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Old 09-02-2013, 09:58   #76
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Re: Piracy :-/

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Originally Posted by barnakiel View Post
Re and re the original quote by another poster: there are more than one way to get involved. Every cruising spot has its smaller or larger community of 'cruisers' who 'get involved'. Mostly buying drugs from locals. I say do not get involved with THEM nor with their suppliers.

Otherwise, if you help to build a school, fix a rusting genset, etc., then there is nothing to worry about.

Do get involved, in the right way though.

b.
Hmmmmm. Most cruisers are drug users, i.e. criminals?
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Old 09-02-2013, 10:03   #77
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Re: Piracy :-/

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Hmmmmm. Most cruisers are drug users, i.e. criminals?
I know what he means, why don't you?
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Old 09-02-2013, 10:22   #78
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Re: Piracy :-/

I agree with Barnakeil. Stay away from drug using cruisers.

Just to make the point clearer... if you use drugs stay away from me.


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Old 09-02-2013, 10:35   #79
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Re: Piracy :-/

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Originally Posted by Therapy View Post
Hmmmmm. Most cruisers are drug users, i.e. criminals?
Not sure where you got this from. I quote (from myself, how humble ;-): "...Every cruising spot has its smaller or larger community of 'cruisers' who 'get involved'. Mostly buying drugs from locals..."

Please note the " round cruisers.

In some places it is one bad apple, in other places there are small communities who do not cruise actually anymore but still live on their boats. Pretty indistinguishable, I guess, to any Johny come cruising lately, from the general sailing public. And they have the airs, you know, the stories and the looks, all so romantic, and so repetitive.

BTW users are not criminals in most legal orders. But they are a problem in any social order.

b.
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Old 09-02-2013, 10:37   #80
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pirate Re: Piracy :-/

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Originally Posted by MarkJ View Post
I agree with Barnakeil. Stay away from drug using cruisers.

Just to make the point clearer... if you use drugs stay away from me.


Mark
Ahh well.. thats me outa the 'Social Circle'...
Alcohol..
Caffine..
Nicotine..
Codine..
Might as well take up pot...
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Old 09-02-2013, 11:18   #81
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Re: Piracy :-/

Quote:
Originally Posted by barnakiel View Post
Not sure where you got this from. I quote (from myself, how humble ;-): "...Every cruising spot has its smaller or larger community of 'cruisers' who 'get involved'. Mostly buying drugs from locals..."

Please note the " round cruisers.

In some places it is one bad apple, in other places there are small communities who do not cruise actually anymore but still live on their boats. Pretty indistinguishable, I guess, to any Johny come cruising lately, from the general sailing public. And they have the airs, you know, the stories and the looks, all so romantic, and so repetitive.

BTW users are not criminals in most legal orders. But they are a problem in any social order.

b.
Sorry,
I read it as most buy drugs from locals.....
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Old 09-02-2013, 11:28   #82
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Re: Piracy :-/

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Originally Posted by boatman61 View Post
Ahh well.. thats me outa the 'Social Circle'...
Alcohol..
Caffine..
Nicotine..
Codine..
Might as well take up pot...
Dont be a dick. You know exactly what I mean.


Mark
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Old 09-02-2013, 11:42   #83
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Re: Piracy :-/

Quote:
Originally Posted by boatman61 View Post
Ahh well.. thats me outa the 'Social Circle'...
Alcohol..
Caffine..
Nicotine..
Codine..
Might as well take up pot...
Yes but you are at the pirate side of this thread so should cower behind your lifelines with cutlass and all after reading about the anti-piracy measures discussed here har har!!
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Old 15-02-2013, 10:54   #84
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Why not a shot gun loaded with RUBBER buckshot. It's enough to get anyone to cry uncle and you can even use it when crew is in hostage situation. Yes crew will not like you but will save your life.

I keep my shotgun tactical loaded with three rounds of rubber then lead. First three to separate and mitigate and if threat is still aggressive then use lead buckshot. You make it more than clear your first intent was to use non lethal rounds and only went to lethal after the fact.

Or you can keep a pistol and shot gun and keep shotgun full of rubber only if tactical loading isn't your thing.

But rubber less than lethal ammo is a great way to defuse a situation where there is a high risk of collateral damage.
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Old 15-02-2013, 11:03   #85
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Re: Piracy :-/

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I keep my shotgun tactical loaded with three rounds of rubber then lead. First three to separate and mitigate and if threat is still aggressive then use lead buckshot. You make it more than clear your first intent was to use non lethal rounds and only went to lethal after the fact.

Or you can keep a pistol and shot gun and keep shotgun full of rubber only if tactical loading isn't your thing.
This talk is straight out of "Guns and Ammo" , I mean "seperate and mitigate"

Firstly you have to acquire a rubber load, which in many places/countries is either impossible to get or reserved for law enforcement. Not to mention the ensuing paperwork.

"Then use lead buckshot" , I suspect unless you have presence of mind and can tell the future youd have the exact amount of rubber in the pump, followed by the lead, of course a miscount , results in fatalies. Reloading under pressure of course is nonsense.

Anyway a shotgun is good close in, but in practice its an unwieldy fireaboard a small vessel and one that cant be used in a small area where friends and foe could be mixed up. Over longer distances it rapidly becomes a less then useful firearm

how this would help in the face of several AK47s I dont know.
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Old 15-02-2013, 11:19   #86
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Re: Piracy :-/

I think I'm going to look into a surplus battleship .......................... to protect myself from other cruisers
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Old 15-02-2013, 11:28   #87
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Rubber buck shot is widely available here in the states over the counter legally. Separate and mitigate is a lot easier than saying "ok I put these bad people in pain and give my crew a change to get away and if bad people are still a threat then deal with them".

My point with rubber buck shot is to use against them as they try to come aboard. You may want to take your chances with the "give them what they want and they will go quietly" approach, but it's becoming more common for them to kill or harm the crew and scuttle the boat. Or if they think you have money try and hold you hostage.

But the separate and mitigate action was one of the first things I learned as a law enforcement officer. If you are serious about protecting yourself with firearms then spend some money and take a few classes. After practicing a bit in a controlled situation you would be amazed at how quickly you will without having to think about it.

It wasn't that long ago pirates killed those four cruisers who tried to peacefully give them what they wanted. The issue is before no one kicked up a lot of dust when it was just let then take your stuff and they left. But now the law enforcement entities are after them so witnesses are something they don't want.
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Old 15-02-2013, 11:29   #88
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Re: Piracy :-/

Aw, now look what you've done...a new arms race. I'll see your BB and raise you an SSN. They have sails! Should be some bargains on the mil surplus market soon with all the defence cuts.

p.s. forget the rubber bullets, and leave the hostage rescue stuff to the pros. Otherwise you'll get someone you love killed. Don't let it get that far...
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Old 15-02-2013, 11:40   #89
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Re: Piracy :-/

Visit exotic locations. Meet the loacls. And kill them.

If you just cruise only in the countires where its legal to buy or posses rubber bullets thats fine. The rest of the world will be safe
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Old 15-02-2013, 11:44   #90
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Re: Piracy :-/

Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaBuffalo View Post
Rubber buck shot is widely available here in the states over the counter legally. Separate and mitigate is a lot easier than saying "ok I put these bad people in pain and give my crew a change to get away and if bad people are still a threat then deal with them".

My point with rubber buck shot is to use against them as they try to come aboard. You may want to take your chances with the "give them what they want and they will go quietly" approach, but it's becoming more common for them to kill or harm the crew and scuttle the boat. Or if they think you have money try and hold you hostage.

But the separate and mitigate action was one of the first things I learned as a law enforcement officer. If you are serious about protecting yourself with firearms then spend some money and take a few classes. After practicing a bit in a controlled situation you would be amazed at how quickly you will without having to think about it.

It wasn't that long ago pirates killed those four cruisers who tried to peacefully give them what they wanted. The issue is before no one kicked up a lot of dust when it was just let then take your stuff and they left. But now the law enforcement entities are after them so witnesses are something they don't want.
A debate, using what is available in the US is ridiculous, a 9mm Glock is a far better useful weapon aboard in the US, why bother with a cumbersome shotgun.

Also as far as I know the only pirates in the US are legal

The debate has to focus on what is practical outside of the US and in many jurisdictions all these solutions involving firearms are very problematic, so problematic as to be rendered moot.

Thats leaving aside the value of untrained prople using firearms in the first place.

Assuming you cant carry exotic ammo , or large calibre semi autos, you have two problems

(a) How do you prevent hostiles from approaching

(b) How do you engage in defensive activities when they are aboard and what is practical

(c) How do you wake up first - anyway.


Quote:
It wasn't that long ago pirates killed those four cruisers who tried to peacefully give them what they wanted. The issue is before no one kicked up a lot of dust when it was just let then take your stuff and they left. But now the law enforcement entities are after them so witnesses are something they don't want.
to which pirate activity are you referring here. if its the four US on a boat with bibles, the main reason they are dead is there was a shoot out with US special forces. ( which is the reason the french guy was killed too, when the french engaged and is the reason the UK forces will NOT engage if the yacht has already been taken)

Dave
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