Mother of an anchor

[Vasco]

Have switched from a 44# Bruce to a 45# Manson Supreme as my primary anchor. Got rid of my old CQR which was my secondary and the Bruce is my secondary now. Very pleased with the Manson's performance so far. Boat is in Miami and I'm home for three weeks.

[CSY Man]

Manson Supreme...?

Don't know that type.
Similar to the German Bulwaga?
Or one of the types made in New Zealand or Australia?

Why did ya pick the Manson?

[Vasco]

CSY Man,

Another Kiwi anchor, similar to the Rocna, in fact it seems to be a knock off of the Rocna. I was going to go for a Delta but I think the Supreme is a bit better with the roll bar and it was a bit less expensive. The Rocna is too expensive here as it lacks a good distributer. Talking about anchors I actually saw a boat with a Hydrobubble and it was on a 56 footer, one of those Taiwan boats, looked like a CT. I got mine from Azure Marine in FL. Pretty good service. Another board member got one from Azure and was quite happy. Azure Marine Home Page

[ssullivan]

Interesting post. I have a light 35lb CQR I'm thinking about retiring. I'll keep the 45lb CQR, but want to get the anchor that best compliments the CQR. I suppose that's one that works very well in soft mud and possibly large rocks. How much was this Manson, and does the metal seem to be of quality?

[cat man do]

Here's a post I put in a couple of month's ago re: a Manson Supreme

Interestingly I have just had a look at a site of an Australian retailer and it's reckons a 15m boat, which is what i'm building, needs a 60 lb plough, but after emailing Manson , they got back to me the same day, they reckon i'll need a 45lb Manson Supreme, which is similar to the Rochna anchor and several others.

Reasoning being the extra holding ability of the newer style.

This anchor also has Lloyds certification, which some of the others may not have.

the retail prices are 60lb Yum Cha generick plough.......... $237
........................ . 60lb Manson plough........................ $299

....................... . 45 lb Manson Supreme [new style]......$440


Don't know why you'd buy the generick plough for a saving of $60, and there is a bit of difference between the manson plough and manson supreme at $130 more.

You'd think being 15kg lighter it would be cheaper, but if it has the same or better hold than a 60lb plough, I know where i'll be spending my money.

Dave

[ssullivan]

Just checked out the Manson Supreme in detail. Interesting. One of the best features also has me a bit concerned. What would happen if you had a day where you had a 180 degree wind shift (or current shift) and you were using that neat feature for anchoring in rocky bottoms (ie: the slot in the shank)?

Would it gracefully trip the anchor for you as your shackle slid up the shank?

If so, would you then be dragging an anchor along with the chain on the wrong end, as in close to the flukes?

I know there are some anchor guys on here... What would happen?

I like the design (like the Rocna), but am uncertain about 180 degree shifts while using the sliding slot on the shank, which is one of the best features....

thoughts?

[cat man do]

When i spoke to the Aus. Distributor re this issue he suggested that using the slot was probably the go as a day anchor situation in reefy waters, but as a longer overnight prospect a rope and float from the hoop would be a better option.

Makes sense.

I can also get 2 Manson Supremes for the price of 1 compared to other NZ brand's

Dave

[soul searcher]

Hey Cat a 45# CQR costs $672.00 at west marine. Yikes! I got one in the back af my truck Ill sell for that and trow in shipin.

Vasco have you used the anchor much or did you just get it? I'm down to either the manson(need to change the name i think of charles every time)
Or the Rocna, maybe Craig Smith will trade me He needs a new test anchor I can tell Good pic that looks like a lot of weight in the tip! of the anchor. how well does it fit on the roller? yours look just like mine. rollers that is.

Matt
Oh ya limited time offer subject to how I feel at any givin minute no returns no guarentee no whining. limited to stock on hand free shipping to the lower 48
feet of my driveway price does not include fuel sur charge or expendable shop supply charge. tax, tag, title, insurance, extra.

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by soul searcher

Hey Cat a 45# CQR costs $672.00 at west marine. Yikes! I got one in the back af my truck Ill sell for that and trow in shipin.

Why would I want to spend $672 US = $851 AUD on a CQR, when the Manson cost to me is $347 US = $440 AUD on my door ??

I think the YIKES was for the "other " NZ brand that is twice as expensive.

Dave

[soul searcher]

didnt think you would. remember sarcasm? my bad I forgot the smiley

[CSY Man]

Aye, anchors.

Being a former live-aboard with no boat insurance way back when, I did look at anchors and still do.

Present boat: CSY 33 Cutter/Sloop;
It "came" with a 35 lbs. CQR as a primary and several back-up anchors of various types. (20 lbs Danforth, 40Lbs. West Marine High Performance )

Dragged good on the CQR 35 when anchored in a bad spot 7 years ago.
Got back to town and ditched all the anchors that came with the boat and purchased a Delta 55 for primary, a Fortress 55 for 'Canes and a Danforth 12lbs Hi-Tensile for stern Anchor.

So far so good, but need another hook for secondary working anchor. Looking at a Fortress 23, but open for ideas. (Price is also a factor, the Fortress can be on my deck for about $225 US)

Been impressed with the Marocon/French Spade on a friends boat, but them things are really expensive.

Delta seems to be the ultimate compromise of price and performance, but I can not fit the shape on my cabin top, hence the Fortress 23 in my future.
(Got a flat space with Danforth style chocks on the cabin top, a plow would not do, on the other hand, one of these new anchors.....)

[Vasco]

Soul Searcher,

I've only used the anchor a dozen times or so since I got it, mostly in mud and sand (not hard packed). The conditions have varied from calm to 35 knots. I am impressed by how quickly it sets and how little chain is needed when setting the hook. When I was anchoring in 35 knots it set so fast it stripped the clutch on the windlass, the Bruce used to drag a bit before setting. Looking forward to trying it out in hard sand with grass. The Bruce was useless there.

Did a quick informal survey in the marina where I left the boat. Delta seems to be the most popular hook there.

[soul searcher]

Thats good to know thanks! around here Its either hard sand or bayou slop. My fortress sets fast in all but I have a hard time with the others in the sand be curios to know how it does.

[craigsmith]

Originally Posted by soul searcher

Or the Rocna, maybe Craig Smith will trade me He needs a new test anchor I can tell Good pic that looks like a lot of weight in the tip! of the anchor.

In fact the weight in the Supreme's tip as a % of the anchor's weight is quite bad. It varies between 17 and 23%, vs 33% on the Rocna.

Originally Posted by ssullivan

Just checked out the Manson Supreme in detail. Interesting. One of the best features also has me a bit concerned. What would happen if you had a day where you had a 180 degree wind shift (or current shift) and you were using that neat feature for anchoring in rocky bottoms (ie: the slot in the shank)?

Would it gracefully trip the anchor for you as your shackle slid up the shank?

If so, would you then be dragging an anchor along with the chain on the wrong end, as in close to the flukes?

That is exactly what will happen, and means you can hardly ever use the slot. The slot itself is copied from the Australian SARCA. Furthermore it hasn't been copied "properly"; the SARCA slot goes much farther forward - the Manson version sees the anchor balance horizontally when hung from the forward most point, so it doesn't work very well in the best of circumstances.

The slot requires heightening the shank, which creates bow-roller compatibility issues, and gives trouble when retrieving the anchor as it will lie the side of the shank and not right itself.

In addition to this, the gas cutting of the slot in the supposedly high tensile steel (they follow our specifications with regard to metal types exactly) is a terrible thing to do to high tensile metal; it creates weak points and lowers the strength considerably.

Originally Posted by cat man do

Why would I want to spend $672 US = $851 AUD on a CQR, when the Manson cost to me is $347 US = $440 AUD on my door ??

I think the YIKES was for the "other " NZ brand that is twice as expensive.

Like the CQR, and genuine Bruce, and Rocna, you get what you pay for. The generic ploughs do not perform as well as a CQR, nor are they as strong or durable. Manson have, like every other anchor in their range, copied the Rocna, and not truly understood everything they've done. The result is a cheap imitation with severe flaws.

Here is a comparison of a Manson plow vs a genuine CQR: http://www.rocna.com/distributable/c...na_testing.pdf

With regard to the Supreme specifically, one practical result can be seen in the recent SAIL testing, where the Supreme ranked only middle-of-the-road with an averaged "max before releasing" figure of 2400lbs, whereas the original Rocna scored exactly double at 4,800lbs. The Rocna was also smaller. The low figure of the copy is the result of a poor showing in one of the three tests, indicating an inconsistency of performance.

[Vasco]

Craig,

Do you have a test similar to the one you posted (Rocna,Manson Plow, CQR) but with the Supreme and the Rocna. Would be interested in seeing that. Your methodology in those tests was fairly simple and would be easy to reproduce.

I was concerned with the bow roller issue and the distributor agreed to take it back if it didn't fit. As you can see from the picture it fits quite well. One problem with this type of anchor is that I have to make sure it is oriented right before homing it in the roller and I have to take care that the roll bar doesn't hit the bow if the anchor comes up facing the wrong way. I don't use swivels on my anchors.