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Old 08-04-2009, 04:29   #16
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Originally Posted by GordMay View Post
Ecoterra International, which monitors seajackings, said the Tanit was seized by some 14 pirates about 390 miles (630 kilometers) from the coastal Somali town of Bandar-Beyla, south of Cape Ras Hafun, northeast Somalia.
Hi Gord,

That doesnt make sense 390 miles from that town is anywhere... even Yemen. Have a look on Google Maps. If its 390nm off thecoast then that should have been enough (!!!)

"On April 4, Somali pirates highjacked the Tanit and took the crew hostage off the coast of Ras Hafun, northeast Somalia." (from France 24 | Despite warnings, French family sails into pirate hands | France 24 )

"On March 20, The Floreal left the Tanit as they approached the Bab-el-Mandeb Detroit which marks the entrance of the Indian Ocean. The warship is not authorised to go any further. Its mission is to protect the commercial ships which cross the Gulf of Aden, one of the world’s most strategic routes."

Between March 20 and April 4th is a fair bit of time...

At least the family got what they wanted:
Quote:
"We want to flee the consumer society and its routine,” Mr Lemaçon told the newspaper Ouest France. “We don’t want our child to receive the sort of education that the Government is concocting for us. We have got rid of the television and everything that seemed superfluous to concentrate on what is essential.”
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Old 08-04-2009, 04:36   #17
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ONe good thing is it indicates we might get a whole war ship to escort us through the Gulf of Aden.... If I practice my French....
voulez vous couchez avec moi ces soir.
voulez vous couchez avec moi ces soir
voulez vous couchez avec moi ces soir

Je t'aime, moi little French Capitaineeee



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Old 08-04-2009, 05:58   #18
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As I recall, the US Navy was first invented to deal with the Barbary pirates of the day. Even if the pirates cant be 100% eradicated it is hard to believe we couldnt put a serious dent in their activities. If we started confiscating boats they would have fewer and fewer ways to get out to passing ships. And if we followed them home a few times it shouldnt be hard to find out where their bases are. International law is all on the side of the good guys here so I am wondering what they are waiting for.
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Old 08-04-2009, 08:04   #19
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Sck5 - That would be the Marine Corp.
"From the halls of Montezuma, to the shores of Tripoli . . . "

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Old 08-04-2009, 08:55   #20
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Yes, certainly the Marines too - But the Marines relied on the Navy for transportation to actually get to the shores of Tripoli. Once they landed they may have been on their own but the Navy had their share of action also. (including running one of their ships aground in the harbor if I remember correctly)

Also, I believe the Marines were part of the Navy back in those days. I dont think they had a separate command structure until much more recently

But I am entirely in favor of going after the pirates with Marines. It would be an experience the pirates would never forget I am sure.
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Old 08-04-2009, 09:38   #21
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as markj said 390 nm should be enough.I have been delivering yachts in that area for 2 years.the last trip i sailed from the seychelles back to the med.from the seychelles i sailed over to 60 deg to stay well off shore,but still had a visit from a fishing boat.At the time i was over 500nm off shore in the indian ocean.I have been reading that there has been a sailing yacht taken off the seychelles with 2 local men on board.they were heading for madagaska.
Unfortunatly the military cannot be everywhere.I have read that some cruising yachts are planning to sail in that area heading for the gulf of aden,maybe it would be a good idea to stay away and stay further north if heading for the med.
Im sure there are people that will say they have the right to go where they want,and they do,but you dont put your arm in the lions cage at the zoo.
I look forward to reading your comments

david.

looks like cape town will be busy
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Old 08-04-2009, 11:21   #22
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"On March 20, The Floreal left the Tanit as they approached the Bab-el-Mandeb Detroit which marks the entrance of the Indian Ocean. The warship is not authorised to go any further. Its mission is to protect the commercial ships which cross the Gulf of Aden, one of the world’s most strategic routes."

Between March 20 and April 4th is a fair bit of time...

The article was misleading. Bab-El Mandeb is the strait connecting the Red Sea to the Gulf of Aden. From that I can only assume Floreal's mission is in the Red Sea, not the GOA as reported. That allowed Tanit 2 weeks to get from B-E-M around Socotra and headed south well off-shore; which is more than enough time, and would have allowed a stop in Djibouti or Aden. Obviously well-offshore doesn't cut it anymore. Yes there's still the option to go around the Cape, but those who watch these things know that piracy is on the rise off the West coast of Africa too.
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Old 08-04-2009, 15:07   #23
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. From that I can only assume Floreal's mission is in the Red Sea, not the GOA as reported. .
Thats where the dates are confusing. The yacht was taken off the east coast of Somalia. The French navy stopped escorting the boat when it left the GOA.
The Yacht had come down the Red Sea.


The thing that surprises me is how the hell does someone operate 400+ miles off the coast and hijack ships? They must be useing some of the smaller hijacked ships.

It must be like looking for a needle in a haystack finding a 40 ft yacht 400 miles out. They MUST have heard the VHF and used RDF?????

Its just crazy.


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Old 09-04-2009, 02:25   #24
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Pirates finding ships - easy, Worlds Navies finding pirates - hard...

I don't understand why it is so easy for the pirates to find the ships and so hard for the world's navies to find the pirates.

What's the range of a decent military radar these days? 100, 200, 330nm?
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Old 09-04-2009, 05:44   #25
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I was puzzled too but then I read somewhere that there are dozens if not hundreds of fishing boats out there, any one of which might be a pirate. They dont know until they get in their dinghys and head off toward a ship. Still, I have to think it is possible for the combined NATO navies to start boarding and checking fishing boats and at a minimum following them back to their bases. As somebody up above noted what are Marines for if not to go after pirates on shore?
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Old 09-04-2009, 06:25   #26
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BBC NEWS | Africa | Pirate stand-off over US hostage

For answers to many of your questions check out the BBC link and read the side bar articles. They give some good explanations about the situation.
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Old 09-04-2009, 07:12   #27
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The thing that surprises me is how the hell does someone operate 400+ miles off the coast and hijack ships? They must be useing some of the smaller hijacked ships.

It must be like looking for a needle in a haystack finding a 40 ft yacht 400 miles out. They MUST have heard the VHF and used RDF?????

OK, I get in now that I've read the Tanit's blog - they spent quite some time in the Gulf of Aden, visiting Djibouti, Aden and finally Al Mukalla. Obviously Floreal did not spend much time with them, and left them near the mouth of the GOA, vice Bab-Al Mandeb.

It's likely that the pirates are using spotters in or near ports, and in fishing fleets - they give tracking info to the pirates to narrow the search area. Also they don't always need to find a needle in a haystack - there's enough traffic going to and from that region in all directions; all the pirates have to do is wait around in some random spot and wait for soem hapless target of opportunity to stumble through.
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Old 09-04-2009, 07:19   #28
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I don't understand why it is so easy for the pirates to find the ships and so hard for the world's navies to find the pirates.

What's the range of a decent military radar these days? 100, 200, 330nm?
Sure for air search. Radars still have to contend with the horizon - range in NM is roughly 1.33 times the square root of combined height of radar and target in feet. Eg height of radar 80 ft, height of pirate vessel 20 ft:
(80+20)^0.5 * 1.33= 13.3 NM. Even then it's just a blip - it's more likely to be a fishing blip than a pirate blip.
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Old 09-04-2009, 08:09   #29
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While in College in Kansas City SoOoooooom years ago, I worked at a 7 - 11 store (so I could have enough money to eat). Problem was, I worked the evening shift... and at the time these stores were being knocked over (Robbed at gun point) on a regular basis. I was hit twice, both were unsuccessful for the robber.

At the time the Kansas City Police just instituted a policy where they plastered warning posters on these stores and made massive TV ads warning potential robbers that undercover and concealed police officers would be rotationally posted within and about these stores. If a robbery took place, the police would take lethal action with out warning to the robber.

They actually has some of these poor police officers hang out in the walk in coolers. On one occasion I was being robbed while officers were in my cooler and in a car outside. After I handed over the cash the robber stopped by to pick up some chips and a beer.... he almost had a heart attack and I know he spoiled his pants when he open the cooler door and was greeted by a shotgun in the face and told to freeze. His two buddies ran out into the officers outside who had shot guns drawn on them. In other stores across town several thieves were shot during attempted robberies in these set ups. TV news reported these stories each night. Some people didn't like the police tactics but In a few weeks these robberies almost went away.... when the added security went away it was only a few months until the robberies slowly started again. Guess you get what you want or are willing to settle for.

I would think something similar could occur where a security force, private or some national, could be rotated on and off ships in this area and any other where the problem occurs frequently. A security force with ability to not only repel but destroy an attacking party would / should cool the willingness to attempt these attacks.

Recently I saw on TV a story about a private security firm that assisted in supporting fishing laws by seizing offending boat at the governments request. The cost to the government was minimal as the boat was held with a fine and or sold to pay the security team.

Lots of ways these problems could be attacked with out massive flag ships crisscrossing vast amounts of open oceans.
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Old 09-04-2009, 08:17   #30
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Protection.........

We always carry 2 AK-47's with us as well as a sawed off shot-gun (pump) and 2 long ringe rifles with scopes. We cruise off Nicaragua carribbean side (lots of drug running there). Never a problem. Always keep a night watch at anchor and have had 4 attempts and have always been thwarted by the sound of our AK's firing.
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