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Old 11-03-2013, 15:06   #16
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Re: Illegally Discharging Waste in FL

You think its bad in Florida ! I Have done 2,807 surveys in the Great Lakes and my stats show 60% of sailboats had open and operable overboard discharge systems and about 3% of powerboats. You may have a black water discharge system in the Great Lakes but it must be physically separated from the discharge valve or subect to vessel seizure and a $100,000 fine. I believe the US states on the Great lakes apply the same law as per a memorandum of agreement from the Great Lakes Joint Commission.

Unfortunately I have never heard of the law being enforced.

I am wintering in a small harbour on Lake Ontario and there are three powerboats and two sailboats. Two of us built a portable pumpout wagon and use it weekly. The other powerboat and neither sailboat has pumped out since last October.
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Old 11-03-2013, 15:20   #17
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Re: Illegally Discharging Waste in FL

"The other powerboat and neither sailboat has pumped out since last October. "
Special AirHead WaterWorld Edition, complete with tomato plant seeds.
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Old 11-03-2013, 16:58   #18
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Re: Illegally Discharging Waste in FL

Welcome to the real world. Maybe I inhabit a world of nasty, environment despoiling faecal bandits, but direct pump out seems to be the way it is, even if most people are scared to admit it.
Some laws are very hard to police, this is one of them.

Regards,
Richard.(Now hunkered down in preparation for vitriolic condemnation from poo-nazis!!)
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Old 11-03-2013, 18:07   #19
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Re: Illegally Discharging Waste in FL

I was told from a crusier that george town is the worst place.......there would be no swimming at anchor and he even dreaded putting his feet into the water as he got out for his dingy to go to shore....he even went to the extent of not using his foot pump to rinse off the dishes......its seems pump outs dont happen at anchor...

for me its simple at the moment.....fill up the fuel and get a pumpout....but we are not out for long periods...........however my grey water goes overboard...as far as I am aware this is legal....
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:02   #20
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Re: Illegally Discharging Waste in FL

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Originally Posted by jmackay View Post
There is no excuse, go three miles offshore and pump it out. Our head goes into the holding tank and that needs to be pumped out either at a pump out station or overboard by hand. No way for an unintentional discharge.

THAT IS UTTER NONSENSE!!!

Go three miles out, DO YOU REALLY KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT???

Here in Massachusetts, the three mile starting point begins on the shores of our off shore islands, 15+ miles from the main land. The whackies lobby legislators to pass no-discharge areas which in turn get approved by the Department of Interior. Of course the states fail to provide adequate pump out, rule against on-board waste processing and expect all good citizens to obey their crazy regulations. In the mean time the local towns and cities pump at will when ever the need arises such as after a rain storm.

Its not only waste discharge the crazies get after, Boston used to dump truck loads of snow into the harbor. NO MORE! At one time they even had a snow melting machine that melted the snow just to get rid of it. NOw that really is nonsense. But it is OK to store the snow next to the water where it will melt and where does it go?

Toooo many DAMNED REGULATIONS!!! I still think the best place to stuff an environmentalist is into my filled holding tank!
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:42   #21
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Re: Illegally Discharging Waste in FL

how much raw sewage does the city of key west pump into the ocean?

According to the EPA reports (and available through the Florida Keys National Marine Sanctuary), boats account for less than 1.5% of all Keys water pollutants. All of the rest is from shore side sources, including the 7 million gallons per day of "almost raw" sewage that Key West pumps in the water about 100 yards off the beaches.

Dont take me to task about my one little turd a day......

The city needs to take care of its problems before it points a finger at me....just saying
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:26   #22
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Re: Illegally Discharging Waste in FL

16 years on Lake Michigan and my second fear, after sinking, is I haven't broken pump over
capablity enough to satisfy the CG! Especially I live in fear of a Canadian inspection. I only know of the bucket over the stern during the Chicago-Mac race after the holding tank was full. Not saying that might happen more often than you think.
Boatpoker I applauded you & your friend for doing the right thing! The other boaters won't be friends if you report them but friends like that you don't need!
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:50   #23
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Re: Illegally Discharging Waste in FL

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Originally Posted by Navicula View Post
For me its simple at the moment.....fill up the fuel and get a pumpout....but we are not out for long periods...........however my grey water goes overboard...as far as I am aware this is legal....
Same for me and I thought/hoped that this is the norm ... apparently not.

On the other hand, the City of Kingston, Ontario discharges their untreated overflow directly into the river whenever there is a bigger rainfall ... go figure!
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Old 11-03-2013, 21:08   #24
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Re: Illegally Discharging Waste in FL

not sure why the electro san isn't allowed in ndz's. the output is probably as safe or safer than what typical waste treatment plants dump in the icw or nearby offshore. but it's easy for the politico's to pick on boaties because, as all the land sharks know, we're rich.
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Old 11-03-2013, 22:23   #25
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Re: Illegally Discharging Waste in FL

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Old 11-03-2013, 22:40   #26
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Re: Illegally Discharging Waste in FL

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Originally Posted by boden36 View Post
Welcome to the real world. Maybe I inhabit a world of nasty, environment despoiling faecal bandits, but direct pump out seems to be the way it is, even if most people are scared to admit it.
Some laws are very hard to police, this is one of them.

Regards,
Richard.(Now hunkered down in preparation for vitriolic condemnation from poo-nazis!!)
When fastbttms finds this thread he is gonna freak out completely



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Old 11-03-2013, 23:07   #27
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Re: Illegally Discharging Waste in FL

The Poo-Nazi's have gone way crazy in the Great Lakes--Locking out the overboard discharge valve is good enough for the rest of the country, but they want to go greener. Now the price of a pumpout goes up every year--last year they wanted $20-25 for 20 gallons. For that, its worth putting in a section of hose with quick disconnects to meet the letter of the regulations
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Old 12-03-2013, 07:55   #28
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Re: Illegally Discharging Waste in FL

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When fastbttms finds this thread he is gonna freak out completely
No, I won't. Not much fun engaging in a battle of wits with unarmed opponents.
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Old 12-03-2013, 08:44   #29
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Re: Illegally Discharging Waste in FL

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The city needs to take care of its problems before it points a finger at me....just saying
Yes, they should. But then the city isn't going to be fined $10k and have their boat confiscated if they get caught without a proper MSD. You very well may.

I think the sanitation laws are pretty ridiculous. It is perfectly legal for me to stand on the back of my boat and pee directly into the water, but illegal for me to pee into a cup and then dump the cup into the water. How stupid is that?

But I don't want hefty fines and I CERTAINLY don't want to see my boat confiscated, so I obey the laws. It is inconvenient, and sometimes a bit costly. It would be a lot more inconvenient and costly to have the Coast Guard impound my boat.
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Old 12-03-2013, 09:10   #30
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Re: Illegally Discharging Waste in FL

onestep-
"not sure why the electro san isn't allowed in ndz's."
That's easy. Because the laws are written by and for the average idiot, and they have to be kept SIMPLE. ndz means NO discharge, NO debate over what it is, NO debate about how clean it might be. Which is why we sometimes ask "Which half of NO don't you understand? The N or the O ? " Even when it is that simple, there are many folks who just can't figure it out. A truly clever sailor will find a way to bottle it and sell it.<G>

d0n-
"But then the city isn't going to be fined $10k and have their boat confiscated if they get caught without a proper MSD" Oh, you never know. Onceuponatime I happened to meet a uniformed officer who I knew, in the parking lot of a building. I was coming in, he was going out, we were both parked or parking. And a new outside man had been put in charge of his department, and was changing all the informal tolerance that had worked so well for so long to "by the book" for everyone.
So I asked the man, isn't that one of your cars, parked in the no parking zone, with no red lights on? And he moaned, literally, and said yes, it was the chief's car and please don't do that to him, because he knew the chief had made a big deal out of "no red light, no emergency, no privileges". I said OK, but the car is parked in a no parking zone, with no red lights, not on call, so you have to ticket it. And if you don't write it up, I have to cite you for misfeasance for failing to do so, don't I?
He smiled a big smile and said yes, he certainly did have to write it up, there was nothing he could do about that because he couldn't risk that misfeasance charge.
Of course we both knew the chief would be pissed, and he'd have the ticket dismissed (maybe) after he had to make an appearance for that. But yes, he was quite happy to write it up.

You may not win friends, you may start a war, but yes, with a little careful dancing I'd bet you CAN get a "city" boat written up for violations, and with a little spin from the local nooze, use that to demonstrate just how arbitrary local enforcement is, and how ridiculous the whole topic is.

Last night our Mayor Bloomberg made an ass of himself on the Letterman Show, insisting that his stalled ban on large sugared drinks wasn't a ban, it was "just portion control". Ahuh. I can buy ten 16-oz drinks but not one 32-ounce drink. Sounds more like a penalty on math skills than portion control. These people need to be stopped. All of them.
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