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Old 04-06-2011, 12:13   #31
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Re: Single handing overboard

Personal accountability is something we can all agree on. If I am foolish enough to allow myself to get into a situation that costs my life, so be it- that is a whole lot better than growing old wishing I had done something.

Since my goal is to do many many more "foolish" things before I leave this earth or get too old and have to act my age. I researched something that Boatman mentioned- waterproof autopilot remotes.

Garmin makes the GHC10 remote for thier GHP 10 autopilot. The device is water proof to IPX-7 standards. Experience with Garmin handheld GPS's has been that the devices are almost idiot and weather proof.

For those who are looking at a new auto-pilot, or those of us looking to get a boat, this could be a real option.

Bill
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Old 04-06-2011, 12:56   #32
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pirate Re: Single handing overboard

Quote:
Originally Posted by John A View Post
We must have some generational thing going on here about responsiblity..
I think that's it exactly. That need to have the Epirb/PLB/Satphone/ and all the rest. The point of the game is taking care of yourself, not endangering others.

My trailing line was my 7/16" #2 anchor rode of 200' with an auxilliary loop around the Autohelm. One day it got tripped. Pulling it in, I noticed the float and the loop had been bitten off. This wasn't mid-Pacific either. I was maybe 20 miles west of Key West on the way to Ft Jefferson. I mention that because on the way out I still had cold beer. I didn't see what it was, so in the spirit of mariners everywhere, let's say it was a 25' Great White Shark. I was in a 20' boat.

The bare bareboat charter couple: Rogue wave my butt. It was nice enough for them to be sunbathing on deck. Here's yer rogue wave story...
lemme git 'nother beersy weersy...
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Old 04-06-2011, 13:30   #33
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Re: Single handing overboard

I don't think there's any shame in using technology to minimize risk. It's not the 18th century anymore, and there is NO glory in dying young... Cruising is an activity suitable for Geriatric folks and Children. It's a LEISURE SPORT It's not like a bunch of cowboys out there risking their life for gold bullions and 'king and country' and all that jazz... Pushing that guilt trip onto new sailors is not a good thing in my opinion. (even though it's done in every single safety gear related thread on this website)

Being a new sailor myself, and not very old I'd say that I don't "need" any of it, but rather, I Enjoy using gadgets and technological marvels to my advantage wherever possible. If my GPS craps out, I'll be just fine. But there's no advantage to going without the GPS provided I'm not stupid enough to rely on it %100 of the time... It's the same with all other forms of technology.

Its also possible that the 'generational gap' that seems to exist with every new generation, is the result of learning from the old generations mistakes...

With that said
The remote controlled autopilot is pretty darn nice in respect to singehanded maneuvering. But it doesn't seem suitable for an overboard safety device.... you get 45' distance from the unit before it craps out (and that's probably an optimistic number).
So if you go over the rail at 5knts, that's about 4-5 seconds to hit the button...

A 100 foot rope trailing behind will give more like 12-15 seconds. A 200 foot rope, 30 seconds... a PLB, 24 hours...

1 onethousand, 2 onethousand...
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Old 04-06-2011, 13:59   #34
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Re: Single handing overboard

IIRC, with about half of the commercial fishermen that have been lost around here their boats have been found later in good condition with nobody aboard. Happens all the time. People speculate that it's mostly guys taking a leak over the side but since we don't have many female solo commercial fisherpersons we don't really have a control group to study.
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Old 04-06-2011, 14:12   #35
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Re: Single handing overboard

By all means come out cruising with whatever makes you comfortable.

Two observations from one who went cruising: At some point you're going to need to draw a line through the "want" list and just leave. But if you're sust doing local sailing seeing how many toys you can purchase, we aren't even on the same page. After the first 5 years EVERYTHING is subject to failure and the further you are from home the more expensive it will be to replace, and overtime replacement willbe more selective.

Consentrate more on avoiding disaster reather than planning for it. Try the bucket test I suggested and get back to me. Can you lift 200 lbs over your head for any length of time? Remember you'll need to pull that 200 lbs (wet clothes and all) through the water in excess of 5 knots to make it back to the boat.

Remember to retrieve the towed line before reverseing the boat or sailing in waters populated by other boats.
The line was cut by your prop.
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Old 04-06-2011, 14:15   #36
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Re: Single handing overboard

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Originally Posted by callmecrazy View Post
The remote controlled autopilot is pretty darn nice in respect to singehanded maneuvering. But it doesn't seem suitable for an overboard safety device.... you get 45' distance from the unit before it craps out (and that's probably an optimistic number).
So if you go over the rail at 5knts, that's about 4-5 seconds to hit the button...
Some of the autopilot remotes have a "deadman" feature, where if you go overboard and out of range the gizmo will kill the engine / head the boat into the wind, etc. I agree that needing to hit the "stop" button in the few seconds while you're overboard but still in range isn't too practical.

Also, thanks for adding some reasonable perspective to this discussion. I've been biting my tongue.
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Old 04-06-2011, 14:17   #37
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Originally Posted by callmecrazy View Post
1 onethousand, 2 onethousand...
That's funny, but it misses the point as you well know.

Anyway, I do hope the next RTW teenagers have to pay for the rescues.

Or how about when buying an emergency come-save-my-ass acoutrement, you have to put up, say, $100K deposit towards rescue?

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Old 04-06-2011, 14:20   #38
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Re: Single handing overboard

Just here in the SF Bay an empty boat was found and later a body who had been soloing. It definitely happens.
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Old 04-06-2011, 14:34   #39
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Re: Single handing overboard

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Just here in the SF Bay an empty boat was found and later a body who had been soloing. It definitely happens.
Was he towing a line?
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Old 04-06-2011, 14:57   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sww914
but since we don't have many female solo commercial fisherpersons we don't really have a control group to study.
ROFLMAO! Yet valid from a statistical viewpoint....
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Old 04-06-2011, 15:00   #41
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Re: Single handing overboard

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I think that's it exactly. That need to have the Epirb/PLB/Satphone/ and all the rest. The point of the game is taking care of yourself, not endangering others.
You seem to have a pretty well defined philosophy regarding rescue at sea. Would you ever accept assistance? What if you couldn't pay for it? Is there some level of experience, skill, and preparedness that you must meet, and then it becomes OK to ask for help? Is it ever appropriate to ask for help? Does it make a difference if you are at sea for business or for pleasure?

This isn't a dig at you -- I'm honestly interested in anyone's thinking on the subject.

I believe everyone here will agree that the Abby Sunderland adventure was an example of doing it wrong (Abby is the girl who was rescued in the southern ocean while attempting a record during the worst part of the year and being quite unprepared for it.)
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Old 04-06-2011, 15:16   #42
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Re: Single handing overboard

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.

Anyway, I do hope the next RTW teenagers have to pay for the rescues.

[/SIZE]
I'm not sure how the misfortunes of a teenage girl at the hands of her unscrupulous father have anything to do with this discussion....

There is a different teenager (out of what 6 or 7 of them now?) that is doing just fine as we speak, I'm pretty sure she has an epirb on board, but i'd wager my boat she won't be needing it.

On the other hand, this 67 year old solo sailor has been rescued twice in as many years trying to cross the atlantic... Generalizing teenagers as irresponsible just because they carry new technology only proves my point further. That point being, It's not the technology (or the lack of it) that causes peoples to need rescue. It's the person (or some misfortunate accident).


There was also another solo sailor who was prepping for extended cruising lost a few months ago in the Chesapeake, they just recently found him I think... His boat was found less than a mile away from the his Marina. And I should mention he was Australian, before that whole "american's" thing gets thrown into this pile.

John: I agree with you %100. Prevention... And I wouldn't want to be dangling from a rope getting dragged through the middle of the ocean like shark bait either But I think the rope attached to the tiller or some other form of cut-off position, is certainly a viable option (as demonstrated by that video I posted). 30 seconds is more than enough time to swim 3 feet to leeward to save your own life.
Personally I'll take being tethered in over anything else. If things get rough enough that I become worried about going over, then maybe I'll tow a line, just in case.

I only mean to point out that there is always more than one way to do things.
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Old 04-06-2011, 15:38   #43
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Re: Single handing overboard

Yep. Personnel choice and it depends.
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Old 04-06-2011, 15:45   #44
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Re: Single handing overboard

I vote for bondage.

The solo sailor who won't wear a harness is unlikely to have a remote control or EPIRB when s/he goes over. All gadgets will be in the locker just above the safety harness, tether and safety lines!
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Old 04-06-2011, 16:13   #45
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pirate Re: Single handing overboard

Regarding my mention of using a remote which has gathered much scorn....
If one looks back you will see I said... "IF the auto-pilot folk made/came up with a remote with a DECENT RANGE....."
I used to work a beach sports centre in Spain and we had Yamaha 750 Jet Bikes...
to stop folks doing a runner to the next bay and a friend waiting with a pick up we had them rigged with remote cut outs.... we could stop them dead nearly 1/2 a mile away... so though it sounds like I'm talking outa my ass... the technical stuff is out there... just needs customers asking for it... they'll make it...
As for falling over the side and grabbing a trailing rope... hitting that buttons gonna be a lot easier than hauling your Designer Foulie/PFD clad ass back to the boat...
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