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Old 12-04-2009, 20:48   #31
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Exactly! Nor I am condoning the actions of the pirates.
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Old 12-04-2009, 20:55   #32
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Its funny, well armed groups of soldiers in formal armies invade countries on a regular basis in the world we live in, and it rarely draws the kinda posts i've read here. yet a few poorly armed "thugs" take the most extreme measures to survive, and they are branded as the evil of all evil. the expression....."a poor mans war is terrorism, a rich man's terrorism is war" might very well apply in this situation.

You have talked about naval blockades and other forms of military use to prevent this form happening.....more violence. Have we not learned in the last 8 years alone, that violence does not bring change or peace. Developing the economies of these countries so that they can produce a descent standard of living for their people is the only way that this kinda of activity will stop. Unfortunately it is clear that the world bank and the IMF have no interest in having a prosperous 3rd world. And this is clear to the people who live there, but unfortunately gets missed by us brainwashed westerners. So they see these ships steeling form them, and the toxic waste which regularly washes up on their shore, and they get desperate. Can't honestly say I'm surprised.

Seems like there are a lot of "Thugs" in the world. We in the west are good hearted people, we are just trying to do business. Nothing wrong with business is there. That never hurts anybody.
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Old 12-04-2009, 20:59   #33
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Originally Posted by captain58sailin View Post
I am going to preface this by saying " What the pirates did is wrong and I am in no way condoning their actions." However denigrating them and making them out to be lesser people, makes it easier for us to kill them with out our conscience, bothering us at night. It worked for the crusades in the middle east, it worked for Hitler with the Jews. It has worked for every country in the world that has declared war on another country, so justify the inhuman acts by making the enemy out to be a lesser human. Maybe we should think about what lengths we would all go to, in order to see our families fed, especially in a place where there is little or no hope of things getting better.
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Originally Posted by Christian Van H View Post
Opie, he didnt say that at all. He was describing ways in which leaders have lowered "enemys" in the eyes of their followers...creating the idea that its OK to think of another race or country as less than human. These pirates do not do this because it is fun and romantic...or easy. They do this partly because they can see no other way, THEY HAVE NO HOPE. Combine that with a rather foul upbringing, and, voila! instant pirate. You don't really believe they are that different, do you? Where does the money go? From the looks of the waterfront, they aren't redeveloping their Country...my guess is its going up a ladder towards the top echelon of what they have that passes for a government.
I am not saying that they had a great life and most of them are just trying to get by. I do not believe as humans that there is any difference between us and them. As with any society I am sure that 99% of the population are peace loving people, but it is the 1% you have to worry about. We have the FBI, police and many other law enforcement agencies to keep us safe from the 1% here. Since there is no real government there the 1% rules. We spend billions of dollars in that region of the world aiding the less fortunate. We sent our military there in the 90's to try to run the bad elements out. We as a nation did not have the stomach for it after our Blackhawks got shot down. So once again (as with Afghanistan) we left them in a pile of rubble. We need to stop this behavior as a country, either finish what we start or just don't do it at all. The saddest thing of all is most of these things start with good intentions, but you know the saying "The road to hell is paved with good intentions."

I still find it hard to believe that the pirates are out their trying to steal money to feed their kids. The people robbing these ships (for the most part) are thugs. (The 1% club)
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Old 12-04-2009, 21:10   #34
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Its funny, well armed groups of soldiers in formal armies invade countries on a regular basis in the world we live in, and it rarely draws the kinda posts i've read here. yet a few poorly armed "thugs" take the most extreme measures to survive, and they are branded as the evil of all evil. the expression....."a poor mans war is terrorism, a rich man's terrorism is war" might very well apply in this situation.

You have talked about naval blockades and other forms of military use to prevent this form happening.....more violence. Have we not learned in the last 8 years alone, that violence does not bring change or peace. Developing the economies of these countries so that they can produce a descent standard of living for their people is the only way that this kinda of activity will stop. Unfortunately it is clear that the world bank and the IMF have no interest in having a prosperous 3rd world. And this is clear to the people who live there, but unfortunately gets missed by us brainwashed westerners. So they see these ships steeling form them, and the toxic waste which regularly washes up on their shore, and they get desperate. Can't honestly say I'm surprised.

Seems like there are a lot of "Thugs" in the world. We in the west are good hearted people, we are just trying to do business. Nothing wrong with business is there. That never hurts anybody.
Wasn't the ship bringing relief supplies to Kenya?
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Old 12-04-2009, 21:16   #35
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Wasn't the ship bringing relief supplies to Kenya?
thats what I read. But I doubt they have access to cargo manifests so as to influence which vessel they are going to try to hijack.
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Old 12-04-2009, 21:41   #36
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Mr. Romberg, you are dead on. Ignore the naves.

I grow weary of the liberal “intellectual elite” (most of whom have never dealt with hardships greater than spilling their Starbucks lattes on their Birkenstocks) pontificating and spouting their “enlighten” progressive philosophy while demeaning those with common sense.

All I know is that this particular pirate situation was solved with less than $10 worth of .308 calibre boattail, rather than millions in ransom.
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Old 12-04-2009, 21:50   #37
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Time to close this thread...doncha think?

This is the same kind of drivel I see on other forums.

Time to scuttle this sucker.
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Old 12-04-2009, 21:54   #38
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Is that

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It has been said that why don't the army put some of there people on the boats , One end and pick them up when there safely through, You would only need 2 with a rail gun [Vulcan Gatling Gun] each side would be enough to stop any attack.

A few dead pirates would be enough to stop the attacks as they would be unsure what boat was armed and what was not

From what I understand now the insurance co.s are charging the ship owners a Levi for going through the straights so they are not worried as they are not losing any money and the pirates know this and from what I understand is the pirates are only asking for the Levi amount so they are not upseting the insurances Co's

Could be a good business to get into escorting boats through the straights


Regular fit or relaxed fit?
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Old 12-04-2009, 22:17   #39
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Chief,

It's related to boating, world cruising (French yacht seizure) and nobody's forcing you to read this.

Steve B.
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Old 12-04-2009, 22:28   #40
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Time to close this thread...doncha think?

This is the same kind of drivel I see on other forums.

Time to scuttle this sucker.
I agree. The US Navy and FBI handled the situation in a professional manner and rescued the brave Captain. Lesson learned for the pirates. End of story.
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Old 12-04-2009, 22:45   #41
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Good Job Seals!

It sounds to me like the US handled this one rather well. The pirates are dead, the crew and captain are all safe, and the ship is returned intact to the owners.

From press reports, President Obama gave the military on scene permission, well in advance, to use deadly force when and if they felt that to be the best course to save the captain's life. This is in marked contrast to some earlier administrations who felt like they needed to micromanage events from Washingtion. The negotiators seem to have won enough time, and achieved a favorable enough situation for the Seals to do their job with the best chance of keeping the captain alive. All the US military involved, especially the Navy Seals did a super job when it counted most.

There are far too many armchair experts on this thread who don't have a clue what's really involved in these situations. The results speak for themselves. I say congratulations on a job well done to all concerned!
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Old 12-04-2009, 22:52   #42
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Originally Posted by Chief Engineer View Post
Time to close this thread...doncha think?

This is the same kind of drivel I see on other forums.

Time to scuttle this sucker.
Why do you feel the need to control the content of the thread? If it isn't of interest to you, don't read it. Who gives a **** if "this is the same kind of drivel" you've seen on other forums? You ain't the only one using this forum. The rest of us still have something to say.
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Old 12-04-2009, 23:10   #43
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Uh oh, too many leaks... she's going down...
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Old 12-04-2009, 23:22   #44
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knaves or naves?

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Originally Posted by rover88 View Post
Mr. Romberg, you are dead on. Ignore the naves.

I grow weary of the liberal “intellectual elite” (most of whom have never dealt with hardships greater than spilling their Starbucks lattes on their Birkenstocks) pontificating and spouting their “enlighten” progressive philosophy while demeaning those with common sense.

All I know is that this particular pirate situation was solved with less than $10 worth of .308 calibre boattail, rather than millions in ransom.
nave
Noun
the hub of a wheel [Old English nafu, nafa]?
Perhaps you meant "knaves"
knave (nv)
n.
1. An unprincipled, crafty fellow.
2.
a. A male servant.
b. A man of humble birth

I for one have worked as a seafarer in and out of Somalia, shortly after the shooting died down after our invasion in the '90s, when the farmers could not grow crops in the fields for being shot down when they went to harvest. The fishers were allowed to go out 1 time in 3 weeks in dugout canoes with boards for paddles.
I have also been working the west coast of Africa for the last 8 years, in almost every country. Nigeria in particular. I have seen first hand the privation of the poor individuals, I have seen the aid ships tied to the docks, not being allowed to discharge their cargo so that the population would keep starving; so that the leaders could demand more aid, and then the food was being sold out the back door to line the powers that be, pockets.
Nigeria is the 8th largest oil producer in the world; yet the people are forced to live on top of garbage piles. They have no clean water, they have no way of getting rid of the sewage. Over a 1000 people have died in the last month from meningitis alone.
I personally don't care for Starbuck's the coffee isn't very good.
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Old 13-04-2009, 03:31   #45
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... I grow weary of the liberal “intellectual elite” (most of whom have never dealt with hardships greater than spilling their Starbucks lattes on their Birkenstocks) pontificating and spouting their “enlighten” progressive philosophy while demeaning those with common sense...
Disparaging or belittling the general world-view or philosophy of others is not debate; but mere mud-slinging, and juvenile name-calling. Neither does it display any common sense, nor common decency.

These sorts of insulting put-downs aren’t probative, and they’re certainly not “nice”.

The CruisersForum takes the "be nice" rule VERY seriously, and does not tolerate ANY rudeness.

For your edification:
http://www.cruisersforum.com/?page=rules
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