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Old 04-02-2013, 19:37   #241
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Re: U.S. Navy ship goes aground due to bad charts

Funny thing is, I would have thought that area was charted by the USN anyway, rather than by the locals.
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Old 08-02-2013, 00:24   #242
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Re: U.S. Navy ship goes aground due to bad charts

The local ‘NAMRIA’ charts are mostly poor quality copies of old DMA and Admiralty charts with their own additions and a multitude of clerical mistakes.

Their value is more for finding better details of potential anchorages. Certainly not for navigation.
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Old 10-02-2013, 11:03   #243
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Re: U.S. Navy ship goes aground due to bad charts

US Navy pushes back USS Guardian salvage ops due to rough seas | News | GMA News Online | The Go-To Site for Filipinos Everywhere


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Latest estimate showed that the grounding of the ship has damaged 4,000 square meters of reef, from the initial 1,000 square meters.
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Old 11-02-2013, 00:47   #244
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Re: U.S. Navy ship goes aground due to bad charts

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Originally Posted by gpshephe View Post
So your saying that if the person responsible for navigation on the ship was using a sextant they would have been ok?
In case anyone else is misled by your reading words which were neither expressed or implied in the post you're responding to:

Perhaps he's suggesting that if they'd been looking out those window thingies, they might have been OK?

The thing about a false sense of security is that it stops us using all the means at our disposal to keep ourselves safe.

And that surely starts with looking where we're going. Using several pairs of eyes. All the time.

We're not talking about some geriatric solo sailor here.
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Old 07-03-2013, 13:38   #245
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Re: U.S. Navy ship goes aground due to bad charts

USS Guardian was officially decommissioned Mar 6.

http://www.maritime-executive.com/ar...fter-23-Years/
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Old 08-03-2013, 03:21   #246
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Re: U.S. Navy ship goes aground due to bad charts

[QUOTE=bewitched;1135174]I keep my boat in Puerto Princessa, the nearest port to Tubabataha. I think I can offer up some local knowledge about the charts and the reef.

Was the chart off is the first question. Well, yes, pretty much all charts are off in the Philippines, so it's likely that the chart was off. Very little survey work has been done since the 1940's. The most accurate chart I have for Tubbataha is dated 1938 and corrected to 1949. The NAMIRA charts (Philippine Chart Agency) offer no more information for this area than the original US ones. There are essentially copies. C-MAP edition 2 is useless throughout the Philippines and I know of no one who uses them here

Funny,
I have been using cmap ed2 through to Cebu and find that it is spot on when zoomed in. Zoom out I am on Maclan Island, zoom in I am exactly positioned
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Old 08-03-2013, 07:28   #247
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Re: U.S. Navy ship goes aground due to bad charts

Jubilee-
"I have been using cmap ed2 through to Cebu and find that it is spot on when zoomed in."
If you are saying that your position changes as you zoom the view? To me, that would be a huge red flag that there is a software error happening and the positions (plural) cannot be trusted.
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Old 09-03-2013, 16:20   #248
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Re: U.S. Navy ship goes aground due to bad charts

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Jubilee-
"I have been using cmap ed2 through to Cebu and find that it is spot on when zoomed in."
If you are saying that your position changes as you zoom the view? To me, that would be a huge red flag that there is a software error happening and the positions (plural) cannot be trusted.
hart

This is an issue that people have been using to say that the CM93 charts that many cruisers are using are no good. As we all know charts are made from several sources. The smaller scale charts lack detail and boats have been known to run aground on "uncharted reefs" because they did not use the large scale charts. Or zoom to an appropriate scale. I just came in to Port Carmen yesterday using ed2 and again it was spot on. That is not to say that it would not be nice to have ed3.
Joe
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Old 09-03-2013, 18:31   #249
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Re: U.S. Navy ship goes aground due to bad charts

"This is an issue that people have been using to say that the CM93 charts that many cruisers are using are no good. As we all know charts are made from several sources. "

Totally separate from what I am commenting on. If you are changing charts, that's one thing. Zooming in or out, is not changing charts. It is just changing the VIEW of the same chart.

I know, you can set some software to change charts when the view is zoomed--but that's still not just zooming in/out. If the position changed while you were just zooming in/out on a chart, that would be dangerous software.

As to CM93 charts...given the amount of piracy popular with CM93 users? Wouldn't there be some kind of karmic justice there, if the pirates ran themselves aground. <G>

In any case, if positions and features change as you're changing screens, that mythical "prudent mariner" would get a hint there's a possible problem. The folks who don't take the hint...damn it must be nice to be rich.
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Old 10-03-2013, 00:20   #250
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Re: U.S. Navy ship goes aground due to bad charts

Hummm! I wonder what Magellan did before they killed him.
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Old 10-03-2013, 00:57   #251
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Re: U.S. Navy ship goes aground due to bad charts

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Hummm! I wonder what Magellan did before they killed him.
Don't you mean Lapérouse ?
Jean-François de Galaup, comte de Lapérouse - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Old 10-03-2013, 01:15   #252
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Re: U.S. Navy ship goes aground due to bad charts

Actually, I did mean Magellan. But it wasn't for running aground. Ferdinand Magellan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Was Lapérouse killed in the Philippines?
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Old 10-03-2013, 12:17   #253
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Re: U.S. Navy ship goes aground due to bad charts

La Pérouse maybe died when his vessel ran aground on a reef close to Vanikoro in a dark and stormy night, or was killed by the locals, or was lost at sea with the craft that some survivors built. We will never know.

Alain
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Old 25-03-2013, 08:27   #254
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Re: U.S. Navy ship goes aground due to bad charts

Image from 10 days ago, showing most above-deck structure removed.

Photo of the Day: Ex-USS Guardian Wreck Removal Continues | gCaptain - Maritime & Offshore News

The hull is now ready to be cut into 4 pieces and lifted out.

Manila Bulletin
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Old 27-03-2013, 12:36   #255
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Re: U.S. Navy ship goes aground due to bad charts

Great series of pictures of hull dismantling.

USS Guardian: Wooden ship stuck on reef in the Philippines dismantled | Mail Online
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