Is it possible to haul in all chain by hand?

[GordMay]

A nostalgic look at an early discussion ➥ http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ing-533-3.html

[mrohr]

Some thoughts worth trying and/or thinking about: Any breeze at all, 1st step is get the main up esp. if alone…engines do die unexpectedly and one less thing to do once anchor is up and underway.
Learn to sail out an anchor before you have no choice;Eric Hiscock gives an excellent explanation on this and many,many other valuable seaman like maneuvers. Sooner or later you will need some of them .
High freeboard and decks that are cluttered with bikes,hammocks,jerry cans,windsurrfers, awnings etc., etc. add tremendously to the wind load on a boat and require heavier ground tackle to keep the boat in place during a blow and greater effort during retrieval.

Yes ,a motor,crew ,and any type of windlass,are assets in retrieval but not necessary in smaller sailboats ;many workarounds are suggested in the posts above.

I saw a 50ft gold-plater anchored in deepish water and totally stuck in place due to an expensive windlass that decided to weld itself inoperable due to some internal short.
He was still there when I sailed out of the Great Salt Pond a few days later.

………………….luv you all………………………………………………………………mike………………..

[RTB]

Originally Posted by Robin3

I almost missed your reply and now there are more as well, but pretty much coming round to a consensus or as near as we are likely to see I suspect! I'm just listening to the local TV News bigging up of the approach of TS Erika which looks like it could (they would be lost without that word) increase and reach the Bahamas. Are your friends still out there, a few from our marina are I know? Not my choice of time of year for sure, too darn hot for me regardless of it being hurricane season and not having the latest newgen anchor either, plus my on board beauty doesn't do the mermaid bit!.

Yes, they are still there. They are also CF members (Raindog & Ocean Girl). https://raindogps34.wordpress.com/

Erika posted on FB this morning -

Erika Bearden We have prepped many times for hurricanes, but that was on the Texas coast where we knew that the water would bunch up as it had nowhere to go. But here, what kind of surge do you see? These piers don't seem like they could hold anything over 13-15 feet. Depending when Erika hits, high or low tide, will make a huge difference.We were looking at the deep cove next to the Marina ( see pick) as an alternative, could tie up to shore, steep cliffs for wind protection..? We were going to dink over today to see if it is an option. Cat 4-5, I think we would not be safe anywhere, we'd finish prepping the boat and fly out. We don't ride out named storms aboard. Dang, I knew that invest 98, now Hurricane Erika was going to sneak up on us, everyone was looking at Danny, Erika was always the big threat. And none of the models agree!! we have Chris Parker weather, do you?

I wish them luck!

Ralph

[Robin3]

Originally Posted by RTB

Yes, they are still there. They are also CF members (Raindog & Ocean Girl). https://raindogps34.wordpress.com/

Erika posted on FB this morning -

Erika Bearden We have prepped many times for hurricanes, but that was on the Texas coast where we knew that the water would bunch up as it had nowhere to go. But here, what kind of surge do you see? These piers don't seem like they could hold anything over 13-15 feet. Depending when Erika hits, high or low tide, will make a huge difference.We were looking at the deep cove next to the Marina ( see pick) as an alternative, could tie up to shore, steep cliffs for wind protection..? We were going to dink over today to see if it is an option. Cat 4-5, I think we would not be safe anywhere, we'd finish prepping the boat and fly out. We don't ride out named storms aboard. Dang, I knew that invest 98, now Hurricane Erika was going to sneak up on us, everyone was looking at Danny, Erika was always the big threat. And none of the models agree!! we have Chris Parker weather, do you?

I wish them luck!

Ralph

Rght now the downgraded Danny seems to be holding together better than Erika which is still more of an 'expected to' so they may get lucky. I'm watching via CFl TV News 13 and look at Weatherunderground here Hurricanes & Tropical Cyclones | Weather Underground

My bet is it will do a Sandy track and only bug those farther up the east coast where ironically the insurance companies prefer you to be June-December, but that is only from my safe armchair on terra firma.
It would be unfortunate to get caught in a year forecast to be very 'quiet'

I'm not even going daily to check on the boat at the moment, too hot/humid with feels like temps of 105F and afternoon storms. I will leave the islands for cooler winter months methinks that way we dodge the distant relatives family wannacomes for Christmas too.

[RTB]

Yeah, Erika is still a wait and see. If she goes to hurricane status, I'd guess the Bahamas won't slow it down much. Maybe you'll get some cool, wet weather?

Ralph

[goat]

Wow, that hurricane has her name written all over it.

goat

Sent from my SGH-I257M using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[Robin3]

Originally Posted by RTB

Yeah, Erika is still a wait and see. If she goes to hurricane status, I'd guess the Bahamas won't slow it down much. Maybe you'll get some cool, wet weather?

Ralph

If it gets there intact after Hispaniola that is the last I heard, that Hispaniola will cause it problems
Cool And wet will be better than hot and wet I guess. just 'average' would be nice

Robin.

[Bobcat]

Originally Posted by Sandero

Possible? Anything is possible. But it's pretty insane to be hauling up chain without mechanical assist. Also when you haul in chain you are also pull the boat toward the anchor and that includes the windage.

Anyone in the right mind would not consider not having a windlass if they were anchoring frequently.

======================

If the anchor is light eg a fortress, the scope of the chain not too long nor the chain too heavy, it is not such a problem - especially if you have someone else on board. Just get them to drive the boat forward at the speed that you wish to raise the anchor!

As an elderly couple with an 8m cat and 6mm chain we had no problems with a fairly heavy danforth anchor. We anchored frequently, tried to choose shallow soft or sandy anchorages (we drew only about 2ft) and both of us could raise the anchor and get under way a lot faster than using a manual windlass. We did this happily for over ten years until well into our sixties.

For day stopovers we kept a fortress anchor with about 6m of chain and a long nylon warp. At night we usually used all chain and the heavy danforth anchor. Hope that helps.

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by Bobcat

======================

If the anchor is light eg a fortress, the scope of the chain not too long nor the chain too heavy, it is not such a problem - especially if you have someone else on board. Just get them to drive the boat forward at the speed that you wish to raise the anchor!

As an elderly couple with an 8m cat and 6mm chain we had no problems with a fairly heavy danforth anchor. We anchored frequently, tried to choose shallow soft or sandy anchorages (we drew only about 2ft) and both of us could raise the anchor and get under way a lot faster than using a manual windlass. We did this happily for over ten years until well into our sixties.

For day stopovers we kept a fortress anchor with about 6m of chain and a long nylon warp. At night we usually used all chain and the heavy danforth anchor. Hope that helps.

Bobcat, while your experience is valid, please note that the OP is asking for advice about a circumnavigation or other distant destination cruising. You simply can not count on being able to anchor in shallow water all the time, and quite the contrary is common in many parts of the world. You can't count on having good protection in every anchorage. You can't count on having low wind conditions every time you need to weigh anchor.

You need to have the ability to cope with a wide variety of conditions and be confident that you can get your ground tackle aboard when you need to.

Your method fails to provide that assurance.

Jim

[Sandero]

Of course probably most don't single hand their boats and the work of setting and retrieving the hook can be down fairly easily with a motor and one person hailing the chain / rode / anchor while the other motors the boat slowly forward to a position over the anchor.

I often have someone aboard... and that person does not do anything mechanical, refuses to and so I am essentially single handing. And I have done plenty of literal single handing including ocean passages. My responses to the OP was to think about single handing in a range of conditions and it seems to me that doing this manually only is certainly doable in pretty benign conditions in shallow depths with light tackle.

My experiences tell me that this is too often not the case and of course there can be nasty mud to get off the chain as well which is best done will retrieving with a deck wash pump and hose with nozzle using the electric windlass with foot controls. I would have enough arms and hands to do it all.

The windlass to me is a no brainer for people who anchor frequently over all bottoms and wind and wave conditions... which is what long distance cruising deals up. I added chain and the windlass before I took off and it was one of the best decisions I made and have no regrets about the cost. I think it saved me in a few situations from a fate I don't want to contemplate.

I strongly recommend all chain and an electric windlass if you are doing extensive cruising and anchoring. You decide.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Bobcat, while your experience is valid, please note that the OP is asking for advice about a circumnavigation or other distant destination cruising. You simply can not count on being able to anchor in shallow water all the time, and quite the contrary is common in many parts of the world. You can't count on having good protection in every anchorage. You can't count on having low wind conditions every time you need to weigh anchor.

You need to have the ability to cope with a wide variety of conditions and be confident that you can get your ground tackle aboard when you need to.

Your method fails to provide that assurance.

Jim

Jim and Ann,

Unfortunately I'm old enough to remember we hauled by hand or maybe the ultra rich didn't.-------------++++++++++++++++-+*

[RTB]

I recently read Kristen's book http://www.amazon.com/Living-Island-...ords=caribbean and read much of her blog The Log of Whisper

She did much of the anchoring as her husband sat in the cockpit having his coffee. They sailed from Maryland to Trinidad and returned over a period of a few years. Their boat? An Albin Vega 27. I just thought this might be relevant to the OP's question.

Back to my bright work....

Ralph

[Impetuous too]

Hi there,

We sailed from Guatemala, Belize on to Cuba then through the Panama and across the Pacific and circumnavigated New Zealand including a thoroughly enjoyable 2 months in Fiordland in the last two years with all chain (300ft 3/8 BBB) and a manual windlass with the wrong Gypsy and therefore useful only really to help breaking the anchor out. Our deepest anchorage was Bora Bora where we anchored in 22m (over 70ft) three times. Our biggest haul was in Fiordland where it wouldn't set so we ended up pulling up our Bruce (I think 55lb) and much of our chain in over 35 m (approx 120ft). I had to leave that one to my boyfriend. We've never had to leave our main anchor buoyed but would be ready to do so if necessary. We take it in turns to pull up the anchor and see it as exercise. Sometimes it's frustratingly hard for me in particular but we're never in a big hurry and always feel satisfaction once it's up. If the situation is concerning the adrenaline helps. We only ever anchor (except one night in a marina in Panama and two on buoys in Tonga over 18 months).

When we return to our boat in New Zealand early next year we are going to upgrade our kitchen counter top and modify our reefing system and Staysail but have no plans to change our ground tackle (except perhaps locating a gypsy that fits our chain if possible).

What I would add is that good free diving skills or a scuba tank are very useful when anchoring near coral. You may have tried to avoid it but that's not always how it turns out once the wind changes. Twice the dive tanks have saved us from having to leave an anchor. An electric winch wouldn't have helped unless ridiculously oversized (with commensurate damage to the coral or possibly the weakest link).

I'm not saying you should do it, only that it's possible and that we like it this way.

[Jim Cate]

Our biggest haul was in Fiordland where it wouldn't set so we ended up pulling up our Bruce (I think 55lb) and much of our chain in over 35 m (approx 120ft).

G'Day Ruth,

If my math is correct, that 120 feet of chain and 55 lbs of anchor total out at around 250 lbs. Raising that hand over hand from straight down is something that few could actually accomplish. I'm impressed, and willl not be challenging Duncan to wrist wrestle!!

But really, the fact that you successfully did your lengthy cruise hand over handing your anchor does not mean that it is good practice, nor that it should be recommended to someone just setting out.

Your success, and your apparent enjoyment of the process is great, but I'll stick by my advice to fit some sort of windlass. BTW, if your windllass had worked better, would you have not used it more? (Honest question, 'cause us cruisers often work out ways of dealing with things as they occur, even though they ain't optimal or desirable).

Jim

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by Cadence

Jim and Ann,

Unfortunately I'm old enough to remember we hauled by hand or maybe the ultra rich didn't.-------------++++++++++++++++-+*

Sorry, I don't get your point here, Cadence.

Jim