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Old 17-09-2017, 09:15   #1
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Clean boats x dirty boats

Although empirical, it seems logical to me that a neighboring fouled hull will increase fouling on your own clean hull. I need to prove it to our club managers, so they find a way to force boat owners to keep their hulls in a decent condition. Can anyone help me on finding supporting studies?
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Old 17-09-2017, 09:26   #2
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Re: Clean boats x dirty boats

I don't know about the bottom growth on nearby yachts affecting my own, but I have had concern about yachts having electrical faults that were putting large amounts of leakage current into the water next to me. I have even gotten a tingling electric shock by touching their boat.

When I was in Whangarei, New Zealand, I got massive bottom growth from ships that pumped contaminated bilge water into the Hatea River.

When I was in Darwin, Australia, they would not let you into the marina through a lock system unless all your through hulls were treated for mussels so that the Darwin marina did not fill up again with mussels. They had to do a massive chemical dump into the water to kill all the mussels that were clogging the marina.
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Old 17-09-2017, 09:47   #3
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Re: Clean boats x dirty boats

Quote:
Originally Posted by hthoni View Post
Although empirical, it seems logical to me that a neighboring fouled hull will increase fouling on your own clean hull. I need to prove it to our club managers, so they find a way to force boat owners to keep their hulls in a decent condition. Can anyone help me on finding supporting studies?
So, I am to believe that this is no growth on the pilings, rocks, or bottom of the harbor?

In water cleaning is established to be environmentally questionable. In the US and Europe there considerable pressure to ban the practice.

Further, I had read studies that suggest that cleaning in the slip increases fouling of neighboring boats by spreading seeds. I know of at least one chain of marinas that forbids in slip water cleaning for that reason. Maxingout's experience seems to support this.

I think you have both a weak and an arguably incorrect position. Good luck!
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Old 17-09-2017, 09:59   #4
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Re: Clean boats x dirty boats

Quote:
Originally Posted by thinwater View Post
So, I am to believe that this is no growth on the pilings, rocks, or bottom of the harbor?

In water cleaning is established to be environmentally questionable. In the US and Europe there considerable pressure to ban the practice.

Further, I had read studies that suggest that cleaning in the slip increases fouling of neighboring boats by spreading seeds. I know of at least one chain of marinas that forbids in slip water cleaning for that reason. Maxingout's experience seems to support this.

I think you have both a weak and an arguably incorrect position. Good luck!


Some neighboring boats have 1 inch thick organisms colonies, reproducing, dissipating 10.000 larvaes per cycle / adult barnacle ... it seems to me those colonies would function similarly to ants, termites, fleas or pigeons... the more you give them a proper environment, the more they will grow.
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Old 17-09-2017, 10:20   #5
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Re: Clean boats x dirty boats

I dont agree. the stuff grows no matter what, but if anything, a neighbors boat becoming a eco safe space for all the critters may actually be a good thing!
What's next? petitioning the Marina gestapo to require only electric propulsion so you dont have to smell a neighbors diesel fumes?
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Old 17-09-2017, 10:35   #6
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Re: Clean boats x dirty boats

Quote:
Originally Posted by hthoni View Post
Some neighboring boats have 1 inch thick organisms colonies, reproducing, dissipating 10.000 larvaes per cycle / adult barnacle ... it seems to me those colonies would function similarly to ants, termites, fleas or pigeons... the more you give them a proper environment, the more they will grow.
The answer to your question is simple. Hang several fiberglass sheets (hang them below pipe floats if needed) between boats with very heavy growth, and several between boats that are kept clean. Also several near but slightly away from the marina. Make certain that sunlight exposure is identical. See if there is a difference. In other words, involve the marina in your own local study. Use enough locations to control for variability.

Since this is specific to your waters, it would mean more.
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Old 17-09-2017, 10:38   #7
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Clean boats x dirty boats

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheechako View Post
I dont agree. the stuff grows no matter what, but if anything, a neighbors boat becoming a eco safe space for all the critters may actually be a good thing!
What's next? petitioning the Marina gestapo to require only electric propulsion so you dont have to smell a neighbors diesel fumes?


We are not saving the ocean by creating good conditions to those criters. Its like having a neighboring house full of termites, rats or any other plague. Those boat owners leave their vessels like crap for years... they never sail, nor visit the boat. It just stays there occupying a slip that could help another potential active boat owner.
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Old 17-09-2017, 10:44   #8
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Re: Clean boats x dirty boats

And it seems to me, that the OP needs to get degrees in marine biology and epidemiology.

Marine growth is not a plague infection. and the presence of nearby growth is not the only source of sufficient larval/spore/etc material to ensure the next boat over is going to get hairy.

If you want a clean bottom, paint it with TBT and just don't tell anyone.

I'll bet the OP could convert the YC to a dockominium and start an HOA at that yacht club, too.
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Old 17-09-2017, 11:34   #9
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Re: Clean boats x dirty boats

Quote:
Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
And it seems to me, that the OP needs to get degrees in marine biology and epidemiology.



Marine growth is not a plague infection. and the presence of nearby growth is not the only source of sufficient larval/spore/etc material to ensure the next boat over is going to get hairy.



If you want a clean bottom, paint it with TBT and just don't tell anyone.



I'll bet the OP could convert the YC to a dockominium and start an HOA at that yacht club, too.


Absolutely! Im not a biologist, if that was the case i wouldnt be here bothering people. Im asking for information.

Absolutely! Would never be the only source, my question was if those dirty hulls would increase the problem.

TBT compounds are banned.
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Old 17-09-2017, 11:58   #10
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Re: Clean boats x dirty boats

"TBT compounds are banned."
Yes they are. And they're still the best way to discourage bottom growth.
Personally, I prefer to hire unemployed pearl divers and have them gently polish the hull twice weekly, but yacht clubs tend to bitch and moan about having the hired help sleeping out back behind the waste oil tank and empty pallets. Which makes TBT far less of a problem.
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Old 17-09-2017, 12:06   #11
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Re: Clean boats x dirty boats

Quote:
Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
"TBT compounds are banned."

Yes they are. And they're still the best way to discourage bottom growth.

Personally, I prefer to hire unemployed pearl divers and have them gently polish the hull twice weekly, but yacht clubs tend to bitch and moan about having the hired help sleeping out back behind the waste oil tank and empty pallets. Which makes TBT far less of a problem.


My proposal to the YC was to give boat owners 2 options. Either they should keep their boats decently or they would pay an extra monthly fee to YC, who would clean their boats.

I hire a diver who scrubs my hull twice monthly.

I'll go to club within one hour and I'll send you some scary pictures of my neighbors...
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Old 17-09-2017, 12:33   #12
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Re: Clean boats x dirty boats

Quote:
Originally Posted by thinwater View Post
In water cleaning is established to be environmentally questionable. In the US... there (is) considerable pressure to ban the practice.
Neither statement is remotely true. And anybody who is paying attention understands that not performing in-water hull cleaning is environmentally more damaging than doing it is. Increased fuel consumption, increased hydrocarbon emissions and transport of invasive species are just a few of the reasons why.

Quote:
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If you want a clean bottom, paint it with TBT and just don't tell anyone.
That's about as an environmentally unfriendly suggestion as you could possibly make.
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Old 17-09-2017, 12:36   #13
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Re: Clean boats x dirty boats

isnt rio a dirty water port?? dirty water grows more stuff than neighbor boat seeding.
i know that when my boat is in a dirty harbor it grows all kinds of lovelinesses.
even in clean water growth happens.
mebbe they should just ban boats in the harbor, as dirty bottoms happen.
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Old 17-09-2017, 12:49   #14
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Re: Clean boats x dirty boats

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Originally Posted by zeehag View Post
isnt rio a dirty water port?? dirty water grows more stuff than neighbor boat seeding.
i know that when my boat is in a dirty harbor it grows all kinds of lovelinesses.
even in clean water growth happens.
mebbe they should just ban boats in the harbor, as dirty bottoms happen.


Make them clean their boats!

Yes, Guanabara Bay is very polluted, mainly with urban poor sewage treatment. What makes the problem much worse.
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Old 17-09-2017, 13:03   #15
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Re: Clean boats x dirty boats

Quote:
Originally Posted by hthoni View Post
My proposal to the YC was to give boat owners 2 options. Either they should keep their boats decently or they would pay an extra monthly fee to YC, who would clean their boats.

I hire a diver who scrubs my hull twice monthly.

I'll go to club within one hour and I'll send you some scary pictures of my neighbors...


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