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Old 01-09-2011, 14:47   #1
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Angry Rocna Recall - China vs Canada Quality Comparison

I purchased a Rockna 10 in spring 2011 as my primary anchor, and after spending almost a month hanging off it during various sea trials in preparation for extended voyaging, was appalled - absolutely appalled - to learn about substandard steel being substituted after it's manufacture was outsourced to China from Canada.

After research and verification that Rockna had changed ownership, and that the new owners had become lax with their standards, I became concerned, and stopped by my local West Marine to investigate, and possibly return my anchor, and begin the process of finding a suitable replacement.

To my surprise, both a Chinese sourced and a Canadian sourced Rockna 10 were on the floor:



I'm not even going to tell you which one is which.

Just look at the photo, and it's OBVIOUS that one of these anchors is of very poor quality and craftsmanship.

I'm a retired Architect.

It was my job to make sure this sort of thing NEVER happened to the buildings I was responsible for. If a contractor did sloppy work or substituted ANYTHING without my approval, I made him fix it, or he didn't get paid.

I wasn't very popular with contractors, but my clients were happy, and my buildings don't leak or fall down.

The lack of quality is obvious in the above photos, even from a distance, and further, it serves as a good way to identify the outsourced anchors - just look at the welds.

This is an outrage, and in my opinion, Rockna needs to stop making excuses and immediately apologize for this - or they deserve to go bankrupt.

If anyone is ever hurt because of this, Rockna's management and owners should be held criminally negligent - as I would be as an Architect if deliberate negligence on my part injured or killed anyone.

They should be held civilly liable if anyone loses property because of this, again, just like a US Architect.

Anchors a critical system - life, limb, and property are on the line. All Rockna had to do was LOOK at what was coming out of thier contractor's factory, and they would have know - so it was either blind negligence or deliberate maleficence on their part to allow this to happen. Their attempt to cover it up is beyond the pale, and argues strongly for the latter.

Detailed photos to follow. Right now I'm returning my anchor -West Marine is holding the Canadian one for me, and has removed the China Anchor from the floor. It's very unfortunate, because my anchor always set quickly, held solidly, and never dragged. It's an excellent design.

I was confident in it until I examined the welds this afternoon, and sure enough - they are no where near the quality of the known Canadian anchor in the photo above, though not as bad as the ones in the other anchor.

I have a feeling the old Canadian Rocknas will become collector's items after they go out of business over this - just like the original Bruce I own.

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Old 01-09-2011, 14:55   #2
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Re: Rockna Recall - China vs Canda Quality Comparison

Unfortunately this is not the only example of this kind of thing. A well known European manufacturer of lifebuoys as used on commercial ships outsourced production to China. After a period of time quality control became complacent and the inevitable happened. A lifebuoy was being tested to SOLAS requirements and failed. This turned out to be due to sub-standard flotation material being used and a safety device that would have barely floated itself let alone support the weight of a drowning man. Decent stuff can be made in China but QC has to very, very thorough.
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Old 01-09-2011, 14:58   #3
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Re: Rockna Recall - China vs Canda Quality Comparison

Hogan,

Thanks so much for sharing that pic and your info. I have watched the anchor threads (ad nauseum) and wondered how big a deal the lesser quality was. After all good enough does the job as well as perfect.

But my eye went to that weld and bugged out.

Of all the numbers and ranting and defending and such, that has gone on over these anchors, this is the last word in my book.
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Old 01-09-2011, 15:03   #4
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Re: Rockna Recall - China vs Canda Quality Comparison

On another thread on this forum someone who had done a fair bit of business in China made a comment that the quality control was excellent if you paid for it, but non-existent if you didn't. It looks like we have another situation where max. profit outweighs quality with no regard to safety. One of those units looks like it was hand forged, the other looks like it was cast.
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Old 01-09-2011, 15:06   #5
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Re: Rockna Recall - China vs Canda Quality Comparison

Also notice the bends/angles aren't as "crisp" and the galvanizing cruder on one anchor versus the other.

Aware that welds can be stronger than the parts their join, I'm wary about relying on welds on an anchor.
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Old 01-09-2011, 15:16   #6
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Re: Rocna Recall - China vs Canda Quality Comparison

We are a wal-mart nation. None of this surprises me...
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Old 01-09-2011, 15:57   #7
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Re: Rockna Recall - China vs Canda Quality Comparison

Quote:
Originally Posted by sarafina View Post
Hogan,

Thanks so much for sharing that pic and your info. I have watched the anchor threads (ad nauseum) and wondered how big a deal the lesser quality was. After all good enough does the job as well as perfect.

But my eye went to that weld and bugged out.

Of all the numbers and ranting and defending and such, that has gone on over these anchors, this is the last word in my book.
I agree, and appreciate the post also.

Just out of curiosity, why was it considered ranting before>? My voice was one of those who saw the obvious problem with the shift to China, still not sure why there was such a backlash against some of these discussions early on...
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Old 01-09-2011, 16:00   #8
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Re: Rocna Recall - China vs Canda Quality Comparison

Didn't say you were ranting Faith.

These Rocna threads have been going for A LONG TIME. Trust me, there has been ranting and posturing on both sides, as well as some cogent and coherent arguments.
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Old 01-09-2011, 16:01   #9
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Re: Rocna Recall - China vs Canda Quality Comparison

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hogan View Post
After research and verification that Rockna had changed ownership, and that the new owners had become lax with their standards, I became concerned, and stopped by my local West Marine to investigate, and possibly return my anchor, and begin the process of finding a suitable replacement.

To my surprise, both a Chinese sourced and a Canadian sourced Rockna 10 were on the floor:
I am surprised that there are ANY Canadian/NZ anchors left in the supply pipeline.

Secondly, I can't believe the difference in quality. As said before, the Chinese one looks like it was cast.

I wonder how Rocna is going to explain this one?
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Old 01-09-2011, 21:35   #10
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Angry Re: Rocna Recall - China vs Canda Quality Comparison

I'm hopping mad about this - to think, Rockna's new owners debased an excellent design to make a few $$$$ more, thereby risking my life, my ship, my dreams, and my HOME, along with thousands of others - all for greed.



This is exactly why I retired from the Architecture profession, (and teaching Architecture) - GREED.



It's why I moved onto a 20 foot boat, went off grid, and became as self sufficient as possible - to protest this exact sort of thing - I saw it repeatedly as an Architect, so I quit, and started teaching - Then I saw it had invaded the colleges I taught at, so I quit those jobs too. I've sold or donated everything I own, burned the rest, and retired from wage slavery on less than $500 per month, and will start voyaging the world - IN PROTEST - and hopefully as an example to the next generation - and my former students.



AND now GREED is trying to creep onto my beautiful ship and destroy it like a filthy, diseased wharf rat!

Well, I'll not tolerate it!

Not on MY watch!

Hold onto your hats now....

Detail of Chinese shaft to fluke weld:



Detail of Canada shaft to fluke weld:



Outside detail of Canada roll bar weld:



Inside detail of Canada roll bar weld:



Outside detail of China roll bar weld:



Inside detail of China roll bar weld:



Made in Canada UPC:



My replacement (of Canadian providence) anchor at rest on Nomad's bowsprit after a no hassle exchange at West Marine:



Now, I'd like to make a few comments:

First -

Regarding West Marine:

I can't tell you how many people have called me a fool - and worse! for spending my meager, carefully husbanded savings there.

"What a waste of money! XYZ online has that Spar Perfect Varnish for 2/3rds, free shipping and no tax!"

"Worst Marine"

"Tiffany's"

etc, etc, etc, etc....

Yet the Marina Del Rey West Marine has NEVER given me ANY hassle when I've returned something.

It's rare to have to bring something back, though inevitable over the two years I've been preparing my ship for cruising.

They accepted a 12 month old battery I killed, no questions asked, giving me store credit.

They recently took back TWO handheld depth finders without question and without a receipt - they just looked up the transactions, and offered me a refund or store credit.

A month ago I purchased an expensive pair of Ray-Ban's to replace a set I'd purchased from them - and lost - for a 10 day trip to Catalina.

I found the lost pair when I came back, and they TOOK BACK THE PAIR I'D USED FOR TWO WEEKS OF CRUISING!

And today, they let me photograph the POS China Anchor and the Quality Canada anchor on the floor, before APOLOGIZING about the China anchor being mistakenly put on sale, and then removing it from inventory!

Their employees are always helpful and friendly, most know me by name, and that's why I keep shopping there - well, that and I can walk there from my slip...

I've spent around $20k there prepping Nomad as a result of such outstanding customer service - and turned my back on a venerable local chandlery - after they hassled me over the return of a Lifeline AGM battery that refused to hold a charge of 12 volts! - right off the shelf! THE NEXT DAY!

It took me a month to get another SUBSTANDARD battery from that outfit - and now I've got to replace it also (In the interim I've learned much about the voodoo surrounding marine electronics, and will be acquiring an ABYC certification in it before setting off)

Second:

What are Rockna's current owners thinking?

Haven't they heard of the internet?

People like me will not tolerate lies, corruption, and greed any longer - we all have printing presses now, and truth will always emerge from lies.

We will expose them, and those who try to profit from them. The bad guys are going to have to find a different way to satisfy their greed than at the expense of honest people.

Its a new world Warf Rats:

Secrecy, lies, and deception are part of the old one.

Forums like this restore my faith in humanity.

I'd suggest shorting Rockna Stock - unless they own up to this and make amends, their ship is lost -

It's already aground and foundering - and they are trying to kedge off with a defective anchor.

Serves them right.

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Old 01-09-2011, 21:59   #11
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Re: Rocna Recall - China vs Canda Quality Comparison

Do you have any idea were the Canadian one came from...they haven't been produce there since 2008 I believe?
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Old 01-09-2011, 23:20   #12
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Re: Rocna Recall - China vs Canada Quality Comparison

I got lucky I suppose - look at the Canada UPC and contact that supplier - maybe they have some left in stock.

What a shame....great designs are only as good as their execution.

Its a classic lesson I've tried to impart to my Architecture students for the past 15 years.
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Old 01-09-2011, 23:39   #13
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Re: Rocna Recall - China vs Canada Quality Comparison

Quote:
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I got lucky I suppose - look at the Canada UPC and contact that supplier - maybe they have some left in stock.

What a shame....great designs are only as good as their execution.

Its a classic lesson I've tried to impart to my Architecture students for the past 15 years.
The distributor for Rocna in North America is the same company that used to make them in Canada.

From what I can determine, Rocna decided to move all manufacturing to China, and offered the company who use to build them the distributorship.

As a result of that, I find it strange that a Canadian anchor would still exist in the supply chain.

Regardless, good for you!

Perhaps if Grant read this he can fill us in on exactly what happened.
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Old 02-09-2011, 01:17   #14
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Re: Rocna Recall - China vs Canada Quality Comparison

China is a third world country. I dont care how much money they might have, its still third world because of their lack of ethics, morals, integrity, sense of right and wrong, lack of quality.........blah blah

You get the message. Over the past 20 years, we in the west have seen millions of jobs going east because the manufacturing costs are less.

This is why they are less and we are to blame. We always want cheap, cheap as possible. Ask yerself punk, cheap is as cheap does.

Now its got to the point where the discerning purchaser cannot find many alternatives to chinese made crap. China has won a market and hold too many of the cards for us to fight back.

With that market share, they have bought most of the worlds resources like rare earth magnets, copper, tin, lead etc. I bought an outside tap for the yard and didnt realise how crap it was until it was shredding tap washers. The internal machining at the valve base was rubbish which is why it was chewing washers. Its typical of chinese micky mouse quality

We are all to blame but what to do about it?
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Old 02-09-2011, 01:29   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anjou
China is a third world country. I dont care how much money they might have, its still third world because of their lack of ethics, morals, integrity, sense of right and wrong, lack of quality.........blah blah

You get the message. Over the past 20 years, we in the west have seen millions of jobs going east because the manufacturing costs are less.

This is why they are less and we are to blame. We always want cheap, cheap as possible. Ask yerself punk, cheap is as cheap does.

Now its got to the point where the discerning purchaser cannot find many alternatives to chinese made crap. China has won a market and hold too many of the cards for us to fight back.

With that market share, they have bought most of the worlds resources like rare earth magnets, copper, tin, lead etc. I bought an outside tap for the yard and didnt realise how crap it was until it was shredding tap washers. The internal machining at the valve base was rubbish which is why it was chewing washers. Its typical of chinese micky mouse quality

We are all to blame but what to do about it?
I remember when Japanese cars were referred to as been "Jap crap"
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