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Old 14-07-2009, 13:47   #31
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"but can you shoot a shotgun bullet from a flare gun without blowing your hand off? "
Well, no you can't. A "shotgun bullet" is an oxymoron, a shotgun slug is probably what you mean. And while you could easily get any third-world machine shop with a foot-powered lathe to make up an adapter to fit, quite literally, any size or style of ammunition into a flare gun, there are some things that should just be left to MacGyver.

Some of the finest (and most amazing) gunsmithing in the world comes from the dirt floor mud huts in the Khyber Pass. But if you're not familiar with firearms, you're honestly better off with a machete. Sold for $25 in fancy US stores, $10 in commodity stores, $1 in the third world, and only a dime a piece if you buy them wholesale in China.

Proven to be just as good as firearms, against a million Rwandans not so long ago.

And of course, fully legal to carry on board.
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Old 14-07-2009, 13:56   #32
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[Machetes were] Proven to be just as good as firearms, against a million Rwandans not so long ago.
I can't argue with the truth of your observation, hellosailor, but, Gawd, what a hideous, gruesome reminder and testament to man's insatiable lust for the blood of innocent victims - in this case, about 20% of the entire population.

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Old 14-07-2009, 22:21   #33
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tj-
That genocide is so common, so frequent, and so quickly and repeatedly ignored by most of the world...well yes, hideous is a suitable word. For the folks who insist on ignoring it, as much as the ones who commit it.
The folks who ignore it--well, wasn't that most of Germany that said "Nazis? Camps? What camps? What Nazis?" and here in the US, our own grade schools that for so many years conveniently forgot to teach the genocide against the native American peoples, by England, Spain, and the other old world powers? No one told me that 'trade' blankets came from plague victims, and sucessfully decimated hte natives. (With literally a 90% kill rate in some colonies.)

"Never Again" seems to have had a very short expiration date. Not on my watch.
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Old 15-07-2009, 00:22   #34
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Plague in the America's: well, I wouldn't call that genocide. The Europeans didn't bring their diseases as biological weapons, they didn't have a clue. The question is what would have happened when the Indians would have been as resistant to these diseases as the Europeans...

In Africa it was the other way around: the Europeans died from African diseases (malaria, tse tse).

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Old 15-07-2009, 08:12   #35
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Nick,

HS was alluding to the somewhat contested assertion that blankets believed to harbor Smallpox were purposely traded to the Native Americans. The evidence supporting this is somewhat sketchy, and even if it did occur, it's effectiveness is questionable. In reality there are many other ways smallpox, typhoid and other diseases were introduced to the Native American population unintentionally. To be sure, the way in which the native population of North America was treated is despicable, but it was a far cry from wholesale systematic genocide. And as you pointed out with the Africa example...the death toll from disease could very easily have gone the other way, an interesting thought I'd never considered.
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Old 15-07-2009, 09:26   #36
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Genocide, I believe, implies a pre-meditated mass killing of a people.

President George Washington: The immediate objectives are the total destruction and devastation of their settlements. It will be essential to ruin their crops in the ground and prevent their planting more.

President Thomas Jefferson: This unfortunate race ... have by their unexpected desertion and ferocious barbarities justified extermination and now await our decision on their fate.

President Andrew Jackson: They have neither the intelligence, the industry, the moral habits, not the desire of improvement which are essential for to any change in their condition. ... they must necessarily yield to the force of circumstances and ere long disappear.
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Old 15-07-2009, 09:29   #37
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This thread has wandered way off topic. Can we get it back to the original topic please?

Thank you.
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Old 15-07-2009, 12:56   #38
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Old 15-07-2009, 14:00   #39
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A single-round, breech-loading, 38 caliber pistol.

Oooh, THAT'S GONNA SCARE PIRATES!

Anyone seen an alligator that swallowed an alarm clock 'round here? The captain's real worried about that one, too....
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Old 15-07-2009, 16:11   #40
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As we are heading to Malaysia after Indonesia I was very interested in what the Malaysian rally director said about firearms in Malaysia. Any crime where a firearm is used (not shot, just carried) carries a mandatory death penalty.

So if one is thinking about enhanced flare guns etc, I think you better be prepared to declare them at each country.

They will then be removed for your stay in most countries so you don’t get possession of them anyway.

So that brings you back to at sea piracey attacks. and as I intimated before taking brightly coloured smoke to a AK47 party may be quaint but wont earn you applause.



PLease note that again for those that think the rest of the world agrees with you: Mandatory death penalty.




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Old 15-07-2009, 19:46   #41
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A good cutlass (machete) and a spear gun, quiet, reliable and effective.

If you need anything more than that you are seriously outgunned. A flare gun would be laughed at even with some sort of single shot insert. It would just enrage them and then there would be hell to pay.
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Old 15-07-2009, 20:44   #42
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That's very macho machete talk I read here. You should stop and think about the last cruiser that took his machete to engage a pirate: he was immediately killed and his wife stabbed (she survived with a collapsed lung). The place was Rio Dulce, Guatemala, not a year ago and the yacht was Sundays Child... cruisers we know/knew.

The speargun is just as silly, it's not the movies you know. Without a serious gun, you better surrender and put yourselves to their mercy and you're likely to survive, raped and all if you're unlucky.

The only other option is that security washboard of steel bar to delay their entry and make them understand hell is waiting inside for them while they are kicking it in. They might reconsider if that hell makes the sound of a slide-action shotgun followed by a blast through that security-fence. You'll have to deal with the consequences of your actions or decision to surrender whatever option you choose.

We choose to skip Guatemala, especially after other cruisers (Dream Odyssey, know them too) were boarded a couple of days later by the same group. They surrendered, survived and were not even harmed; just all their boat stuff was taken.

You must realize that these are bad guys, not some nervous thieves that run when you say boo. They are born with a machete in their hands and had countless knife fights or other violent exchanges so you better be sure you will outclass them at their game before taking a blade.

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Old 15-07-2009, 21:34   #43
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That's very macho machete talk I read here. You should stop and think about the last cruiser that took his machete to engage a pirate: he was immediately killed and his wife stabbed (she survived with a collapsed lung). The place was Rio Dulce, Guatemala, not a year ago and the yacht was Sundays Child... cruisers we know/knew
cheers,
Nick.
If a number of armed people where to decide to invade our boat I would never consider using a cutlass or spear gun. It would be as pointless as a flare gun. However if a single intruder were to make it into our sleeping cabin it could be an entirely different matter dependent on the actions of that person.

If you were to read some of my earlier posts in this thread you will see how I look at the problems of preventing people from invading our boat and some of the preventative measures i have taken. All of which do not require firearms.

The only use I would put the machete to is to hasten the departure of a midnight sneak thief of which we have had a few. I have spent thousands of hours swinging a machete or its equivalent and am completely familiar with its use for a variety of tasks. It could be said I grew up with one.

We have spent a fair amount of time in Guatamala over the years and elsewhere where at times there have been problems. There used to be a lot of "floaters" on the Rio years ago when the owners of properties on the Rio Dulce decided to discourage thievery. It was a drastic solution that is all to frequently used in countries where life is not valued.
My main intent for writing what I did was to get the thread back on track and not argue about something that cannot be changed but only rewritten.
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Old 15-07-2009, 22:30   #44
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However if a single intruder were to make it into our sleeping cabin it could be an entirely different matter dependent on the actions of that person.
And how they are armed.
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Old 15-07-2009, 22:38   #45
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mesquaukee: ah, you are the exception then... I really thought no cruiser here would have used a machete that much and here you are, proving me wrong ;-)

As you can see on the photo below, I'm pretty scary (not!) with a cutlass too ;-)

But anyway, I think we both have the tactic of avoiding some places. Unfortunately, we learned that you are only lowering the risk with that method, not eliminating it.

ciao!
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