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Old 09-09-2014, 09:28   #16
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Re: Routes in the Bahamas

Given your objectives and approach, and that of your investors, no conscientious mariner should give you what you are asking for as it will likely not be used in a responsible and informed way and potentially lead to accidents on the water. Especially given the high number of inexperienced skippers chartering boats in the Bahamas who could easily make the mistake of using your app when they should rather rely on other methods and information.




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Old 09-09-2014, 09:34   #17
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Re: Routes in the Bahamas

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Does anyone know of a different source than Jeppesen as I am still trying to reach but with no luck.

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Old 09-09-2014, 10:18   #18
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Re: Routes in the Bahamas

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Thank you for your input.

Some of you are concerned with the accuracy and the usability of website like this and as I said it is not meant as a definitive guide or something captains to rely on.
Things like draft, speed and so on will be configurable, I am not trying to reinvent the wheel but satisfy the investors requirements, it is business at the end of the day. We have a database of ports we would put on the map, we DO NOT have the routes in the bahamas that can be used between those ports and you all pointed out clearly drawing them myself would be bad. We do not want to display all routes on the map all the time but only those related to the specified starting point and destination taking into account the draft.

Linking to 3rd party sources is not an option, we need to have access to that data ourselves and display it accordingly.

Does anyone know of a different source than Jeppesen as I am still trying to reach but with no luck.
Stykiaz,

You say your group are great developers but are you also programmers? Do you know the complexity of the task you are trying to accomplish? You will have to start with a chart that is active and contains continuous data points for land vs water, water depths and all potential hazards across the entire chart. Off the top of my head I would guess this could require hundreds of thousands of data points.

Then you would have to add a module that will read all those data points and choose a best path from one point to another which could theoretically include an infinite number of options to go from A to B. Each potential route could require testing thousands or tens of thousands of data points.

Not saying this is impossible, but doesn't appear to me to be a quick and easy task.
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Old 09-09-2014, 10:26   #19
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Re: Routes in the Bahamas

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Stykiaz,

You say your group are great developers but are you also programmers? Do you know the complexity of the task you are trying to accomplish? You will have to start with a chart that is active and contains continuous data points for land vs water, water depths and all potential hazards across the entire chart. Off the top of my head I would guess this could require hundreds of thousands of data points.

Then you would have to add a module that will read all those data points and choose a best path from one point to another which could theoretically include an infinite number of options to go from A to B. Each potential route could require testing thousands or tens of thousands of data points.

Not saying this is impossible, but doesn't appear to me to be a quick and easy task.
We are not going for quick and easy and we won't go into so much depth, as I said multiple times so far we are not aiming at providing a complete full featured and definite tool for planning routes and plotting charts! We won't display water depths on the map, just suggest a route from point A to point B only taking into account the draft of the boat, as simple as that. At this point in time requirements don't include any extra complexity. This is why I am trying to get a hold of those routes in an usable for format which we can overlay on to the map.
It will be a rough guide telling boater how long it would take to get to their destination and help them plan their itinerary.
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Old 09-09-2014, 10:38   #20
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Re: Routes in the Bahamas

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.
It will be a rough guide telling boater how long it would take to get to their destination and help them plan their itinerary.
It's a sorry boater that needs this. If a boater needs a guide to tell them how long it would take to get to their destination they should stay at home. It's distance and speed. Now if you could predict the weather accurately all along the route that might be helpful.
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Old 09-09-2014, 10:46   #21
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Re: Routes in the Bahamas

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We are not going for quick and easy and we won't go into so much depth, as I said multiple times so far we are not aiming at providing a complete full featured and definite tool for planning routes and plotting charts! We won't display water depths on the map, just suggest a route from point A to point B only taking into account the draft of the boat, as simple as that. At this point in time requirements don't include any extra complexity. This is why I am trying to get a hold of those routes in an usable for format which we can overlay on to the map.
It will be a rough guide telling boater how long it would take to get to their destination and help them plan their itinerary.
But to give even a very rough, approximate route from A to B you will have to have the program take into account areas that are water vs land and depth. Otherwise you will give the user completely idiotic results, showing routes across land or through water that is 6" deep. FYI there are lots of places in the Bahamas where the water is only inches or maybe 2-3' deep. It might look like water on a "map" but it is way too shallow for anything bigger than a row boat.

Some background in case you have no experience at all in marine charts which I'm guessing is the case.

The two main electronic chart types are raster and vector. Raster charts are effectively a photograph of the original paper chart so will give no data at only, just pixels for the image. Vector charts do include all the data in digital format, a file of some type I assume. This is where you would have to start.

At this point I think your best option is to put together some kind of digital image of the Bahamas and pay a boat expert to draw course lines between the major destinations. Then the user can click on the various locations and have the manually drawn course lines from that point show on screen. You would have to set some basic parameters, mainly draft of the vessel. Maybe have two options, max draft 4' and max draft 6'.
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Old 09-09-2014, 10:52   #22
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Re: Routes in the Bahamas

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It's a sorry boater that needs this. If a boater needs a guide to tell them how long it would take to get to their destination they should stay at home. It's distance and speed.
Absolutely. It's not rocket science.

Another thing. To me, a big part of fun of planning a trip is looking at the charts and figuring the routes and stops. Even if it was there I might look at this kind of web site but would never use those routes for any real planning. At most I might want to know something like the direct line distance from the Exumas to the T&C or similar. As far as more exact distances and routing around hazards, don't think so.
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Old 09-09-2014, 16:16   #23
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Re: Routes in the Bahamas

Dear Stykiaz,

We already have enough dumb boaters out here. Don't add some ill conceived "time in transit" algorithm designed by a dirt dweller (you) that can't even tie a bowline. The combination of stupidity is sure to run someone aground, or worse. The fact that you even think that such a program would be useful convinces me that you haven't got the slightest clue about what you are doing. You would be wise to leave such things to people who do have a clue.

And I say this as a sailor who has been to the Bahamas since the 1970's, and a computer programmer who has worked at the techie level since 1966.

By the way, if you think you have a contract with the Bahamian government, you obviously haven't dealt with them before.
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Old 09-09-2014, 16:49   #24
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Re: Routes in the Bahamas

If this projects manages to get off the ground, please omit Long Island, Cat Island and the Jumentos.
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