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Old 24-12-2010, 18:56   #16
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Originally Posted by Tampabayfireman View Post
Just a reminder to those that dont understand, that there is a big difference between hookah regulator and a dive tank regulator.
I know many divers that use off-the-shelf 2nd stage scuba regs with their hookahs, and they work fine. I'm not saying that every scuba reg will work fine in a hookah rig, but plenty do.
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Old 24-12-2010, 20:36   #17
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What are brand names of oilless comprssors?
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Old 24-12-2010, 21:12   #18
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Is the Thomas 1020 still the one?
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Old 24-12-2010, 21:23   #19
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Is the Thomas 1020 still the one?
It is. Unfortunately, they are rarer thans hen's teeth. Thomas has not produced any 1020s (or any other model from the Air-Pac line) since they moved their production facility from Wisconsin to Louisiana last year. Nobody has any and nobody knows when they will get any.

You can still find gas-powered hookahs using Thomas compressors, if you want to go that route. I like the Air Line hookahs:

Air Line Diving System | The Air Line by J. Sink
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Old 26-12-2010, 07:20   #20
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Actually it's a 12 volt system. I use a 100 watt converter and a marine battery powering a 3/4 horse compressor with a partical filter. I use a trolling motor to get to my destination, I've been under water for as much as 6 hours and only used 25% of the battery's power. The system only cost me $400.00 to build. I use it to treasure hunt the beaches around my house. it paid for itself the first day.

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I think there must be a "typo" in that number. 746 watts equals one HP, so 3/4 HP would be need somewhere near 600 watts plus conversion losses, etc.
- -
Hookah's I have seen come in 3 "flavors" - the new rotary DC little motor with a "sort of" hospital one inch plastic and wire ventilator hose with continuous flow - good for up to 10 feet or so. Very inexpensive and good for bottom cleaning.
- - Converted SCUBA systems with the long air-breathing quality hose replacing the usual 2 ft SCUBA hose. You use our SCUBA tank as the air source.
- - Electrical/gasoline compressors (like Brownie's) with a flotation ring/buoy and one or more hoses and 2nd stage mouthpieces. These are the most versatile, but also the most expensive.
- - Home-made versions of the above are certainly most probably cheaper to make - but be sure to use "oil-less" compressors rated for human- breathable air. Plus filters and all the other bells and whistles to keep from destroying your lungs.
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Old 26-12-2010, 07:52   #21
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FB

How about one of these as an alternative to the 1020:

Compressors - HP-1000 - 115V | GD-Thomas

Compressors - HP-1050 - 115V | GD-Thomas
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Old 26-12-2010, 10:43   #22
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FB

How about one of these as an alternative to the 1020:

Compressors - HP-1000 - 115V | GD-Thomas

Compressors - HP-1050 - 115V | GD-Thomas
While it looks like the air delivery specs would work, these compressors weigh about 75 pounds, making them almost 4 times heavier than the 1020. They are not designed to be portable. And while I can't find a price on either of these two models, my guess is that they are pretty expensive as well.

There are many compressors capable of doing the job, but not all of them are conducive to doing it easily or economically.
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Old 26-12-2010, 12:33   #23
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75lbs! didn't catch that. Oh well.

Somebody else has to be making a decent alternative
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Old 26-12-2010, 14:20   #24
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Might want to check that figure..... I know it's been a lot of years since I went to Paramedic School, but I thought the average minute volume for a 75kg male was 5-8 lpm!
This number is not right. Divers usually use about 12 to 18 liters of air per minute at the surface. At 10 meters depth, the pressure is twice the surface pressure, so twice the amount of air is used. At 20 meters of depth, three times the surface amount is used. The 30 liters per minute number at the surface could be true for a scared beginner.

Another thing: first stage regulators for diving are generally set for 8 to 10 bars above ambient pressure (120 to 150 psi). Second stages will generally work fine within this pressure range. Thus, setting the pressure to 11 bars absolute will give you 10 bars above ambient at the surface and 8 bars above ambient at 20 meters. That should be enough of a range for a hookah rig. So a scuba second stage regulator should be fine for hookah.
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Old 26-12-2010, 15:14   #25
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I bought a few compressors in my quest to find the perfect one. Finally found one that has aluminum tanks (no rust) and sufficient power only $139:

http://www.canadiantire.ca/AST/brows....jsp?locale=en

I also got the Brownie 60' hose and regulator. Works great.

Oh and its quite light, not sure exactly but probably 30lbs.
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Old 26-12-2010, 16:31   #26
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Might want to check that figure..... I know it's been a lot of years since I went to Paramedic School, but I thought the average minute volume for a 75kg male was 5-8 lpm!
Figure is based on 25 years of diving experience as a diving supervisor.

A novice diver will use 30 LPM and can rise to 50 LPM if working hard. At the other extreme I use about 16 LPM in the middle of the season when the water is warmer, I am relaxed and not having to work hard. One of my dive buddies is a size 8 and she uses 10 LPM but then she is a nurse who works in a hyperbaric chamber. This is in full dry suits wearing twin sets.

The volume of the average males lungs is about 6 litres and the normal breathing range for light exercise is 4.5 litres which is what your thinking of.

A hookah diver or someone unused to diving will be using about 30 LPM when scrubbing a hull or changing a prop/anode etc. Whilst depth does change the volume of air consumed for example at 10 metres our novice diver would use 60 LPM, if you are working on the hull the depth is shallow enough to really affect the calculations.

One thing I will mention for those using hookah, please don't hold your breath particularly when coming up. The increase in volume as the air expands inside your lungs is sufficient to cause a burst lung. You must breath out on the way up. Please no excuses, you must breath out. I don't like visiting folk in hospitals or hearing about trips to them.

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Old 28-12-2010, 00:10   #27
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Originally Posted by fstbttms View Post
It is. Unfortunately, they are rarer thans hen's teeth. Thomas has not produced any 1020s (or any other model from the Air-Pac line) since they moved their production facility from Wisconsin to Louisiana last year. Nobody has any and nobody knows when they will get any.

You can still find gas-powered hookahs using Thomas compressors, if you want to go that route. I like the Air Line hookahs:

Air Line Diving System | The Air Line by J. Sink

I have a SIP Hobbyair 210 oil less compressor, 20 meters of Barflow breathing hose and a hookah regulator. The hose was the dearest component at $100. The only concern I have is the air temperature at the compressor end. I'm considering using a metre or so of copper pipe coiled up in the airflow before the breathing hose to air cool the air somewhat. I notice on the so called "bought" units they use either a metre or so of black hose or stainless steel coated hose before the yellow breathing hose. How safe is this?

This is the compressor http://common.leocom.jp/datasheets/215627_103759.pdf

If your considering one of the bought units have a read of this.
DIVE SYSTEMS OWNERS FORUM == SHARE YOUR PROBLEMS AND EXPERIENCES =============================================
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Old 28-12-2010, 07:52   #28
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The only concern I have is the air temperature at the compressor end. I'm considering using a metre or so of copper pipe coiled up in the airflow before the breathing hose to air cool the air somewhat. I notice on the so called "bought" units they use either a metre or so of black hose or stainless steel coated hose before the yellow breathing hose. How safe is this?
The only reason that hookahs often incorporate a length of heat-dissipation hose is that the high temperatures at the compressor end of things will eventually dry and crack the breathing hose where it attaches to the compressor. There is no health risk involved. I wouldn't use copper pipe as copper conducts heat very well and will likely dry and crack your breathing hose just as if it were connected directly to the compressor. Not to mention you now have an additional piece of very hot metal to worry about.
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Old 28-12-2010, 13:26   #29
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The only reason that hookahs often incorporate a length of heat-dissipation hose is that the high temperatures at the compressor end of things will eventually dry and crack the breathing hose where it attaches to the compressor. There is no health risk involved. I wouldn't use copper pipe as copper conducts heat very well and will likely dry and crack your breathing hose just as if it were connected directly to the compressor. Not to mention you now have an additional piece of very hot metal to worry about.
I would have thought because copper conducts heat well it would also dissipate well and be cool enough by the time it reaches the yellow expensive stuff. I am concerned that the black stuff the bought crowd use could be bad for your health. I'm open to suggestions and appreciate your advice. The commercial units assembled here use SS tubular frames as air tanks which are connected by flexible ss hose to the compressor.
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Old 28-12-2010, 13:44   #30
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Commercial-grade breathing hose is always black. The yellow stuff is the cheap, stiff stuff frequently used in recreational gear. Either are safe to breath through. You want to stay away from pneumatic tool hose.

Mild steel reserve tanks are not suitable for use in a marine environment. Reserve tanks should always be plastic, stainless or non-existant.
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