Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 06-09-2012, 16:10   #346
Registered User
 
Travelnik's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Nanny State
Boat: 22' Westerly Nomad
Posts: 593
Re: Honduras: Sailing Boat Boarded and Robbed by Pirates

Quote:
Originally Posted by goboatingnow View Post
While Its a good laugh and a joke. It would be wrong to encourage anyone to carry aboard illegal or potentially illegal firearms or devices that resemble them including homemade. Such actions can result in severe penalties in many countries.

Dave
True, so on a serious note...

There has been talk of all kinds of silly things, medieval weapons. light sabers, etc.

But what about real defense items? What is really allowable everywhere?

Spear guns are not legal in some places, so that's out. How big of a knife could you have on board before the officials decided that it wasn't a kitchen knife?

Are machetes allowed, or would most officials see them as weapons instead of coconut choppers?

There are things like big hammers and crow bars/pry bars, big screwdrivers and legitimate tools like that.

What other legal self protection items can you think of that remain in the realm of this current reality?


__________________

__________________
Dean - 22' Westerly Nomad - Travelnik
A 14-foot mini-cruiser is minimalist. A 19ft is comfortable, and anything much larger than a 25 borders on ostentatious.
Travelnik is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 06-09-2012, 16:30   #347
Nearly an old salt
 
goboatingnow's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 13,649
Images: 3
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsmastern

True, so on a serious note...

There has been talk of all kinds of silly things, medieval weapons. light sabers, etc.

But what about real defense items? What is really allowable everywhere?

Spear guns are not legal in some places, so that's out. How big of a knife could you have on board before the officials decided that it wasn't a kitchen knife?

Are machetes allowed, or would most officials see them as weapons instead of coconut choppers?

There are things like big hammers and crow bars/pry bars, big screwdrivers and legitimate tools like that.

What other legal self protection items can you think of that remain in the realm of this current reality?

I'd say knives are about the only thing justified on a boat. Most things that project force over a distance are problematic legally. Many counties specifically forbid lethal or aggressive self defence and hence ban pepper sprays, etc But I'd nevertheless never get into a knife fight.

Dave
__________________

__________________
Check out my new blog on smart boat technology, networking and gadgets for the connected sailor! - http://smartboats.tumblr.com
goboatingnow is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 06-09-2012, 16:44   #348
Registered User
 
Sand crab's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Gig Harbor, WA
Boat: 34' Crowther tri sold 16' Kayak now
Posts: 3,157
Re: Honduras: Sailing Boat Boarded and Robbed by Pirates

You mean one of these?
__________________
We don't need no stinking badges.
Sand crab is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 06-09-2012, 16:59   #349
Registered User

Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Melbourne Australia
Boat: Paper Tiger 14 foot, Gemini 105MC 34 foot Catamaran Hull no 825
Posts: 1,616
Re: Honduras: Sailing Boat Boarded and Robbed by Pirates

Knives are now illegal in Victoria, Australia, I dont know about the rest of OZ,

It got a bit ridiculous a few years back here when a woman carrying her new kitchen Knives from the supermarket to the car was charged with carrying a knife,

I forget how that ended up, But it made every one quite aware of the law,
You keep your new knives hidden in your shopping bags,
__________________
Mr B is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 06-09-2012, 17:03   #350
Registered User
 
Travelnik's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Nanny State
Boat: 22' Westerly Nomad
Posts: 593
Re: Honduras: Sailing Boat Boarded and Robbed by Pirates

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sand crab View Post
Yeah, just like that!

But seriously, what size kitchen knives would be frowned on? Butcher knives? Meat cleavers?

Would a small axe or hatchet be allowed?

__________________
Dean - 22' Westerly Nomad - Travelnik
A 14-foot mini-cruiser is minimalist. A 19ft is comfortable, and anything much larger than a 25 borders on ostentatious.
Travelnik is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 06-09-2012, 17:16   #351
Registered User
 
Travelnik's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Nanny State
Boat: 22' Westerly Nomad
Posts: 593
Re: Honduras: Sailing Boat Boarded and Robbed by Pirates

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr B View Post
Knives are now illegal in Victoria, Australia, I dont know about the rest of OZ,

It got a bit ridiculous a few years back here when a woman carrying her new kitchen Knives from the supermarket to the car was charged with carrying a knife,

I forget how that ended up, But it made every one quite aware of the law,
You keep your new knives hidden in your shopping bags,
That is ridiculous!

But I'm not talking about carrying anything, I'm wondering about what customs officials would object to in the galley, tool box, cabin, etc.

Where would most "reasonable" officials draw the line and call a tool a weapon, and give you a hard time? I know that there can be jerks anywhere that will pull crap just to prove their power, that's why I mentioned "reasonable."

__________________
Dean - 22' Westerly Nomad - Travelnik
A 14-foot mini-cruiser is minimalist. A 19ft is comfortable, and anything much larger than a 25 borders on ostentatious.
Travelnik is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 06-09-2012, 18:05   #352
Senior Cruiser
 
Therapy's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: W Florida
Boat: The Jon boat still, plus a 2007 SeaCat.
Posts: 6,894
Images: 4
Re: Honduras: Sailing Boat Boarded and Robbed by Pirates

Quote:
Originally Posted by dsmastern View Post
That is ridiculous!

But I'm not talking about carrying anything, I'm wondering about what customs officials would object to in the galley, tool box, cabin, etc.

Where would most "reasonable" officials draw the line and call a tool a weapon, and give you a hard time? I know that there can be jerks anywhere that will pull crap just to prove their power, that's why I mentioned "reasonable."

From all of my reading/research and limited experience I would say it depends on how your attitude is interpreted by said official.

I have seldom been out on any of my boats without a machette. For snakes you see.

You don't know what he got or didn't get last night. It could help knowing as then you would know to provide cookies all around or BJs.

__________________
Who knows what is next.
Therapy is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 07-09-2012, 05:28   #353
Armchair Bucketeer
 
David_Old_Jersey's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 10,013
Images: 4
Re: Honduras: Sailing Boat Boarded and Robbed by Pirates

Quote:
Originally Posted by Therapy View Post
You don't know what he got or didn't get last night. It could help knowing as then you would know to provide cookies all around or BJs.

I would be happier offering cookies........YMMV .
David_Old_Jersey is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 07-09-2012, 05:40   #354
Armchair Bucketeer
 
David_Old_Jersey's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 10,013
Images: 4
Re: Honduras: Sailing Boat Boarded and Robbed by Pirates

Quote:
Originally Posted by goboatingnow View Post
While Its a good laugh and a joke. It would be wrong to encourage anyone to carry aboard illegal or potentially illegal firearms or devices that resemble them including homemade. Such actions can result in severe penalties in many countries.

Dave
I see no encouragement (incitement nor grooming ).

But of course some gubberments are known to have no SOH and like to spend there time hunting bogeymen. Strangely enough they seem to be the ones most addicted to pointing (and firing) guns at people and are also armed with a strange sense of what being "free" actually means...........no names .

FWIW (legally, nadda ), in these parts for non gun weaponary it is mainly about the usage (actual and likely) that da gubberment says no. I could happily and legally have a samurai sword on my boat that would not be confiscated if seen by officialdom........but running down the high street with it whilst screaming Banzai! would see me in some legal trouble (even if I wasn't directly threatening someone with it or chopping them up).....of course lots of circumstances in between that could give rise to interest from officialdom.........but as a rule of thumb, if folk have a reason to own an object (decoration), are not using it to scare people (directly or not) then da Gubberment around here does not fundamentally care. Samuri Sword, Monkey Wrench, Axe, Machete or pointy stick . The real reason (and dual purpose) for having onboard does not have to be shared with anyone else.

and always remembering that what da Gubberment does not know about doesn't worry them - at least not until you can see the whites of their eyes .
David_Old_Jersey is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 17-12-2012, 20:56   #355
Registered User
 
asduffy's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Seattle
Posts: 2
Re: Honduras: Sailing Boat Boarded and Robbed by Pirates

It seems that reading through this post there is one of two solutions. First is to be submissive and give in to them in the hope you are not harmed (statistically this is your best chance of the two), coupled with the idea that you spend your money in nice places. Second is to fight back with a weapon at the risk of escalating the experience or least being imprisoned for carrying illegal weapons.

Most countries try and make money off people. They charge all kinds of fees for port entry and other fines and stuff. I think there is a great option to deal with this.

These pirats are there because it is not profitable to get rid of them. If Sailors worldwide got together and created international law that stated if your country has a port then it is financially responsible for any wrongdoing. I would set the minimum find around $50k, then the governments of these countries would see profit it dealing with there pirates. I would set loss of life at $100,000,000.00 this would cripple these countries and their business that benefits off this community. I think overnight you would see their navy hunting these people down instead of harassing the sailing community for not checking into a port in the right way.

If we take the money out of the pockets of the nice people who make money from us, then we say to them it is your responsibility to keep us save if you intend to take our money. It's the cost of doing business.

For those of you that want to arm yourself, trust me there is no wepon you can afford that equals that of a navy destroyer of even the poorest countries. Pirats just wont take the chance on $11k if the result is a $50k fine to the community, that is a $50k hit on their lives. Legally!!!

Also it would make for safer waters and more business at port, thus giving more opportunity in their countries and providing a legitimate living for someone considering a life of a pirate.

The question is not should you fight or not, the question is are there ways you could create law that would make in profitable to the right people to ensure that you never have to ask this question in the first place.
__________________
asduffy is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 17-12-2012, 23:11   #356
Registered User
 
Nessus's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 69
Re: Honduras: Sailing Boat Boarded and Robbed by Pirates

Seems to me a few gallons of petrol and a flare gun could end a pirate situation very quickly.


Set the sea ablaze to show your intentions. Gasoline floats.

I would most certainly carry firearms. I am an enthusiast and collect firearms in the states. However while cruising I worry much more about third world prison than I do pirates.

There is no bravado in prison. I also have an aversion to having another mans anatomy in my butt hole.
__________________
Nessus is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 18-12-2012, 01:26   #357
Senior Cruiser
 
atoll's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: gettin naughty on the beach in cornwall
Boat: 63 custom alloy sloop,macwester26,prout snowgoose 37 elite catamaran!
Posts: 9,311
Images: 75
Re: Honduras: Sailing Boat Boarded and Robbed by Pirates

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nessus View Post
Seems to me a few gallons of petrol and a flare gun could end a pirate situation very quickly.


Quote:
Set the sea ablaze to show your intentions. Gasoline floats.
I would most certainly carry firearms. I am an enthusiast and collect firearms in the states. However while cruising I worry much more about third world prison than I do pirates.

There is no bravado in prison. I also have an aversion to having another mans anatomy in my butt hole.
Set the sea ablaze to show your intentions. Gasoline floats

have you considered entering yourself for the darwin awards as well
__________________
my catamaran building project updates http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...36#post2502136
atoll is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 18-12-2012, 01:34   #358
Moderator
 
carstenb's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2012
Location: Copenhagen
Boat: Jeanneau Sun Fast 40.3
Posts: 4,936
Images: 1
Re: Honduras: Sailing Boat Boarded and Robbed by Pirates

Well aToll,

of course the poster didn't mean he would set the sea on fire right around his own boat. He would take a dinghy an row over to the other boat, pour out the gas and row away. thereafter he would fire off the flare gun............

__________________
I spent most of my money on Booze, Broads and Boats. The rest I wasted - Elmore Leonard
carstenb is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 18-12-2012, 01:42   #359
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Fethiye Turkey
Boat: Lagoon 440
Posts: 3,164
Re: Honduras: Sailing Boat Boarded and Robbed by Pirates

You know the reasons for a forum such as CF is to share advice, wisdom, experience and experiences from those who have either done it or know about it. (not from armchairs and CNN)

Anything else is just opinion, to rabbit on about arming yourself and cruising into foreign ports is just stupid.

If you feel you need to arm your boat to the teeth to reinforce your 'gung-ho' attitude then you really need to stay home on the farm in the safety of your own country and shoot animals.

Cruising is for enjoyment, simply use the pre-warnings to enable yourselves to make a rational decision based on the info shared. Sometimes the occurrence is isolated and sometimes it becomes evident a pattern is developing.

The aim is to not become part of the pattern, use the warning the same as a warning of a storm, STAY AWAY till it blows over and enjoy the cruise.

Cheers
__________________
"Political correctness is a creeping sickness that knows no boundaries"
Lagoon4us is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Old 18-12-2012, 02:12   #360
Armchair Bucketeer
 
David_Old_Jersey's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 10,013
Images: 4
Re: Honduras: Sailing Boat Boarded and Robbed by Pirates

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lagoon4us View Post
You know the reasons for a forum such as CF is to share advice, wisdom, experience and experiences from those who have either done it or know about it. (not from armchairs and CNN)
I have an armchair and I am not afraid to use it .
__________________

David_Old_Jersey is offline   Reply With Quote Reply
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 00:30.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.