Maxsea problem

[S/V Elusive]

Well Fred9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 999999 I can't understand that at all

[hellosailor]

"The only way to truly modify virtual memory is to take a screw driver and remove/add bars of RAM ."
AH, no. Sorry Fred, but VIRTUAL MEMORY has got nothing at all to do with the memory sticks in your computer. Virtual Memory, aka a "paging file" or "swap file" refers to a file on the hard drive which is used as a virtual (meaning, fake) RAM stick.

Depending on your OS it will be called by one of those three names and no matter what you call it, it is slower than real RAM and a last resort to be used when you can't afford real RAM. If the application is working properly, and the OS is working properly, the application can't tell the difference. However, there are limits under every OS as to how much RAM can be allocated to any one program, and to the entire OS including all running programs, and further limits imposed by the computer's own BIOS and memory lines. Any one of those could be problematic. There are also a number of programs written when only governments and major corporations owned terabytes of memory, which simply crash if there is more than 512M of memory in the computer. Or 1G, or 2G, or other arbitrary limits--simply because their programmers never envisioned anyone owning that much.

[scotte]

Originally Posted by Fred999999999999999999999

But one can't modify virtual memory, what you modify is the amount of space you reserve for paging files (which is the amount of hard drive space to be used as a RAM in case the RAM is full).
The only way to truly modify virtual memory is to take a screw driver and remove/add bars of RAM .

Anyway, I did change the virtual memory paging files, as above suggested, and it didn't work. Of course.

Actually, this is not quite technically correct. Physical memory = RAM. Paging space = Disk. Virtual memory = Physical memory + paging space.

[bill good]

G'day It is worth disabling the spyware, firewalls, virus protection & you will find it maywork again. I am just finding trouble after 12mths & the only thing changed was the virus programs. Worth a go.

Regards Bill Goodward

I find the least painful solution when running vintage programs is to run 'em on vintage computers. Saves a lot of swearing and raised blood-pressure. So I'd be inclined to either install WIN98SE as a second operating system and see if that works, or even buy a cheap low-end box to run it on.
I've just installed 7.3.5 on a 'disposable' 1999 Thinkpad 600 using this logic, with no problems - except getting the program to run with a GPS simulator (MaxSea uses $GPGGA for position info, rather than 'GLL or 'GMC) - but the program itself runs fine with a kosher GPS.

Colin

[hellosailor]

"I find the least painful solution when running vintage programs is to run 'em on vintage computers."
Probably right.<G> But you might also try looking at Virtual Server and Virtual PC, which MS has released for free. In theory (the lack of docs and the quality of the docs are both abysmal) you can use VPC to load and run a "virtual" clone of any old computer on any new computer--limited of course by whether there's special hardware or settings that can't be emulated.
Once the bloody spot on my forehead goes away and the masons fix the cracks in the wall, I'm gonna go back to bashing my head on that one, trying to get a clone of a Windows2000 machine to run on a newer Vista machine. They keep telling me it is going to work, and thsat there must be something "Really Simple, Stupid" tripping me up.<G>

Originally Posted by hellosailor

"I find the least painful solution when running vintage programs is to run 'em on vintage computers."
Probably right.<G> But you might also try looking at Virtual Server and Virtual PC, which MS has released for free. In theory (the lack of docs and the quality of the docs are both abysmal) you can use VPC to load and run a "virtual" clone of any old computer on any new computer--limited of course by whether there's special hardware or settings that can't be emulated.
Once the bloody spot on my forehead goes away and the masons fix the cracks in the wall, I'm gonna go back to bashing my head on that one, trying to get a clone of a Windows2000 machine to run on a newer Vista machine. They keep telling me it is going to work, and thsat there must be something "Really Simple, Stupid" tripping me up.<G>

Well to be honest, I'm not at all impressed by ANY 'advanced' windows operating system when it comes to performing relatively simple computing tasks such as those required on a sailboat. I'd say keep things as simple as possible to get the job done, so in my humble opinion, there's really no need for 'virtual' anything ...

If the Hubble telescope can operate with a 486 running DOS or it's equivalent, then navigating a boat is possible with the most antiquated of computers - and talking antique computers - you simply wouldn't believe how primitive the computer is which controls a Polaris submarine ...

I guess having worked in industry back in the 80's using 8-bit processors - when 6Mhz was considered a lightning-fast CPU - and the coding of just a few hundred bytes to control the most complex of machinery has something to do with my present-day attitude regarding PCs.

On a parallel thread someone recently commented "To do ENC takes more horsepower than raster. ENC is all vector graphics so a fast video card helps." - well, that might well indeed be the way things have developed, but it really doesn't have to be like this.
I can run vector charts on DKart Navigator, CMAPECS or Tsunami '99 under WIN95 perfectly well on a 233 pentium, even when underclocked to 166, just as long as there is 32Mb or more of ram available. Even the re-drawing of a vector-based chart every second through the most rubbish of video cards poses no processor demand worth commenting on, so the normal re-drawing frequency presents no problem at all.

I've even run these programs on an ancient 486 laptop, where admittedly 8Mb of ram did slow things down to the point of being unacceptable.

I've recently baled out of discussions on another forum where the guys there are pre-occupied with developing an all-singing all-dancing system with head-up displays and gigahertz processors which would not look out of place on a Euro-fighter.

With vintage laptops being so cheap (I've just paid £100 (= $200) for 3), it's no big deal to have one working with two stashed away safely as backups - and being identical laptops, their sub-assemblies can be swapped around if things should ever become desperate in some foreign port, and where such an old scuffed-up vintage laptop is far less likely to be pinched.

Drive 'em straight from the boat's batteries via a diode, with another Lead-Acid gel battery in circuit as backup. No nasty Li-Ion batteries to explode, catch fire, or simply deteriorate to death in just a couple of years.

With all power-saving functions OFF, my Pentium 300/96Mb ram system pulls less than 1.0A when running, 0.5A with the screen off, around 7mA when suspended (10 seconds to get up-and-running), and of course zero current in hibernation (around 40 seconds to get up-and-running).
I find the best arrangement is to have the system set to run at Maximum performance, and have 'Rain' running in the background to keep the processor HALTed when not engaged in any essential activity. The (Win)98Lite system is totally stable - never had a crash yet.

With figures like these, what case can there be for running a more powerful computer onboard - except perhaps for entertainment ?

"Support Trailing-Edge Technology !" <G>

'best
Colin

[hellosailor]

I agree with you about the KISS principle and how older systems can certainly be enough--for some things at some times. Especially if a system is dedicated and running only one task/application at one time. For those of us who need one newer more flexible and powerful system though, having those older boxes around can mean "more stuff" aka less storage space, more power cords...just more fuss.

I *think* a former client of mine still has a 386-16/SX box running his faxback system as a solo task under DOS, a good decade after it was installed on his "Well we don't use that one for anything" oldest and lowest-speed computer. It does the job. Of course, even when it was configured, that meant taking it offline to transfer files to it--because DOS couldn't handle driving a CD drive and the fax card at the same time. Or, the network card and the fax card at the same time. So the machine did fine--it was just a PITA to update anything on it, since anything that didn't fit on a floppy couldn't be moved to it unless it was offline.

I loved DOS, but it (and Win3.x/Win9.x) had limits. Sometimes, they were enough. Sometimes they weren't.

Have you found a nav program that can do seamless tiling of charts (bitmap or vector) and keep a running ETA and predicted track including updates from currents in realtime, that can run on those old boxes without pausing? I'm just still kinda shocked at the way most nav software can give you an ETA over a course--but hasn't been given the brains to include adjustments for the currents at any particular time, even when current tables are loaded somewhere in the same package.

Fast computers...sophmoric programming. What a wonderful combination. (Not.)

Originally Posted by hellosailor

Have you found a nav program that can do seamless tiling of charts (bitmap or vector) and keep a running ETA and predicted track including updates from currents in realtime, that can run on those old boxes without pausing? I'm just still kinda shocked at the way most nav software can give you an ETA over a course--but hasn't been given the brains to include adjustments for the currents at any particular time, even when current tables are loaded somewhere in the same package.

Not sure I understand the need for an ETA - is somebody running a scheduled ferry service ?

On past performance, whenever I venture offshore there's a case for using a Quiji board to calculate even the Estimated DAY of Arrival, let alone the Time. <LOL>

My next planned trip is a single-handed non-stop around the British Isles, with working the tides being an essential component of the strategy - but even so I can't see a case for anything more than guesstimating each daily run, as even if I could somehow factor in accurate numbers for predicted tidal flow, all it takes is the lad upstairs to pull the plug on the wind, and any calculations instantly become meaningless.

Maybe that's what some folk mean by 'going with the flow ...' ?

'best
Colin

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by SAE140

... I can't see a case for anything more than guesstimating each daily run, as even if I could somehow factor in accurate numbers for predicted tidal flow, all it takes is the lad upstairs to pull the plug on the wind, and any calculations instantly become meaningless.
Maybe that's what some folk mean by 'going with the flow ...' ?
'best
Colin

In his play, “Julius Caesar”, Shakespeare has Brutus urging his comrades to seize a fleeting opportunity in an armed conflict: “There is a tide in the affairs of men / Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune.”

As in the affaires of mankind, oceanic tides Flood in, and Ebb out.

If you try to leave port before high slack tide, you're going against the flow, and working much harder to make progress. After it reaches high tide, the flow reverses, flowing out, and assisting your departure.

I don’t think that either Shakespeare nor most mariners (or some folk) would be suggesting that one should merely drift with the tides; but, rather, that we should seize the moment, and act when favourable conditions exist.

[hellosailor]

Colin-
One hopes you mean a Ouji board.<G>

ETA can be a valuable piece of work when you are running in waters with currents. For instance, come offshore from Cape May up to Ambrose Light, then up the East River through Hell's Gate and continue up to Point Judith, RI.

The timing of your trip can include--literally--two hours spent covering 50 yards in Hell Gate because you've tried to push against flood there. Similarly, your trip up the East River might be one hour, or three.

Figuring out whether you are going to be someplace in day or night, making a 24 hour sail or an 18 hour sail, is going to require figuring the currents for many of us. I'll use routing software and then do my own figuring with an hour-by-hour advance to make manual speed corrections for the currents--but that's donkey work, and donkeys (the computer) should be doing it. It ISN'T hard to program, it is just iterative caculcations with the information that any nav software with current tables already has in it.

Some of the better program$ will do this (I'm told) but I haven't worked with them.


Gord, I'm shocked that you mention "tides", since tides are vertical changes in water level. Tides matter only in terms of clearances and running aground. Horizontal movement of the waters is "currents" and that's what changes a boat's speed and direction.

... all it takes is the lad upstairs to pull the plug on the wind, and any calculations instantly become meaningless.

Maybe that's what some folk mean by 'going with the flow ...' ?

If you should find yourself offshore in an engineless sailboat, in deep water, and the wind dies - then your boat will drift by virtue of whatever currents are under your boat. No amount of quoting Shakespeare, or the pedantic pointing out of spelling errors, or even the chucking out of a sea anchor will do anything to change that. You will simply 'go with the flow' - whether you want to or not.

It seems we are getting a bit off target here. The original concern "I have a problem with Maxsea 7.3.5" Was being effectively addressed. Let's get back to that issue. As many cruisers run this software, a solution will benefit the members of this forum far more than a discussion about the relevance of ETA's.
Such a discussion might warrant another thread.

[Ex-Calif]

Kai Nui - Excellent point - I tried installing MaxSea and had a very similar problem to the OP. I was enjoying this thread very much and will try reducing the memory allocated as described. I think I get the splash screen and then a program lockup.

However talking computer tech around here is like leaving jam on the counter top. First one ant comes along and in an hour we are reinventing computers, ranting against the evil empire in Renton and longing for the days of vacuum tubes and mechanical switches - LOL. Don't get me wrong, I love it when these guys talk dirty!

I won't go any deeper into my MaxSea problem so as not to divert the topic any further but I am looking forward to more techie installements.

[mob44]

Let me change the subject for a moment. it happened to me twice and as much as it is simple I can not figuer out what to do with it. My boat icon on MaxSea is facing all the time north! CAN SOMEONE TELL ME HOW TO MAKE MY BOAT ICON ON THE CHARTS FOLLOW THE TRACK BOAT IS SAILING?