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14-03-2018, 04:44
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#1
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Senior Cruiser
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Thunder Bay, Ontario - 48-29N x 89-20W
Boat: (Cruiser Living On Dirt)
Posts: 49,139
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A cautionary tale
__________________
Gord May
"If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time/$ to fix it?"
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14-03-2018, 05:02
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#2
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Senior Cruiser
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: PORTUGAL
Posts: 30,584
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Re: A cautionary tale
A sad story.. what can one say.
Too many take the chances without even begining to understand what or how much they are risking..
Hope he finds some peace down the line..
__________________
It was a dark and stormy night and the captain of the ship said.. "Hey Jim, spin us a yarn." and the yarn began like this.. "It was a dark and stormy night.."
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14-03-2018, 05:02
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#3
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Canada or Spain
Boat: Jeanneau SO 43 DS
Posts: 1,162
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Re: A cautionary tale
A sad story indeed, but yes, various lessons to be learned from this.
__________________
Prairie Chicken
><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸><((((º>¸.
`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`· ...¸><((((º>
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14-03-2018, 06:14
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#4
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2008
Boat: Teak Yawl, 37'
Posts: 2,980
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Re: A cautionary tale
Quote:
Originally Posted by boatman61
A sad story.. what can one say.
Too many take the chances without even begining to understand what or how much they are risking..
Hope he finds some peace down the line..
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Well said Boatman!
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14-03-2018, 07:29
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#5
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Florida
Posts: 947
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Re: A cautionary tale
Sad story indeed.
Crotch straps would have saved her.
Don’t know why they aren’t mandatory,
then it’s your choice to not use them.
Cheers
Neil
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14-03-2018, 07:43
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 5,983
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Re: A cautionary tale
Sad story for sure. There are risks and like flying sailing is not inherently dangerous but it's terribly unforgiving of scewups.
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14-03-2018, 08:20
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#7
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: On the Water
Boat: 53' Cutter
Posts: 193
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Re: A cautionary tale
That sealed it! I had never heard of someone slipping out of a tethered harness.
I just ordered Crewsaver ErgoFit Offshore harnesses with leg straps for the entire crew.
We do run our jacklines down the center line of the deck. With 6' tethers, it should not be possible for crew to make it over the lifelines except when working at the bow.
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14-03-2018, 08:38
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#8
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Denmark (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 33,764
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Re: A cautionary tale
Quote:
Originally Posted by Time2Go
Sad story indeed.
Crotch straps would have saved her.
Don’t know why they aren’t mandatory,
then it’s your choice to not use them.
Cheers
Neil
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Indeed. A lifejacket without crotch straps, and all the more! a lifejacket used as a harness and without crotch straps, is utterly useless. They should be banned!
Imagine rock climbing in a harness which stops at your waist, with no leg straps? It's just nuts.
__________________
"You sea! I resign myself to you also . . . . I guess what you mean,
I behold from the beach your crooked inviting fingers,
I believe you refuse to go back without feeling of me;
We must have a turn together . . . . I undress . . . . hurry me out of sight of the land,
Cushion me soft . . . . rock me in billowy drowse,
Dash me with amorous wet . . . . I can repay you."
Walt Whitman
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14-03-2018, 08:42
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#9
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Denmark (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 33,764
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Re: A cautionary tale
Quote:
Originally Posted by SailsWithFists
That sealed it! I had never heard of someone slipping out of a tethered harness..
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Read the Fastnet '79 report! A bunch of sailors died from slipping out of their legstrap-less harnesses. That was almost 40 years ago!
__________________
"You sea! I resign myself to you also . . . . I guess what you mean,
I behold from the beach your crooked inviting fingers,
I believe you refuse to go back without feeling of me;
We must have a turn together . . . . I undress . . . . hurry me out of sight of the land,
Cushion me soft . . . . rock me in billowy drowse,
Dash me with amorous wet . . . . I can repay you."
Walt Whitman
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14-03-2018, 08:47
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#10
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Senior Cruiser
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: PORTUGAL
Posts: 30,584
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Re: A cautionary tale
Thats the freedom of choice one gets in a largely unregulated leisure activity..
Its down to us to end them by not buying what one consders unsafe.. customer power works if enough exercise it.
But the reality often is down to the individuals economic choices.
Ya pays ya money and take ya chances.
__________________
It was a dark and stormy night and the captain of the ship said.. "Hey Jim, spin us a yarn." and the yarn began like this.. "It was a dark and stormy night.."
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14-03-2018, 08:58
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#11
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Denmark (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 33,764
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Re: A cautionary tale
Quote:
Originally Posted by boatman61
Thats the freedom of choice one gets in a largely unregulated leisure activity..
Its down to us to end them by not buying what one consders unsafe.. customer power works if enough exercise it.
But the reality often is down to the individuals economic choices.
Ya pays ya money and take ya chances.
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I guess it improves the gene pool . . ..
__________________
"You sea! I resign myself to you also . . . . I guess what you mean,
I behold from the beach your crooked inviting fingers,
I believe you refuse to go back without feeling of me;
We must have a turn together . . . . I undress . . . . hurry me out of sight of the land,
Cushion me soft . . . . rock me in billowy drowse,
Dash me with amorous wet . . . . I can repay you."
Walt Whitman
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14-03-2018, 09:02
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#12
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Writing Full-Time Since 2014
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Deale, MD
Boat: PDQ Altair, 32/34
Posts: 9,568
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Re: A cautionary tale
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockhead
Indeed. A lifejacket without crotch straps, and all the more! a lifejacket used as a harness and without crotch straps, is utterly useless. They should be banned!
Imagine rock climbing in a harness which stops at your waist, with no leg straps? It's just nuts.
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Also this:
From EN 12277: Mountaineering Equipment - Harnesses - Safety requirements and test methods
3.1.4, chest harness (type D). Harness which fits around the upper part of the body around the chest and under the armpits.
NOTE 1. This type of harness alone cannot support a person in the hanging position without permanent injury in less than one minute.
---
But all of this said, we aren't always going to even wear the thing, not if it is uncomfortable. I have yet to find a legs strap or crotch strap rig that does not either slide down the leg while sitting and scooting (unless worn too tight) or irritate the balls. Even worse, once they have slid down, you can't stand up.
The other problem is fitting. Nearly all sailor wear the chest harness over weather gear">foul weather gear and it is too loose. Worn properly, it really is not so easy to slip out. But a proper fit over bulk clothing is troublesome (fits better with a dry suit).
There really should be a better answer. I came up with my own answer (modified leg straps) that is more comfortable and will allow me to take a massive fall without discomfort, but it is more complicated to don than I would like.
I've worn climbing harnesses untold thousands of hours, so I don't think I'm being fussy.
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14-03-2018, 09:04
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2008
Boat: Teak Yawl, 37'
Posts: 2,980
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Re: A cautionary tale
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockhead
I guess it improves the gene pool . . ..
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Most "cruisers" are past child bearing age and have already had children or choose not to have children. Sorry, little net improvement on the gene pool.
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14-03-2018, 09:06
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#14
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Marine Service Provider
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 6,103
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Re: A cautionary tale
I consider PFD crotch straps to be essential.
There have been numerous reports of sailors who have slipped out of their inflatable (or foam) PFDs, especially if they are in cold water and begin to suffer from loss of consciousness or use of their hands.
If you are like many who own an inflatable PFD that does NOT have leg or crotch straps, they can be added easily, in just a few minutes with no tools (like putting a belt on trousers) and inexpensively.
Here is what I bought to add to my inflatable PFD. They cost less than $12 and took about 3 minutes to install. This strap can be added to most inflatable PFDs that have a webbing harness that surrounds the chest. The photo below does not show how they are attached to a PFD. You simply slide the loops over the webbing harness on your PFD, then connect the quick clips and adjust the length for good fit. Very simple.
What about comfort?
I know that some may not want to wear a crotch strap because they think if may be uncomfortable. My experience with these is that once put on, they are soon forgotten, like wearing socks or a belt on your pants. In short, they are not uncomfortable, they are adjustable, and very light in weight, so hardly noticed if at all.
Crewsaver Add-On Crotch Straps
$11.99
Fits most inflatable PFDs!
The Crewsaver Inflatable Life Jacket / PFD Crotch Strap connects to any inflatable lifejacket or buoyancy aid's attachment points for a more secure fit
Designed to hold you in a safer position in the water
Retro fits most inflatable lifejackets or buoyancy aids
Detailed instructions included to ensure correct fitting
https://www.defender.com/product3.js...131&id=3142281
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14-03-2018, 09:06
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#15
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Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Denmark (Winter), Helsinki (Summer); Cruising the Baltic Sea this year!
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 33,764
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Re: A cautionary tale
Quote:
Originally Posted by LakeSuperior
Most "cruisers" are past child bearing age and have already had children or choose not to have children. Sorry, little net improvement on the gene pool.
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Ha, ha. Unfortunately, you are right.
__________________
"You sea! I resign myself to you also . . . . I guess what you mean,
I behold from the beach your crooked inviting fingers,
I believe you refuse to go back without feeling of me;
We must have a turn together . . . . I undress . . . . hurry me out of sight of the land,
Cushion me soft . . . . rock me in billowy drowse,
Dash me with amorous wet . . . . I can repay you."
Walt Whitman
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