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stevensuf · 22-01-2012, 11:13

Ive got the chance of 80m of unused 10mm grade 30 anchor chain at a great price, i was intending to use grade 40, i know 40 is stronger , but is grade 30 that weak? would it be dangerous to use? boat is 43 ft& 10,600kg

**delmarrey** · 22-01-2012, 11:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevensuf

Ive got the chance of 80m of unused 10mm grade 30 anchor chain at a great price, i was intending to use grade 40, i know 40 is stronger , but is grade 30 that weak? would it be dangerous to use? boat is 43 ft& 10,600kg

Of all the years of sailing/anchoring, I've never heard of a galvanized chain breaking, no matter what the grade.

Anyone else?

**GordMay** · 23-01-2012, 07:21

G30 chain is roughly half(or less) as strong as G43 High Test of the same size.

See NACM Welded Steel Chain Specifications ➥ National Association of Chain Manufacturers: welded chain

10 mm ≈ 3/8"
3/8" G43 = 5400# (2450 kg) WLL
3/8" G30 = 2650# (1200 kg) WLL
½" G30 = 4500# (2430 kg) WLL

**HopCar** · 23-01-2012, 08:57

What is the wildcat on your windlass sized for?

stevensuf · 23-01-2012, 09:14

The gypsy is 10mm chain 30mm link size, im thinking more the cleats would be ripped out long before the chain snapped even with g30.

nb the ultimate rating is about 50% more for g40 vs g30 ie min breaking load ie 11200 lb for g30 and 16200 lb for g40, dunno why they quote the safe wll as half. the other thing, thinking ahead is that regalvanising doesnt weaken g30 but does to g40 and heavily weakens g70.

**Cheechako** · 23-01-2012, 09:26

Is G30 the same as BBB or is it Proof Coil? It's really not necessary to use G4, in fact it rusts faster, but I have seen pictures of PC elongated badly.... I would be surprised if galvanising would change anything about the strength.... isnt the temp too low for that?

stevensuf · 23-01-2012, 09:38

google regalvanising chain, youll be surprised g30 very little degradation, g40 is degraded a little more, g70 heavily degraded, the chain is proof tested, proof testing does not make the chain any better, it is more like q.c. , ie we hang a load on it and see if there are any weak links, all anchor chain should be proof tested!

**colemj** · 23-01-2012, 09:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by GordMay

G30 chain is roughly half(or less) as strong as G43 High Test of the same size.

See NACM Welded Steel Chain Specifications ➥ National Association of Chain Manufacturers: welded chain

10 mm ≈ 3/8"
3/8" G43 = 5400# (2450 kg) WLL
3/8" G30 = 2650# (1200 kg) WLL
½" G30 = 4500# (2430 kg) WLL

G30 WLL is rated at lower percentage of breaking load than G43. You can't really compare WLL with regards to strength. A lot of times the only real difference between the two is that one was actually tested (high test) and the other not.

Mark

**Cheechako** · 23-01-2012, 10:21

Doing a little research, It appears that G30 is indeed what we old timers call "Proof Coil" chain. You may have a hard time finding a wildcat to fit it... depends on the spec I guess. It has been dissed in years past as far as anchor chain; BBB and G4 being recommended. But.... who knows..... might be fine.

**colemj** · 23-01-2012, 11:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheechako

Doing a little research, It appears that G30 is indeed what we old timers call "Proof Coil" chain. You may have a hard time finding a wildcat to fit it... depends on the spec I guess. It has been dissed in years past as far as anchor chain; BBB and G4 being recommended. But.... who knows..... might be fine.

Proof coil is a specific link length and pitch of chain and is available in all grades of chain. BBB is also a specific link length and pitch and not a grade. G3 and G4 both come in proof, short and BBB links. There is no advantage of BBB for anchoring in any grade, as it just adds weight with no additional strength.

Mark

**Jim Cate** · 23-01-2012, 11:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by colemj

Proof coil is a specific link length and pitch of chain and is available in all grades of chain. BBB is also a specific link length and pitch and not a grade. G3 and G4 both come in proof, short and BBB links. There is no advantage of BBB for anchoring in any grade, as it just adds weight with no additional strength.

Mark

Gotta disagree here: BBB's shorter links work far better on gypsies than the longer proof coil links. Most if not all windlass manufacturers advise the use of the shorter links on their products.

From personal experience: we used 3/8" PC chain on our previous boat, which had a horizontal axis manual windlass (Maxwell). In that installation, the load was essentially borne by a single link "pocket" on the gypsy at a time. What this meant was that when lowering the anchor, if the chain had a twist in it as it rose from the chain locker, it tended to jump off the gypsy. If this happened in deeper water, and before the anchor had reached the bottom, a runaway situation quickly developed. Scary and dangerous to toes and fingers!. With short link chain the chances of this are greatly reduced.

And as to strength... we used that G-30 rated chain for 17 years and four regalvanizings before we sold the boat (36 ft, ~10 tonnes). AFAIK it is still in use 8 years on, although the present owner doesn't anchor all the time like we did.

So, if it will work on the gypsy, I for one would be happy with the strength.

Cheers,

Jim

**colemj** · 23-01-2012, 12:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Gotta disagree here: BBB's shorter links work far better on gypsies than the longer proof coil links. Most if not all windlass manufacturers advise the use of the shorter links on their products.

From personal experience: we used 3/8" PC chain on our previous boat, which had a horizontal axis manual windlass (Maxwell). In that installation, the load was essentially borne by a single link "pocket" on the gypsy at a time. What this meant was that when lowering the anchor, if the chain had a twist in it as it rose from the chain locker, it tended to jump off the gypsy. If this happened in deeper water, and before the anchor had reached the bottom, a runaway situation quickly developed. Scary and dangerous to toes and fingers!. With short link chain the chances of this are greatly reduced.

Yes, windlass manufacturers all build windlasses for short link and BBB chain. I don't know anyone who builds for proof-coil. Proof-coil is more of a hardware/industrial and mooring type of chain and is not made as anchor chain. I doubt you were using proof coil - probably short link chain, but it sounds like it wasn't a good fit for your windlass gypsy. If you were using proof coil, you shouldn't have been. It does sometimes "fit" a gypsy, but you will not have more than a single point of contact with it - not even a whole link.

Check out Acco's catalog - you will see proof coil, short link (ISO) and BBB chains. The only chains they sell for anchoring is short link and BBB. Proof coil is sold for moorings

We have a horizontal windlass with short link chain (not BBB) with the proper gypsy and have 3 links locked into facets at all times. On this particular gypsy, that is the full 90* bend into the locker.

BBB will require a gypsy specific to it. It will probably have more links captured because it is an even shorter link and pitch. It will not be any better of an anchor chain, and will just add more weight with no benefit over a short link chain.

Mark

stevensuf · 23-01-2012, 12:15

Well here's what ive learned so far:-

g30 is basically a grade of steel, lower in carbon content than g40, it has a recommended working safe load half of g40, though a breaking strain only 30% less.
Regalvanising weakens higher carbon content steels, g40 less so than g70 which is severely reduced. g30 weakens very little due to galvanising as it is not tempered (ie heat treated like g40/g70 are) so in the longer term g40 will be almost as weak as g30 once it has been galvanised, so the performance gain is only useful for the first few years of life.

Ultimately, unless you are going to scrap your chain before regalvanising , youd be better with the cheaper grade g30 chain.

I think i have the answer and saved a fair bit of money in the process.

**barnakiel** · 23-01-2012, 14:26

Grade 30 is OK. You just can go one size lower with 40 so in some cases one can carry more chain (or carry less, and sail a lighter boat).

Grade -435 is good too - just not practical to go with its 2 inch dia links.

b.

noelex 77 · 23-01-2012, 15:29

Make sure the chain will fit your gypsy. There are a number of standard sizes for 10mm chain. The two most common have a pitch length of 28 mm(Din 766) or 30 mm. 28mm chain will not fit on a 30mm gypsy and vice versa.
G40, or even G70 is better, but I think G30 10mm would be OK