chinese 'product safety' (also, you may remember their dry wall imports that sickened thousands of people). For my part, I was poisoned by their Heparine while awaiting a Triple Bypass a month before the FDA pulled it from the hospital shelves. Ethnocentricism? I think not - just read the news and you'll learn about their safety record!
--------------------------------
DRUGS.COM - WEDNESDAY July 8, 2015, 2015 -- Asbestos fibers have been found in crayons and other toys sold in the United States, according to a new report from an environmental health advocacy group.
The fibers were found in four brands of crayons and two children's crime-scene toy fingerprint kits, according to the EWG (Environmental Working Group) Action Fund report released Wednesday.
"We were surprised," said report co-author Sonya Lunder, a senior analyst with the Washington, D.C.-based group. "Crayons and crime-scene toys were found to have asbestos in years gone by, and the manufacturers of both had already promised to deal with the problem," she explained.
"All the products that tested positive were manufactured in China," said Lunder. "This makes it harder to follow the supply chain and enact and enforce pledges to have asbestos-free products."
Lunder said that contamination with asbestos, a known carcinogen, had been spotted in several types of crayons as far back as 2000 and in certain crime-scene toy kits in 2007.
Health experts and retailers expressed concern over the findings.
The U.S. National Institutes of Health (NIH) notes that asbestos, which is composed of long, thin mineral fibers, once was common in insulation material.
Though tiny and invisible to the naked eye, airborne asbestos fibers are easily inhaled. With time, scarring, inflammation and breathing impairment can occur, as can lung cancer and mesothelioma, a rare cancer of the lining of the lungs and abdomen, according to the NIH.
Asbestos is no longer widely used in manufacturing in the United States. It is banned in nearly all other developed nations, the research group said.
EWG said it purchased the crayons between February and May of this year at two national chains -- Party City and Dollar Tree -- in a suburban county near San Francisco. The group said it ordered the two crime scene toys through Amazon.com and Toys"R"Us.com.
EWG hired an independent company, Scientific Analytical Institute from Greensboro, N.C., to conduct so-called transmission electron microscopy tests to look for asbestos. This is said to be the most sensitive and accurate method of testing available.
In all, 28 crayon brands and 21 toy fingerprint kits were tested.
The contaminated crayons included Nickelodeon's Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles crayons, Disney's Mickey Mouse Clubhouse Jumbo Crayons and Saban's Power Rangers Super Megaforce Jumbo Crayons and ones by Amscan, according to the new report.
Asbestos was also found in two crime lab toys: EduScience's Deluxe Forensics Lab Kit, and Inside Intelligence's Secret Spy Kit, the report said.
All positive results were reconfirmed by a second independent lab, EWG said.
Testing revealed higher concentrations of asbestos in the crime-scene kits than in the crayons, the group said.
Lunder said that up to one million microscopic fibers of asbestos were found in just a single crayon or sample of crime-scene powder.
"Just a couple of fibers can lodge in your lungs and be there forever," Lunder said. "And there's very clear evidence that asbestos leads to two forms of cancer, and thousands and thousands of Americans have been killed by fiber exposure."
Former U.S. Assistant Surgeon General Richard Lemen welcomed the report.
"These are important findings, because asbestos is being placed in children's products," said Lemen, now an adjunct professor with Emory University's Rollins School of Public Health in Atlanta.
"Even if the absolute risk is relatively low, children are more vulnerable to toxic material and carcinogens," he said. "And because they are so young they have a longer latency in which to develop these diseases, which are known to be diseases that develop over time."
Another expert, Christopher Weis, agreed. "This is definitely not a frivolous or trivial concern," said Weis, a senior toxicologist and senior advisor with the U.S. National Institute of Environmental Health Sciences in Bethesda, Md.
"It's the policy of the Environmental Protection Agency and the Department of Health and Human Services that there is no safe level of exposure to asbestos," he added. "There are cases of individuals exposed to asbestos for very short periods of time who then went on to develop disease. And for kids that risk is almost certainly greater."
A spokeswoman for Toys "R" Us, which distributes the EduScience Deluxe Forensics Lab Kit, responded to the report, saying customer safety is the company's highest priority.
"We require that every product we carry meets or exceeds all applicable state and federal laws, industry standards, codes and requirements. At this time, we are reviewing the referenced report, along with supplier test reports, to ensure full compliance to our strict safety standards," Kathleen Waugh, vice president of corporate communications, said in a statement.

[Muckle Flugga]

Originally Posted by Rustic Charm

So, your suggesting this product might be a counterfeit? Is that what your suggesting?

No, I am suggesting that your suggestion of ethnocentrism is entirely incorrect and that the fairly sensible suspicion of Chinese made products is well founded based upon recent historical fact. By the way only one product I mentioned as an example was counterfeit. The other two, both of which nearly killed me, were bona fide, over the counter Chinese made garbage.

[Tailwheel]

Okay, got another one for y'all:

The Blazecut T-series.

Description | Blazecut

There's a video of it on YouTube suppressing a fire in the engine compartment of a VW Minivan.

Anyone know about it, or have it?

Matt

[crabcake]

Originally Posted by Tailwheel

Okay, got another one for y'all:

The Blazecut T-series.

Description | Blazecut

There's a video of it on YouTube suppressing a fire in the engine compartment of a VW Minivan.

Anyone know about it, or have it?

Matt

Looks interesting! - But the only fire safety appliances that I would consider would be that with a USCG or UL approved rating. Looks like their marketing hasn't reached Europe or the Americas yet.

[Tailwheel]

As far as I can tell, Blazecut is available in the US for $99 from jogrusa.com :

Blazecut Fire Suppression System - JOGR

Matt
(I have no association with Jogrusa or with Blazecut)

[Old Swampy]

No one has said anything about CG approval, or whether this product might destroy a diesel doing its dance.

[Paul L]

The product listed by the OP is Dutch.

[FamilyVan]

Originally Posted by Paul L

The product listed by the OP is Dutch.

And the OP is Australian, so USCG approval is probably not a high priority.

Sent from my XP7700 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[Russ]

CO2 Much better, cheaper, cylinder lasts forever (no pressure problems) and has the one same major draw back it is Oxygen depleting. So if fire isn't dead-dad it can restart. Clean up is zilch and I don t have to wait for the fire to get to it! That said I also carry three Purple K extinguishers as back up!!!!!!!!!!!
As with sooo much these days, I trust myself much more than automatic anything automatic, except maybe my autoloading pistol.

Russ