Is it possible to haul in all chain by hand?

[barnakiel]

In a Cape Dory 28 you can. But if you are sailing one of the bigger boats then given enough chain, one can't.

We are sailing a 26' boat and we have no windlass. We are on a 33 pounder and 100' of 8mm chain.

You are only lifting the vertical part of the chain and (towards the end) the hook. In our case this translates into (say 10 meters of water = 14+15=30 kg (66 pounds)).

However, if there is enough wind or current you may need someone else to guide the boat upwind and up-current under engine while you are collecting your anchoring kit. Pulling even a small (say sub-30') boat upwind along the rode is ...

To sum up. 100% doable but ymmv mostly by the depth of your anchorages, the weather conditions and whether you are sailing alone or with crew.

Also: consider chain and warp. You only need as much chain as desired for the catenary and to protect from cuts (rock, coral, etc.) Mind that in a small boat all chain may be simply to heavy for the boat to carry in the bow, and moving the chain to the bilge every time ...

Cheers,
b.

[zeehag]

i have to love it when folks say one CANT do that which i been doing since i got my first boat in 1990.
windlasses break. what ye gonna do, sit it out when you want to go somewhere??? this new lot of cruisers cannot do things without the machinery to make it simpler..
wrong.
they also sprinkle all with a generous dosing of cant.
there is no such word as cant. yes it is in dictionary, but folks who get it done do not use the word. is like the word quit.
those who cant , quit.
there are many ways to raise an anchor by hand without a windlass. one hasnt always the option of extra hands.. get over it and learn how to do this without injury and without loss of boat. it is not hard, just dirty work, but it has to get done.
unless you quit.

[sailorchic34]

Being at the poor end of the cruising gene pool, I use all chain without a windlass. When the winds are up I use to lines with a hook to pull the chain up. In calm conditions, I pull up the slack by hand and then use one line lead aft to the jib winch to pull the chain up while motoring forward. That allows me to be by the wheel when things get busy.

[rodrinn]

Originally Posted by Robin3

It weigh exactly the same as 50 feet of chain plus the anchor. Mathematical fact!

Perhaps pedantic but it's mass will be the same however its weight will have the weight/mass of water displaced by chain and anchor subtracted, or this is what I used to tell myself to make it easier to haul it all in.

[Captain-Avenger]

I would think the answer has a lot to do with how frequently you plan on hoisting the anchor. If you have a 50lb anchor with 50 feet of 5/16" chain, another 50 lbs, then you are talking about 100 lbs. If you move once per week that isn't bad...but if you plan on moving daily, on an extended voyage, then it would get to be a drag after a while.

[Alec H]

and how often does the anchor come up clean? Mud is heavy.

[Sandero]

No one is claiming it can't be done. Of course it can and there are work around for failed windlasses as sailorchic notes. In mild conditions in shallow waters, in sandy bottoms it's not a big deal usually.

I think the OP was contemplating a long offshore cruise anchoring in all sorts of bottoms and depths and wind and wave conditions. And I think MOST who have cruised in this range of conditions use all chain and a windlass.. MOST not all. Most being the vast majority by a long shot.

I might add with a working windlass and single handing I don't twice about moving the boat to a better spot for any reason. I think if I were anchored in a muddy bottom and I had to haul it up by hand I would give it a lot of thought and try to convince myself to stay put.

[Jon Eisberg]

Originally Posted by northoceanbeach

I have heard that for worldwide cruising you just can't beat all chain. That some destinations have shard coral bottoms and you rope will get cut, even if you have fifty feet of chain in front of it.

Is this true? If so, can a boat under thirty feet carry all chain in the now and not be to front heavy?

If you do opt for all chain, I would strongly suggest you do try to lead the chain as far aft as possible... I sail a 30-footer, and have managed to bring 200 feet of 1/4" HT aft by a considerable distance by mounting the windlass several feet aft of the stem, then leading the chain pipe aft and outboard at roughly a 45 degree angle... The downside is the fall into the locker at the aft portion of the vee-berth is rather shallow, and when recovering a long length of rode, I usually have to jump down below to knock down a castle of chain... All things considered, however, I'm very pleased with the arrangement, and the pipe can be easily removed and stowed aside to open up the space in the berth... The smaller overhead locker forward holds the secondary rope rode...

Originally Posted by northoceanbeach

...I have been happy with my mix of rope and chain, but then I've only anchored in the pacific Norwegian. If it's time to get new gear, might as well get stuff that will be appropriate for all conditions, even if I don't need it today.

Well, if you're happy with what you've got now, why change?

There seems to be a lot of dissatisfaction with the longevity of galvanizing on even chain from reputable manufacturers like ACCO these days, why make the sizable investment in all-chain, and begin subjecting it to wear, until you're really ready to go "worldwide"?

[domander]

I've had to haul up a 35 pound anchor with 3/8 inch chain from about 20 feet of water in calm conditions. I didn't much enjoy it, but it was doable. Another time when my windlass failed I brought up my 80 pound Manson with 3/8 chain from about 12 feet and found it easier to use a winch with a chain hook on it (and another hook on a static line to take the weight when re-positioning the primary hook). Could I have done that by hand without risking a heart attack? I don't know. In this case the wind was also calm.

But I've been in many situations when wind and waves would have made the idea of even attempting to bring up the chain by hand totally impossible. As a singlehander preparing for a circumnavigation I have found having a good electric windlass so important I have a second 1000 watt windlass on board as a spare which can swap out my present 1500 watt windlass in a couple of hours if necessary. I replaced the original working windlass with the new one just to make sure there would be no unexpected problems in this plan.

- Brian Domander

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by RTB

We've been cruising for 3 years. No windlass. No autopilot. No problem. Getting the anchor up first thing in the morning is my workout, and gets me going. It's only fair. My wife doesn't have a dishwasher (so we're even).

Attachment 107839

Mind you, we rarely anchor in anything more than 20'. I usually look for 8-12' to drop the hook. I'm guessing in Cali or the PNW, anchorages are deeper.

Our boat is 36', with all 5/16" HT chain, and a 35# Manson Supreme. Oh, and I'm 63 and weigh 135# in cruise trim.


The OP has a Cape Dory 28. Surely a 25# anchor and maybe 1/4" chain is all that's needed. I'm not sure how much weight he can add to the bow, without upsetting the balance. Anyone?

Ralph

Ralph.

I loved the common sense approach with the touch of wry humor.

[zeehag]

i left out the part of my post which should make most of you ......
i cruise a formosa 41. i am old. i am female.
i have a totally fail electric windlass which was too light for boat, and i have a manual bronze windlass, 2 speed.
most of the time i hand raise my anchor and clean it at same time with a bucket and brush.
yes it is heavy.
yes it is a pita.
yes it has to get done and aint no one here helping, so guess who gets to do this..not the cat...
in winter my anchor is used weekly. even a little old frail woman is able to raise this anchor manually if one is intelligent about it. my anchor is a 30 kg bruce--66 pounds, plus 100 percent 5/16 chain, i usually have 150 ft down from my bits to the anchor.
i generally do not have to re anchor in the winds we get daily, as many do, even when chop is heavy, as in many anchorages on this side.
dont let depth fool ye.
at least the swell helps raise the well stuck bruce.....

[jheldatksuedu]

In an emergency you can hook up a snatch block to the stern and lead a line from the chain at the bow to the snatch block and back to a deck winch, this would allow you to pull almost a boat length of chain with each purchase using a deck winch. A couple bent chain grab hooks would also be nice things to have for this situation.

[Spade Anchor]

Not sure what type anchor your using. If it is a properly designed anchor it will not depend on the weight of the chain to help it set, but you will still need chain to avoid chaffing. This will allow you to use a lot less chain total of 30-50ft as opposed to 100-200ft and with a shorter scope.
That will be a lot less weight/work with out a windlass.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by MYTraveler

Mass yes. weight no. Subtract the weight of the water they displace.

I was waiting for someone to point that out. Thanks, you can argue the point for both of us.

[RTB]

Originally Posted by Sandero

I single hand and my wife does not drive the boat... so driving to the anchor is a non starter... for us and for single handers and so this means hauling up heavy anchor is a chore... and worse in a blow.

So, educate me. The boats with windlasses that I've observed still motored up the chain toward the anchor, taking in slack chain as they go. It is my understanding (right or wrong?) that you don't just have the windlass pull you to your anchor in less than calm conditions (say 15-20 knots of wind). I assume (my bad) that you would stop retrieving chain if the bow falls away, leaving the chain at an angle off the bow.

Or do you just hit your button and put the pedal to the metal, and presto, the anchor is sitting on deck.

I'm just thinking that someone with no experience with a windlass might get the wrong idea about proper use of that piece of equipment. Maybe I would be one of those people.

Previously mentioned by Jim Cate that it is not uncommon to anchor in 50' of water while voyaging to many areas. I wonder if the OP realizes how much chain he'd need on put on his boat. Probably 400' or so. Maybe 350' minimum?

Comment about anchoring in mud. You don't want to get dirty? So, do you just dump all that muddy chain into you anchor locker after you run it through your expensive windlass? Most of us use a bucket if we don't have a deck washdown. Either way, you're up on the bow dealing with the mess.

Yes, MOST cruising boats I've seen have a windlass. Some of us don't, and it's not a big deal to us. It's just part of our cruising, just like jugging fuel and water to our anchored boat. Just like when we walk to a store for provisions a mile or two away, and return (still walking) with heavy canvas bags weighing our shoulders and hands down. Do it your way, and do it mine. Just don't tell me or anyone else, they must have a windlass to go cruising. I do agree if you plan on anchoring in deep water fairly often, then yes, I agree. But my cruising is from Texas, to the Bahamas, and up the East Coast to Georgia or the Carolinas. Also, it depends on the size boat (and the size of the ground tackle).




Ralph