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Old 23-01-2016, 16:11   #91
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Re: Watermaker Myths

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If they put melamine in dog food as a filler which caused many pet deaths, I sure as heck wouldn't trust the water coming out of their product.
Don't forget the plastic rice . . . . . .

Tea; whiskey.

The best water I have ever had to brew tea, is from my own well. Miles and miles of thick pea gravel seams and sandstone before it gets to me. Yeah I could bottle it and sell it (but I am not a crook).

As for whiskey, the best water to add to whiskey I have come across, was from a local bottled springwater outfit (it went through seams of shale, about 15 miles to the East of me). It really grates that it was better for that than my well water (but it wasn't nearly so good for tea, so it's a 1:1 draw). It was so good in a single malt though, I'll forgive them.

I've pencilled in a watermaker for the 2017 boat upgrade budget (so fingers crossed, I will be back across the Pond and visiting Tellie, and also that a small watermaker more to my liking is available - I don't need much per day). Until then, I will be using my watertanks, chlorine, and a good water filter (and somebody suggested adding a few drops of real vanilla extract when the tanks are being filled, so I'll try that).

Plus, I am going to get a 50 pint a day dehumidifier. About 500 watts at 110v consumption. Mainly for use with shore power to get and keep things good while doing the boat up (get on top of any mold, condensation, etc). Then while afloat, I am going to use it as a sort of dump load when the batteries are topped off.

I'll probably put the collected runoff into blue 5 gallon kerosene jugs on deck to keep them separate (I won't have kerosene appliances, so none needed). I might do a dedicated water tank for it at some point. Add chlorine, kill the nasties, use it for showering, washing clothes, rinsing off the anchor and rode, rinsing sails, washing down the decks, that sort of thing. A big saving on water in the tanks.

I figure 'dump loading' from full charge (solar panels should top things up, and I'll be running the engine regularly as if I am running it in, to get it into better and better condition, plus the engine is a 30hp, so a 120 amp alternator might be a very good idea), I might well get a half gallon a day as a minimum. If the batteries aren't at full voltage, I won't turn the dehumidifier on. So easy peasy.

'If' I should get into a situation where water for drinking is getting dangerously low (tankage is 65 gallons, so not too bad single handed, and low risk imho), I'll put that water through the filter, and drink it.

Can't wait to get a watermaker though.
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Old 23-01-2016, 16:27   #92
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Re: Watermaker Myths

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I don't think a good watermaker will ever be inexpensive. I recently put one together from information gleaned from the internet. Predictably, the highest proportion of cost was the high pressure pump at just under a boat buck. Surprisingly, the next highest proportion of cost were the many s/s high pressure plumbing fittings. I don't see any reason for either of these things to come down in price. Shopping relentlessly and doing all the work myself over a period of months I spent somewhere between $3,500 and $3,800. Sure, you can do it cheaper, using inferior components, but if you do the unit will be failure-prone and you will find yourself waiting for parts in mananaland, hoping for rain.
The new Lockheed Martin membrane should totally change things. Won't need anything like the energy or pressures for it to filter.

But it is already overdue coming to market (probably supplying big desalination plants with exchange filters first, for massive reductions in running costs)..
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Old 23-01-2016, 16:56   #93
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Re: Watermaker Myths

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The new Lockheed Martin membrane should totally change things. Won't need anything like the energy or pressures for it to filter.

But it is already overdue coming to market (probably supplying big desalination plants with exchange filters first, for massive reductions in running costs)..
Reuters reported a 100X reduction in energy needed for Perforene relative to reverse osmosis, but Lockheed Martin are only claiming a 10-20% reduction. Commercial availability is not expected before 2020. I'm not expecting any significant change to the sort of pumps required. In my opinion, the best feature of Perforene that might turn out to be true is significantly reduced fouling, meaning that the membranes wouldn't have to be changed as often. I would not delay buying a water maker in the hope that Perforene will revolutionize anything.
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Old 07-02-2016, 09:59   #94
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Re: Watermaker Myths

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Tellie has the answer as always, home brew on board filters the nasties out during fermentation and provides a refreshing drink for all on board.
Beer! Beer! Beer! That is a good idea!
However, it is the boiling at the start of the process that kills the nasties, not the fermentation. The fermentation will only go as far as 18% alcohol content by volume and that is not even half of what you need to kill of bacteria/viruses. It is a common misconception that beer is safe because of the alcohol, but it is wrong ;-) Actually it makes sense; if brewing would kill germs, it would also kill the yeast doing the fermenting.
At about 16% to 18% the yeast actually die, so that is basically your upper limit, if you want a stiffer drink you have to distill it. There are more than enough pathogens that will survive that natural upper limit

on topic: I am very curious what the LM membrane will bring. Still saving for a nice watermaker, so lets see what the future will bring.
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Old 16-08-2016, 11:21   #95
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Re: Watermaker Myths

Would you drink the RO water if the tank was coated with generic epoxy, i.e without drinking water certification / approval?
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Old 16-08-2016, 11:37   #96
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Re: Watermaker Myths

I don't know what you mean. We have a molded in fiberglass tank approved for drinking water, I don't know of any problems. Our water tastes fine.
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Old 16-08-2016, 12:00   #97
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Re: Watermaker Myths

My watermaker water was my preferred drinkable water, including when land based. I just don't like water much, the exception being from the watermaker.
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Old 16-08-2016, 12:29   #98
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Re: Watermaker Myths

I have a watermaker but I still drink bottled water I bottle it myself from the test outlet when I'm running the WM

I like the bottles as I keep a couple chilled.

I should have cleaned out my water tanks after installing the WM this year, but never got around to it. I do have a filtered water tap and would be happy to use it to fill the water bottles but I find I'm just it the habit of filling when the WM is running
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Old 16-08-2016, 12:39   #99
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Re: Watermaker Myths

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Run through an inexpensive charcoal filter to eliminate the chlorine taste, our municipal water here in Whoville tastes great! Yet I see nearly everyone, including those on food stamps, buying shopping carts filled with bottled water. I even know of a couple of fools who only give their dogs and cats bottled water to drink. I'm sure as soon as they leave the house, their animals head right to the toilet for the "good stuff."

What a waste...
We sometimes give the pooch our spring water. We were both pretty convinced (my wife and I) by a filter salesman's spiel given to us about thirty years ago, about the testing that had been done on the local water supply. His assertion was that things like toxic metals and bacteria were removed by municipal water works readily, but that some pesticides, pharmaceuticals, and other industrial contaminants remained. His guarantee was that the filter he sold would catch what the water works missed.

Well, we just took it one step further, and now we buy spring water, which lies in aquifers for as long as thirty years. So, the spring water you buy today was rain five to thirty years ago, so lots of time to be filtered by nature in the aquifer. But, the ocean is probably a much cleaner source for pre-treated water than our river fed municipal supply ever was. So it's an apples and oranges comparison. I have no problem with watermaker water.

My guess is, the other people that buy the water have had similar things told to them, or read by them. In either case, people who just pump muni water, and don't filter it, are worse off than any watermaker (depending on where they live, of course).
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Old 16-08-2016, 13:09   #100
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Re: Watermaker Myths

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We sometimes give the pooch our spring water. We were both pretty convinced (my wife and I) by a filter salesman's spiel given to us about thirty years ago, about the testing that had been done on the local water supply. His assertion was that things like toxic metals and bacteria were removed by municipal water works readily, but that some pesticides, pharmaceuticals, and other industrial contaminants remained. His guarantee was that the filter he sold would catch what the water works missed.

Well, we just took it one step further, and now we buy spring water, which lies in aquifers for as long as thirty years. So, the spring water you buy today was rain five to thirty years ago, so lots of time to be filtered by nature in the aquifer. But, the ocean is probably a much cleaner source for pre-treated water than our river fed municipal supply ever was. So it's an apples and oranges comparison. I have no problem with watermaker water.

My guess is, the other people that buy the water have had similar things told to them, or read by them. In either case, people who just pump muni water, and don't filter it, are worse off than any watermaker (depending on where they live, of course).
... or a lot of time to accumulate pesticides...?
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Old 16-08-2016, 13:15   #101
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Re: Watermaker Myths

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... or a lot of time to accumulate pesticides...?
Teehee teehee. Well, you've got a point there. We select our suppliers so we think we've got that covered, but you can't ever be sure
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Old 16-08-2016, 13:22   #102
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Re: Watermaker Myths

Yeah, pesticide levels are reaching terrible levels. Many waters are dead zones now, due to their runoff into the rivers. The rivers distribute them into the delta salt water. many places mostly just jellyfish there. The bottom is dead. Just saw a special on this a while back. Not much lives in there unless it swims in and back out.
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Old 16-08-2016, 13:25   #103
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Re: Watermaker Myths

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Run through an inexpensive charcoal filter to eliminate the chlorine taste, our municipal water here in Whoville tastes great! Yet I see nearly everyone, including those on food stamps, buying shopping carts filled with bottled water. I even know of a couple of fools who only give their dogs and cats bottled water to drink. I'm sure as soon as they leave the house, their animals head right to the toilet for the "good stuff."

What a waste...
There you go, dropping politics into a perfectly lovely watermaker thread. I was told that's not allowed :-)
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Old 16-08-2016, 13:39   #104
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Re: Watermaker Myths

Funny thing is that up to 70%, if not higher, of the bottled water sold as "natural", "spring", etc. is actually unfiltered tap water. Look for the tiny print somewhere on the label which says "such and such town municipal supply".
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Old 16-08-2016, 15:29   #105
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Re: Watermaker Myths

I found out when I was a kid that drinking from a rainwater tank with a dead rat in the bottom was not unhealthy. The oldies living there never seemed to have health problems and reached their late 80's.
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