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Old 17-08-2013, 13:26   #211
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Re: GPS as the Sole Means of Navigation.

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Old 17-08-2013, 13:40   #212
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Re: GPS as the Sole Means of Navigation.

Am I dumb or what!! Taking a 65 footer from San Diego to Channel Islands for a couple of weeks later this month and as I've done in the past, I chart a course on a paper chart for Catalina Island (probably already there from years gone by except for deviation correction), dial in the auto pilot from SD #3 on the course and set an alarm to go off when I reach the Separation channel for LA south of Catalina. I've done the same drill late every summer for about 12-15 years on the same boat and never hit anything expensive yet. Just sit in the wheelhouse keeping watch while the owner and his guests sleep, eat, drink, dance, party and run around naked. Not the toughest job in world!! Phil
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Old 17-08-2013, 19:10   #213
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Re: GPS as the Sole Means of Navigation.

Because it is so convenient I now do all my voyage planning using OpenCPN on the computer and transfer the waypoints to my GPS. I do however monitor course keeping whilst running the tracks on a paper chart and probably will continue to do so even if I manage to crack the comms problems and get the computer talking to the autopilot. Having the paper chart and knowing roughly where the boats position is on it provides reassurance to an old codger not completely trusting of electronic gadgets.
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Old 17-08-2013, 21:27   #214
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Because it is so convenient I now do all my voyage planning using OpenCPN on the computer and transfer the waypoints to my GPS. I do however monitor course keeping whilst running the tracks on a paper chart and probably will continue to do so even if I manage to crack the comms problems and get the computer talking to the autopilot. Having the paper chart and knowing roughly where the boats position is on it provides reassurance to an old codger not completely trusting of electronic gadgets.
Very much the same here, but without bothering with GPS waypoints.
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Old 17-08-2013, 22:02   #215
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Re: GPS as the Sole Means of Navigation.

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Originally Posted by S/V Alchemy View Post
Imaging an electronic nav station hinged top! With a clear scratch-proof surface you could draw on and use compasses on!

That would please me greatly. I'd still keep paper charts, but I would love to have a "glass nav station" of that sort.
I do a lot of plotting in OpenCPN. I can do set / drift, all sorts of fixes, danger/clearing bearings, etc..

I tend to do it at home on the desktop. But I do have the program on my netbook. I have hooked it up to an onboard TV for demonstrations.
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Old 18-08-2013, 02:09   #216
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Re: GPS as the Sole Means of Navigation.

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Originally Posted by S/V Alchemy View Post
Imaging an electronic nav station hinged top! With a clear scratch-proof surface you could draw on and use compasses on!

That would please me greatly. I'd still keep paper charts, but I would love to have a "glass nav station" of that sort.
We are not quite there yet, but close. Not many people have not tried an electronic map for traditional navigation, but it works reasonably well.

There is no need for a compass. All the lines you draw will have the bearing automatically calculated in true or magnetic, with very little chance of error.

The screens do not have as much detail as a paper chart yet, but they are getting closer. The 21 inch high definition screen I have is not far behind (and much bigger screens are available) especilly when the ability to zoom in, rather than getting another paper chart is taken into account.

Using an electronic chart for traditional navigation does require different methods. Using your finger on a touch screen instead on a pencil for example.
These methods are much less satisfying than doing the same thing on paper. There is something pleasing and nautical about using a paper chart that is lost on the electronic equivalent. However, if we look objectively there are some advantages such as the reduced chance of making compass, or transcription errors.

With software like Open CPN we even have the opportunity to write program's for features that we would like included.
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Old 18-08-2013, 04:43   #217
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Re: GPS as the Sole Means of Navigation.

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Originally Posted by noelex 77 View Post
We are not quite there yet, but close. Not many people have not tried an electronic map for traditional navigation, but it works reasonably well.

There is no need for a compass. All the lines you draw will have the bearing automatically calculated in true or magnetic, with very little chance of error.

The screens do not have as much detail as a paper chart yet, but they are getting closer. The 21 inch high definition screen I have is not far behind (and much bigger screens are available) especilly when the ability to zoom in, rather than getting another paper chart is taken into account.

Using an electronic chart for traditional navigation does require different methods. Using your finger on a touch screen instead on a pencil for example.
These methods are much less satisfying than doing the same thing on paper. There is something pleasing and nautical about using a paper chart that is lost on the electronic equivalent. However, if we look objectively there are some advantages such as the reduced chance of making compass, or transcription errors.

With software like Open CPN we even have the opportunity to write program's for features that we would like included.
I'm pretty sure a raster chart is exactly the same detail as a paper chart (raster definition)) in the guys that print them. Not sure where detail is lost....in fact I can zoom so close I can actually read what I wouldn't be able to in dim light on a paper chart.
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Old 18-08-2013, 05:26   #218
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pirate Re: GPS as the Sole Means of Navigation.

I'm afraid I will never have that much trust/faith in electronics... same with doctors...
So I'll stick with what I'm good at...
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Old 18-08-2013, 05:39   #219
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Re: GPS as the Sole Means of Navigation.

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I'm pretty sure a raster chart is exactly the same detail as a paper chart (raster definition)) in the guys that print them. Not sure where detail is lost....in fact I can zoom so close I can actually read what I wouldn't be able to in dim light on a paper chart.
I probably should have said information at any one time.
A printed admarlty sized chart contains more information at any one time than a screen can display (at least the sort of sized screens that are used on yacht)

As you point out you can recover his detail if you zoom in, but then some of the bigger picture is lost.

A big advantage of an electronic chart is as you zoom in it will automatically change to a more detailed chart. This is far easier than than switching charts as is necessary with paper. The much lower cost of electronic charts also means you are far more likely to have the more detailed chart.

The biggest drawback of electronic charts is still the inability to display as much information in one take as the paper equivalent.
Many people find this makes planning more difficult.
I can see their point, but the ability of electonic charts to zoom in does compensate for this. Possible refuges where you might be able to anchor in the event of bad weather or equipment failure can be fully explored along the route in the planning stage. Google earth images, or predicted weather information can also be directly laid on the chart. Multiple map sources can be compared side by side if necessary.

I also find that it is much easier to casually explore a route on an electonic chart without formally sitting down at the chart table. Unexpected route variations can be plotted without leaving the cockpit if necessary.

All this means that it is rare that I consult a paper chart ( other than a pilot book, but electronic versions of these will soon replace what is available in print).

However I do have the view that traditional navigational techniques are important and I employ these.
Its a shame so few few people marry the best of old (navigational techniques) with the best of new (electronic charts). There seems a persistent view that electronic charts only work with a GPS position.
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Old 18-08-2013, 10:52   #220
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Re: GPS as the Sole Means of Navigation.

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However I do have the view that traditional navigational techniques are important and I employ these.
Its a shame so few few people marry the best of old (navigational techniques) with the best of new (electronic charts). There seems a persistent view that electronic charts only work with a GPS position.
This is essentially my position; I'm no Luddite, but I think that the discipline and situational awareness of the older methods (including the venerable "looking out at the water") is still the best basis from which to make full use of electronic navigation. After all, electronic and paper charts employ the same concepts of bearing, heading, set, drift, deviation, variation and so on. If you haven't understood these terms in an "analog" fashion, while holding a hand bearing compass and peering at a couple of pointy things ashore.

Having that foundation makes one a better navigator, period. Lacking it increases the odds that one may be misled or will fail to see elements both basic and critical on the electronic chart.
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Old 18-08-2013, 18:37   #221
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You are welcome.

As an IYT instructor I am accredited to administer the ICC exams here in Canada. I have only done one; it was not that onerous for me or the candidate. He was also writing CYA exams at the same time. That took more time and effort.

As to electronic navigation, I am a somewhat old school and think that folks should have experience in paper navigation before using electronic navigation. That might explain why I prefer raster, rather than vector, charts. I also like to look at a proper sized paper chart when passage planning. I might change my mind when I see 36" chartplotter.
http://goodereader.com/blog/electron...-paper-display

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Old 18-08-2013, 19:20   #222
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Re: GPS as the Sole Means of Navigation.

Those poor angels must be so tired of all the dancing ...
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Old 18-08-2013, 21:46   #223
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Re: GPS as the Sole Means of Navigation.

That was three years ago. Have you seen one?
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