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Old 04-08-2012, 12:58   #16
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Re: Black and White Repro Charts?

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By the way, those charts are illegal in Canada. Slim chance you will be caught but if you ever had a problem and CG or RCMP boarded your boat you could be fined. By the way they are a poor choice, IMHO.

DeepFrz,
Very interesting information concerning the illegality of Bellingham charts in Canada. I have seen them in the past and they looked very proficient. I was told by Bellingham they are copies of the NOAA charts. As a Canadian and a mariner, what is your opinion concerning this law? How would this apply to mariners from other countries who sailed into Canada and were not aware of Canada's law concerning nautical charts? Your thoughts would be appreciated.
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Old 04-08-2012, 13:07   #17
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Re: Black and White Repro Charts?

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If you want a very high quality chart you should consider those made by Ocean Grafix. They are higher quality than government printed charts and all corrections are made up to the day you order them. I'm an Ocean Grafix dealer and would love the chance to quote you on them. They won't be as cheap as black and white photo copies but they are much higher quality. They are printed on high quality water resistant paper.

HopCar -- I can't find these on your website. Where should I look?

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Old 04-08-2012, 13:18   #18
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Re: Black and White Repro Charts?

rognvald; Some time ago there was a piece published about the police charging people with copied charts. I do not know if that still happens or not.

Canadian charts are published by the Canadian Govt. and they hold the copy-write. I dont know where NOAA would have got hold of Canadian Charts except from the Canadian Hydrographic Dept. and if they are publishing them without a license then they are breaking Canadian Law. Any person using copies of Canadian charts in Canadian water is subject to being charged with an offense unless they were published under license.

That is my understanding of it anyway.
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Old 04-08-2012, 13:24   #19
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Re: Black and White Repro Charts?

I had some in the past, Hated them. very difficult to read, you get confused where the land and water begin etc. For my money , I'll take 30 year old real charts. You can get these at used marine supply places by the dozens last time I looked.
Here's an example of the problem: you are coming up on a cape. just off the cape there may be a rock or small island. Just adjacent to the rock is a "hole" in the depth readings. In B&W, the hole (identified by a crcular ring) will look like the rock.... both are a circle shape of sorts.
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Old 04-08-2012, 13:28   #20
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Re: Black and White Repro Charts?

I agree with Cheechako on the issue of readability. Especially at night.

30 yr old charts are very dangerous. Channels change, lights move, etc.
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Old 04-08-2012, 13:36   #21
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Re: Black and White Repro Charts?

actually, no charts are totally safe. channels do move... within 6 months sometimes! lights in the third world are often missing completely, miles off, different designation etc. The terrain and general info doesnt move. Whether you buy brand new charts or 30 year old ones, you need to update them immediately and often.... if you are going to rely solely on them. I dont ever remember consulting a light list for corrections, although I had them (usually out of date also!) The chart is just one tool for me. Many are labeled "not to be used for navigation" Ha! If i'm even remotely clse to a potential problem.... new or old chart... I'm outta there!
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Old 04-08-2012, 13:37   #22
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Re: Black and White Repro Charts?

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Originally Posted by DeepFrz View Post
rognvald; Some time ago there was a piece published about the police charging people with copied charts. I do not know if that still happens or not.

Canadian charts are published by the Canadian Govt. and they hold the copy-write. I dont know where NOAA would have got hold of Canadian Charts except from the Canadian Hydrographic Dept. and if they are publishing them without a license then they are breaking Canadian Law. Any person using copies of Canadian charts in Canadian water is subject to being charged with an offense unless they were published under license.

That is my understanding of it anyway.

DeepFrz,
Thanks for the information. That certainly makes sense. I looked at Bellingham's site and they offer CHS charts of Canadian water. I wonder if they have an agreement with Canada to print these charts and, if so, would they still be illegal? Take a look for yourself. Discounted Nautical Charts, Reproductions, Electronic Charts & Navigational Software | Bellingham Chart Printers
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Old 04-08-2012, 13:46   #23
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Re: Black and White Repro Charts?

If you're sailing in first world waters, up-to-date-charts may be of some value, but anywhere else, buoys/lights/transits are not reliable and not maintained so an out of date/basic chart of depth and landmarks is all you need. Final approach in any exotic location can only be an eyeball/depthsounder/slow and cautious thing.
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Old 04-08-2012, 14:27   #24
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Re: Black and White Repro Charts?

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If you're sailing in first world waters, up-to-date-charts may be of some value, but anywhere else, buoys/lights/transits are not reliable and not maintained so an out of date/basic chart of depth and landmarks is all you need. Final approach in any exotic location can only be an eyeball/depthsounder/slow and cautious thing.
Exactly true! Well said! Everybody listen up, 'cause this is the real world calling. In much of the world, if new charts are available they merely repeat the mis-information shown on the older versions. New surveys are very expensive, and only areas with significant commercial traffic get them.

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Old 04-08-2012, 15:49   #25
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Re: Black and White Repro Charts?

rognvald.

From that link you posted.

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Canadian Hydrographic Service (CHS) navigational charts are only available as originals. BCP is also an official chart agent for CHS. CHS charts are $19.95 each.
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Old 04-08-2012, 20:08   #26
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Re: Black and White Repro Charts?

The Way, I haven't figured out how to get them on my website yet. Here is a link to the Ocean Grafix website. OceanGrafix
If you email me a list of the chart numbers you are interested in, I'll be glad to quote you.
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Old 05-08-2012, 00:42   #27
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Re: Black and White Repro Charts?

I bought some Bellingham charts a few years ago...I gave 'em away...useless...cheap, but useless..to me anyway. Printed words are too small for my eyes, B&W is very hard to discern coastline from depth contours....all in all, I much prefer British admiralty charts for where I sail.
And, yes some of them are very out of date..i think the chart for Va'Vau is still the 1872 version !!
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Old 05-08-2012, 08:39   #28
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Re: Black and White Repro Charts?

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In much of the world, if new charts are available they merely repeat the mis-information shown on the older versions.
When I was sailing on the West Coast of Canada I used to get chart amendments mailed to me. I believe it was monthly. I would spend quite a bit of time updating my charts. Whenever I bought a new chart the chandler would update them to the last released amendments. This was most important to me and I believe it should be to anyone.
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Old 05-08-2012, 11:29   #29
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Re: Black and White Repro Charts?

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The Way, I haven't figured out how to get them on my website yet. Here is a link to the Ocean Grafix website. OceanGrafix
If you email me a list of the chart numbers you are interested in, I'll be glad to quote you.
Thanks, HopCar, I'll check them out!

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