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View Poll Results: Should navigational aids be discontinued?
Yes! We have GPS and chartplotters now. They just get in the way now! 6 7.50%
No, they are a useful backup to the GPS/Plotter/Microwave/Vibrator thing that blinks at me as I drive the boat. 74 92.50%
Voters: 80. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 14-06-2011, 08:41   #1
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Navigational Aids are a Waste of Money !

Ok, let's hear it!
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Old 14-06-2011, 08:51   #2
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Re: Navigational aids are a waste of money!

Didn't you see that article in a magazine a year or two ago? They were suggesting that Nav aids would become virtual. You look through a HUD and see all the ATONs generated by the software. No more real stuff to maintain.

Next all you need is a wraparound viewscreeen and then you don't need the expense of a boat either, just go virtual boating in the safety and comfort of your home.

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Old 14-06-2011, 08:52   #3
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Re: Navigational aids are a waste of money!

Not everyone has a GPS chart plotter nor should have to have one in order to use our waterways. GPS plotters are also a supplement to and not a replacement for navaids.
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Old 14-06-2011, 09:02   #4
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Re: Navigational aids are a waste of money!

Quote:
Originally Posted by cal40john View Post
Didn't you see that article in a magazine a year or two ago? They were suggesting that Nav aids would become virtual. You look through a HUD and see all the ATONs generated by the software. No more real stuff to maintain.

Next all you need is a wraparound viewscreeen and then you don't need the expense of a boat either, just go virtual boating in the safety and comfort of your home.

John
Sadly, with the "marine" price markup, I probably won't be able to afford one of those wraparound viewscreens. Poor me, I will be stuck with this lousy, obsolete, water-borne transportation device that you actually have to SAIL!
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Old 14-06-2011, 09:02   #5
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Re: Navigational aids are a waste of money!

A third choice may be needed.

3) Navigational aids, when used with discretion, are a primary means of navigation.

The discretionary comment comes from the problems associated with lights being out, lights being changed, buoys getting shifted etc.. But that is the purpose of Notices to Mariners and Notices to Shipping.
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Old 14-06-2011, 09:05   #6
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Re: Navigational aids are a waste of money!

Davids got it right IMO.
I think they are absolutely necessary.... chart plotter or not.
And...as of yet, I don't have a chart plotter.
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Old 14-06-2011, 09:06   #7
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Re: Navigational aids are a waste of money!

The poll is skewing heavily in one direction (ok, maybe not heavily, but 3-0). Where are all the brave folks from the "death to paper" thread?!
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Old 14-06-2011, 09:19   #8
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Re: Navigational aids are a waste of money!

The poll asks the wrong question. "Now" they are needed. Will they be needed in future generations? Definitely not.
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Old 14-06-2011, 09:21   #9
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Re: Navigational aids are a waste of money!

Quote:
Originally Posted by David M View Post
Not everyone has a GPS chart plotter nor should have to have one in order to use our waterways. GPS plotters are also a supplement to and not a replacement for navaids.
David is correct here. Plus those aids let you know where the deep and not so deep waters are at. Navigation is an art that sadly is poorly practiced because of those who depend 100% on the GPS. What will they do if a solar flare or someone is jamming the GPS? Yes Major solar flares can knock out the satellites, Yes the GPS can be jammed locally or even turned off by the Military. Who would jam it? Those who don't like you or your life style.
The ATNs are necessary, needed and can help you keep your boat afloat.
The horror stories abound of those naviguessers who run outside the Red or Green line.
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Old 14-06-2011, 09:22   #10
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Re: Navigational aids are a waste of money!

Quote:
Originally Posted by sneuman View Post
Sadly, with the "marine" price markup, I probably won't be able to afford one of those wraparound viewscreens. Poor me, I will be stuck with this lousy, obsolete, water-borne transportation device that you actually have to SAIL!

Hope you have a stout hull then...

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Quote:
So while virtual aids might save money, such a move would require that all mariners have an electronic system to see navigational aids. For those hardy souls who eschew electronic navigation, the waters of the world would return to a time when there were no buoys and a navigator, armed with a good lead line, a stout hull and a dash of courage, was largely on his own.
Trials happening around Europe already, doubt though if it will ever replace conventional buoys, not completely anyway. Personally from experience i trust the laptop with cm93 plugged into gps than I trust unfamiliar buoys. And i don't trust the laptop that much either
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Old 14-06-2011, 09:28   #11
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Re: Navigational aids are a waste of money!

Quote:
Originally Posted by David M View Post
Not everyone has a GPS chart plotter nor should have to have one in order to use our waterways. GPS plotters are also a supplement to and not a replacement for navaids.
When I go out for a daysail, I often don't even install the GPS in the cockpit as I am in local waters, but I still like to see the Nav buoys that mark the shoals as I cruise back to the slip.

And, when I am cruising unfamiliar waters, I still want to see the marks that delineate the ship channel and other things such as the off-limit areas around Pax River etc.

ps: How many of you Chesapeake Bay sailors would like to get into Fairlee Creek without the markers
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Old 14-06-2011, 09:30   #12
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Re: Navigational aids are a waste of money!

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Originally Posted by conachair View Post
Hope you have a stout hull then...

Ocean Navigator | The magazine for long-distance offshore sailing and power voyaging




Trials happening around Europe already, doubt though if it will ever replace conventional buoys, not completely anyway. Personally from experience i trust the laptop with cm93 plugged into gps than I trust unfamiliar buoys. And i don't trust the laptop that much either
The video camera records the scene and sends that to the central computer, which also knows the boat's heading and position. The computer lays down virtual images of buoys and a course to steer in highway view (complete with "guardrails") along with other navigational aids and hazards.

This comes on X-box or Playstation?
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Old 14-06-2011, 09:32   #13
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Re: Navigational aids are a waste of money!

Quote:
Originally Posted by jackdale View Post
A third choice may be needed.

3) Navigational aids, when used with discretion, are a primary means of navigation.

The discretionary comment comes from the problems associated with lights being out, lights being changed, buoys getting shifted etc.. But that is the purpose of Notices to Mariners and Notices to Shipping.
Yeah, for instance they just shifted the buoys marking the Northern Entrance to the Kent Narrows due to shifting sands(mud). I am sure my GPS charts won't reflect that until I get an upgrade and it's hard to tell when the charts will be upgraded by the manufacturer.
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Old 14-06-2011, 10:00   #14
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Re: Navigational aids are a waste of money!

Quote:
Originally Posted by boasun View Post
David is correct here. Plus those aids let you know where the deep and not so deep waters are at. Navigation is an art that sadly is poorly practiced because of those who depend 100% on the GPS. What will they do if a solar flare or someone is jamming the GPS? Yes Major solar flares can knock out the satellites, Yes the GPS can be jammed locally or even turned off by the Military. Who would jam it? Those who don't like you or your life style.
The ATNs are necessary, needed and can help you keep your boat afloat.
The horror stories abound of those naviguessers who run outside the Red or Green line.
Things could get interesting in the very near futurefor those who rely solely on GPS.

www.crunchgear.com/.../fcc-approves-lightsquared-frequencies-gps-now-in- danger/ -
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Old 14-06-2011, 10:05   #15
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Re: Navigational aids are a waste of money!

The same debate once waged about lighthouses. The only lighthouses I see now are museums. Too bad since they could be automated now.
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