Poor customer service by Maxsea and C-Map, or don't sail to Easter Island

[El Pinguino]

Here you go...

Came free with my Burgle Brand charts...

When you get there don't do what La Rose did

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBe8Is3H69Y

And don't rely on the charts south of Golfo de Penas.... longitudes tend to be wonky...

[JPA Cate]

Thanks for that, El Penguino,

I'm with you and Mirar on this one.

Once PaulL feels he has exhausted ways of getting help from the people from whom he purchased the charts, what remains is whingeing, or dealing with the problem. Since whingeing after the fact gets you little, seems like a total waste of time, one might as well as deal with the problem. So thanks for posting the chart.

Ann

[El Pinguino]

Oh... internet whinging can work... just post experiences in the 'product review ' section of CF... you may not get the chart but you will get a nice warm fuzzy feeling....

[jmschmidt]

There is nothing within 200 miles of Easter Island. Buy a paper chart of the island and navigate by GPS or whatever and plot the lat/lon on the paper chart when you get in the vicinity. If at night keep plotting until you get a few miles and wait for daylight.

[sailorF54]

It's fairly easy nowadays to check on the accuracy of nautical charts using Google Earth
You need a computer, Opencpn with charts (CM93 are not expensive ), Paul Higgins' GE2KAP on the same sub-forum (!) and access to Google Earth (GE), either on line, or in the cache if you have been preparing your trip carefully
Now, all electronic charts are based on the same papers charts.
Using all that, I find that on GE Rapa Nui's harbour Hanga Piko is displaced 0.1 M NE (see pic)
Took me about a minute, and now I have a chartlet with GE view overlayed on the CM93 chart in opencpn.

As an extra check, this an independent Bing sat view of the same area. The mark on the corner of the harbour on the CM93 chart is also displaced 0,1 M NE on Bing

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by sailorF54

Using all that, I find that on GE Rapa Nui's harbour Hanga Piko is displaced 0.1 M NE (see pic).

I take it you didn't watch the 'La Rose' on youtube.
I haven't been able to ascertain where they were instructed by the Armada to enter or if it was their own decision... either way I think I would anchor off. I have never heard of yachts going in there before but that is based on a fairly small sample.

[donradcliffe]

We entered the harbor in 1992 under similar conditions with a local pilot steering the boat. It was an E-ticket ride, with surf on both sides, and the depthsounder got under 10 ft with a 7 ft draft boat. From GE it looks like the best path in goes a bit north of the range, then cuts back just before the entrance. On the video, the pilot boat did that, but the French boat was afraid to follow because of the surf on the south side of the channel. Once they got sideways to the surf they were finished. Sad to see it happen, but our home port is equally treacherous in the winter.

The anchorage off the town is quite rolly, and you will need to move around the island as the wind changes with the fronts. Once in the harbor, we were snug as a bug and enjoyed the island for a week.

[Bulawayo]

Hi Ann,
Paul did receive a rather unneccessarily sarcastic jibe. No one appreciates being the recipient of such barbs when they are simply alerting everyone else to the situation they have found. It can potentially save us money by lettting others know of their experiences. I know it can influence my future decisions. I also look at e-charts in detail for my landfall, as well as along my whole intended route as well as alternatives for the entire distance. It appeared to me that Paul was doing what many of us do and was preparing adequately. I am old school and also carry paper charts which I refer to for route planning as I find them preferable to a 10 inch electronic chart. We should rather be supporting people like Paul and dropping an email to the relevant party expressing our disgust at them short changing the buyer rather than having a pop (however gentle) at each other. Its the supplier that is at fault and I believe we should try and support each other in these circumstances, to all our benefits.

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by donradcliffe

We entered the harbor in 1992 under similar conditions with a local pilot steering the boat. It was an E-ticket ride, with surf on both sides, and the depthsounder got under 10 ft with a 7 ft draft boat. From GE it looks like the best path in goes a bit north of the range, then cuts back just before the entrance. On the video, the pilot boat did that, but the French boat was afraid to follow because of the surf on the south side of the channel. Once they got sideways to the surf they were finished. Sad to see it happen, but our home port is equally treacherous in the winter...

Gday Don, good to hear someone has done it but a bit too 'strong' for my tastes.... there is other video out there taken aboard 'La Rose' ( which I think was South African) and you can see the breakers on their starboard beam... as you say they left their turn to stbd too late... very sad

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by sailorF54

It's fairly easy nowadays to check on the accuracy of nautical charts using Google Earth
You need a computer, Opencpn with charts (CM93 are not expensive ), Paul Higgins' GE2KAP on the same sub-forum (!) and access to Google Earth (GE), either on line, or in the cache if you have been preparing your trip carefully
Now, all electronic charts are based on the same papers charts.
Using all that, I find that on GE Rapa Nui's harbour Hanga Piko is displaced 0.1 M NE (see pic)
Took me about a minute, and now I have a chartlet with GE view overlayed on the CM93 chart in opencpn.

This of course assumes GE is accurate to that degree...
Also as shown by you those Cmap charts are way way over zoomed... dangerously so.. I trust they were just an example and you wouldn't use them for navigation at that level.

[seandepagnier]

Originally Posted by Paul L

Yea, what kinda of a numbie would want to have a chart for some run-of-the-mill island that everyone goes to anyway, like Easter Island. I mean really what could go wrong after a 1,900 mile passage And the nerve to think after paying over $1,000 on electronics charts to ask for the one missing one. As you say, I really should go back to the comfort of home and do more preparation. Thanks for chiming in with your thoughtful insight.

You can use CM93, and google earth for free. Then scan a paper chart for additional.

Originally Posted by El Pinguino

This of course assumes GE is accurate to that degree...
Also as shown by you those Cmap charts are way way over zoomed... dangerously so.. I trust they were just an example and you wouldn't use them for navigation at that level.

In my experience the google earth imagery is always dead on.

[JPA Cate]

Originally Posted by Bulawayo

Hi Ann,

Hi back at you, Bulawayo.
Paul did receive a rather unneccessarily sarcastic jibe. No one appreciates being the recipient of such barbs when they are simply alerting everyone else to the situation they have found.

If you're referring to Mirar's post, I guess knowing him, I know he did not mean to be mean, so I did not take it as an unwarranted barb. My son's a volunteer football coach. I've heard him tell kids, "suck it up", sort of like shorthand for "accept the pain and move on". You think Paul was alerting us. I apologize, if I offended him by thinking it was complaining.


It can potentially save us money by lettting others know of their experiences. I know it can influence my future decisions. Possibly.

I also look at e-charts in detail for my landfall, as well as along my whole intended route as well as alternatives for the entire distance. It appeared to me that Paul was doing what many of us do and was preparing adequately. I am old school and also carry paper charts which I refer to for route planning as I find them preferable to a 10 inch electronic chart. So do we.

We should rather be supporting people like Paul and dropping an email to the relevant party expressing our disgust at them short changing the buyer

Yes, that might help, do you have such an e-mail address, or can you get Paul to provide it? I'd be willing to send an e-mail.

rather than having a pop (however gentle) at each other. Its the supplier that is at fault and I believe we should try and support each other in these circumstances, to all our benefits.

Well, there's lots of support been given here, some of it of the sort designed to take the sting from the experience, some of it directed at "getting on with it":

1. Mirar offered a possible solution

2. El Penguino posted a copy of the C-Map chart

3. I'll suggest the pilot book for the area, and I already suggested a paper chart for the area, and later, that he contact someone with CM93.

4. donradcliffe discussed strategies for visiting the area, and I'm sorry, but I forgot the handle of the other guy who posted a chartlet

5. Someone also suggested he post in CF's product review section.

All the above were efforts to make the situation better for Paul, hence should be construed as supportive.

Ann

[Bulawayo]

Thanks Ann,
Nice of you to recognise the situation. I was only referring to the one rather adverse comment. I strongly feel we should make manufacturers aware of how we as a group view such practices. I am on anchor in the mid-Indian Ocean at present - headed for the Red Sea but shall try and find the relevant contact details for the supplier.
Fair winds......

[sailorF54]

Originally Posted by El Pinguino

This of course assumes GE is accurate to that degree...
Also as shown by you those Cmap charts are way way over zoomed... dangerously so.. I trust they were just an example and you wouldn't use them for navigation at that level.

You're right. GE sat (or aerial) pics are inaccurate: a surveyor friend of mine keeps complaining that he can't use them in his job, as they may be offset by a few ...meters
Notice that the Bing pic, from a different supplier, matches GE's
And yes, that was just an example, as Rapa Nui was the topic of this thread. True enough, they are very much overzoomed...

[El Pinguino]

I was just looking at google earth... checking up on something that had zero to do with this thread... ashore...up around BA and the top end of the Rio de la Plata... and it struck me that there is no detail once you leave the land.. and I mean knee deep.

Frinstance... on any day of the week there are between one and two dozen ships anchored off La Plata... on google earth...?... nada!

Any sign of the dredged channels into the Parana or the Uruguay?... nada!

The water is shown as blue... the waters of the Rio de la Plata haven't been blue in a million years... its brown....

GE is wonderful ashore.. I recently used it to measure the height of a tree at Campo de la Ping...

Afloat? Not worth a penny's worth of penguin poo .. imho... ymmv...e&oe ...etc