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Old 05-07-2014, 07:03   #46
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Re: Mantus vs Rocna

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Thanks for the intelligence and character assessment. I appreciate it.

I understand precisely what you are saying. What I am trying to get across, and obviously doing a very very poor job of it is that you have no knowledge or experience on the subject of the Excel yet you seem happy to promulgate hearsay from unsourced people. I don't understand why you would do that. If you can reference a single person who has experience with the excel and thinks its just like a delta, fine.
I think what you meant to say is; Mantus is as almost as good as a Bugel cause they look the same, and I've had mediocre luck with Bugels

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Old 05-07-2014, 07:12   #47
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Re: Mantus vs Rocna

I would buy a Rocna. CMP liked the design and decided to buy it. They did so knowing they would have to deal with PR mess made by the previous owner. The issue was the previous owner used a lower grade steel than advertised (even these "low strength" anchors used the same grade steel as Mantus which I haven't heard being a problem). In either case, not CMPs fault and they will warranty it even if they didn't build it.

I wanted to address that background first as some believe Mantus is more ethical than Rocna. Well Rocna isn't a company, CMP is- and I think actually paying for intellectual property and taking care of people who were mislead by another company isn't so bad.

For the design - the Rocna is welded into one piece and of higher grade steel (here we go again :S) - it is more compact and robust. Mantus (like Fortress) construction allows parts to be replaced, but I'd rather just not break it in the first place.

For a given weight the Mantus is wider and thinner. This will improve performance a bit in soft bottoms - but you might be starting to see a theme here. Same reason I sail a boat with a massive encapsulated keel. I lose a bit of performance for the piece of mind and ruggedness of not having it held on by bolts. But at the end of the day for the 99% of us that will never push them anywhere near the limits - it really doesn't matter. Spend your money on whatever hugely expensive chunk of steel makes you happy.
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Old 13-07-2014, 16:25   #48
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Re: Mantus vs Rocna

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Originally Posted by SV Lift View Post
I would buy a Rocna. CMP liked the design and decided to buy it. They did so knowing they would have to deal with PR mess made by the previous owner. The issue was the previous owner used a lower grade steel than advertised (even these "low strength" anchors used the same grade steel as Mantus which I haven't heard being a problem). In either case, not CMPs fault and they will warranty it even if they didn't build it.

I wanted to address that background first as some believe Mantus is more ethical than Rocna. Well Rocna isn't a company, CMP is- and I think actually paying for intellectual property and taking care of people who were mislead by another company isn't so bad.

For the design - the Rocna is welded into one piece and of higher grade steel (here we go again :S) - it is more compact and robust. Mantus (like Fortress) construction allows parts to be replaced, but I'd rather just not break it in the first place.

For a given weight the Mantus is wider and thinner. This will improve performance a bit in soft bottoms - but you might be starting to see a theme here. Same reason I sail a boat with a massive encapsulated keel. I lose a bit of performance for the piece of mind and ruggedness of not having it held on by bolts. But at the end of the day for the 99% of us that will never push them anywhere near the limits - it really doesn't matter. Spend your money on whatever hugely expensive chunk of steel makes you happy.
You really should check out post 339 in this thread. Scary. The problem with low strength shanks is real, no question.

Photos of Anchors Setting
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Old 14-07-2014, 05:47   #49
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Re: Mantus vs Rocna

Wrong link
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Old 14-07-2014, 16:05   #50
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Re: Mantus vs Rocna

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Wrong link
post 339 in that link works for me.
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Old 14-07-2014, 16:20   #51
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Re: Mantus vs Rocna

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post 339 in that link works for me.
And it works even better if you link the specific post instead of the whole page...

>> Photos of Anchors Setting
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Old 14-07-2014, 16:24   #52
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Re: Mantus vs Rocna

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And it works even better if you link the specific post instead of the whole page...

>> Photos of Anchors Setting
Point taken although I felt the page would give good context. cheers
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Old 14-07-2014, 16:46   #53
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Re: Mantus vs Rocna

While I agree that anchor shanks are better unbendable, post 344 following your reference shows that despite a significant bend, the anchor still performs more or less normally... at least in this seabed.

Further, it is said that Mantus has gone to a stiffer grade of steel subsequent to the manufacture date of the bent anchor, so they have responsibly reacted to a perceived fault.

I don't have a dog in this fight (being happy with my Supreme) but don't see the situation as at all "scary" with the Mantus.

Cheers,

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Old 14-07-2014, 17:12   #54
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Re: Mantus vs Rocna

The bent shank is from a previous generation of the Mantus, they have since upgraded the steele in the shank is made of. They also offered to replace them for anyone with the old shank... show me another maker who would do that?
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Old 14-07-2014, 17:16   #55
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Re: Mantus vs Rocna

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But lead ballast has a couple of drawbacks: ....(b) makes it hard or impossible to regalvanize the anchor.
I have a Simpson Lawrence Delta ancohor which was re-galvanized last year. I was told it could either be heated, the lead poured out, galvanized, then the lead poured back in -or- it could be hung in the galvanizing bath with the lead fill hole up in which case little or none of the lead would spill out. Bristol Galvanizing actually did the second. I may have lost a tablespoon of the lead. After I got the anchor back, I warmed the anchor up with a torch and ran a bit of melted Sn/Pb solder into the hollow to fill it. I could not measure any difference in the anchor's weight, so I assume I still have lead in the hole.

Could that be done with a Spade?
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Old 14-07-2014, 17:29   #56
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Re: Mantus vs Rocna

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They also offered to replace them for anyone with the old shank... show me another maker who would do that?
Spade did that in the past. I don't know how the new company handles that now (they were sold and bought). I'm pretty sure Fortress will also.

The important point here, though, is that not many COULD replace the shank even if they wanted to.

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Old 14-07-2014, 18:08   #57
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Re: Mantus vs Rocna

We offer a Lifetime Parts Replacement Warranty and we will replace any damaged anchor part for free, the customer only pays the shipping & handling cost for the replacement part.

The parts are sent out via the US Postal Service, and their shipping cost is usually nominal compared to other freight carriers (DHL, FEDEX, UPS).

The customer does not need to send the damaged part back, nor do they need to produce a sales receipt or have registered their purchase with us. They could have found the anchor on the bottom of the ocean, or bought it second hand on eBay or at a garage sale, and the warranty still applies.

Relatively painless. The above points are oftentimes in the fine print and can disqualify a warranty, and consumers need to be aware of any warranty limitations.

Brian
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Old 14-07-2014, 18:50   #58
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Re: Mantus vs Rocna

How's that for premonition. Didn't realize the proximity of that post to Noellex's. Sorry if I jinxed you!

Really just was playing devil's advocate. The previous replies seemed to favor the Mantus- and neither Manson or CMP seem to have a forum presence. Guess I have a bit of nostalgia for the Alain / Craig battle royales.

Not a business I want to be in either. Greg sent a mod a free anchor and it ended up bending. Peter hopped in his boat and sailed from NZ to Chile to deliver an anchor and the recipients still said a Bruce was better. A Manson Bruce.
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Old 14-07-2014, 19:19   #59
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Re: Mantus vs Rocna

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Originally Posted by xeon_tsd View Post
The bent shank is from a previous generation of the Mantus, they have since upgraded the steele in the shank is made of. They also offered to replace them for anyone with the old shank... show me another maker who would do that?
Must admit I quite like the modular concept of the Mantus and their replacement policy as pioneered by Fortress. However those advocates of the Bis alloy steel shank certainly seem to be justified. Indeed it was a prime feature promoted by the original ROCNA manufacturer.

Will be interesting to see if Mantus further upgrades its steel. It would be a positive for them.
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Old 01-12-2015, 06:18   #60
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Re: Mantus vs Rocna

I have a Tayana 48Ds and was looking at the Mantus 85 as main anchor. I have a 60CQR that is on boat now can't decide to junk it and buy second mantus as standby. Your thoughts.
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