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Old 30-07-2013, 12:21   #31
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Re: China chain quality

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Originally Posted by goboatingnow View Post
as a once holder of ISO9000 it was never a indication of quality nor was it designed as such , it was an indication that you had a documented quality system, i.e. if you decided to make cheap crap, then thats fine as long as you documented it.

Hence your right ISO 9000 is/was a joke

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The problem being, very few people realize that. It's like putting ISO9000 on your letterhead was assurance that you only made the best. For my company it only created reams of paperwork and an annual week of paralysis when it was time for the audit.
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Old 31-07-2013, 09:28   #32
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Re: China chain quality

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Originally Posted by Twisticles View Post

It's like this: a Chinese product can be as well made, environmentally friendly and ISO compliant as any USA made product.

.....


What is boils down to is the specification and the quality assurance process. If a product meets the right spec, it doesn't matter where it is made.
I agree with you on this, which is why I specifically used the adjective "generic" in my post.

However, the amount of bad generic Chinese chain on the market overwhelms the amount of good Chinese chain produced with high quality (at least in the US and Caribe). By a large margin - which explains most of the experiences here with Chinese chain, and justifies the comments.

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Old 31-07-2013, 09:41   #33
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Re: China chain quality

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Originally Posted by Kestrahl View Post
The galv is still fine after anchoring upwards of 300 nights in the tropics sometimes grinding on coral.
Regardless of where you bought your chain, I'm pretty certain that grinding it on coral isn't something you want to be bragging about.

Even if you don't give a damn about the environment, it pays to understand that is why more and more anchorages are being restricted.
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Old 31-07-2013, 10:46   #34
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Re: China Chain Quality

I don't trust any metalurgy out of China. Not metalurgy that matters, like chain used to keep your boat off the rocks. Chinese manufacturers have been caught too may times cheating or producing shoddy metal products. Your ground tackle is not where you want to cut corners.
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Old 31-07-2013, 11:06   #35
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Re: China Chain Quality

I prefer buying US and German made heavy duty engineering products and parts; engines, cars and such. As for electronics, I prefer buying Japanese and US made components; stereo systems, cameras, PCB boards, PC's, and such. As for aircraft manufacturers, BOEING, Bombardier and DeHavilland (Canada). Cheap is expensive, as you'll have to replace things more often! Life is really simple!

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Old 31-07-2013, 13:36   #36
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I prefer buying US and German made heavy duty engineering products and parts; engines, cars and such. As for electronics, I prefer buying Japanese and US made components; stereo systems, cameras, PCB boards, PC's, and such. As for aircraft manufacturers, BOEING, Bombardier and DeHavilland (Canada). Cheap is expensive, as you'll have to replace things more often! Life is really simple!

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You buy electronics and 747s wow !

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Old 31-07-2013, 13:46   #37
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Re: China Chain Quality

Hi Dave! You must be a silly goof, indeed! The aircraft manufacturers that I listed are my favorite, because they build aircraft that are exceptionally well engineered. I have been flying Twin Otter's de Haviland for decades; very rugged and reliable.

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Old 31-07-2013, 14:04   #38
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Originally Posted by Bash View Post

Regardless of where you bought your chain, I'm pretty certain that grinding it on coral isn't something you want to be bragging about.

Even if you don't give a damn about the environment, it pays to understand that is why more and more anchorages are being restricted.
Ofcourse you don't plan to anchor where there is some coral on the bottom but anyone who has sailed through the south pacific and Philippines knows it can be tough to avoid. I dont think the Philippines authoritys are going to start closing anchorages to cruising yachts anytime soon. When their fishermen are still dynamiting any reef that's not buoyed off for tourists.
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Old 31-07-2013, 16:53   #39
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Depends on how many feet of chain you have out. Lets see. Most chain is more or less 10-12 links/ft. Call it 10 for easy calculation. If you have out 100' of chain then if evenly distributed you would only have 10 bad links between you and the anchor. Now that's Russian Roulette.

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Old 31-07-2013, 16:56   #40
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Why try to shave a buck or two on your ground tackle? Unless you never think you'll use it don't do it.
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Old 31-07-2013, 17:02   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teknav View Post
Hi Dave! You must be a silly goof, indeed! The aircraft manufacturers that I listed are my favorite, because they build aircraft that are exceptionally well engineered. I have been flying Twin Otter's de Haviland for decades; very rugged and reliable.

Mauritz
We all have favourites I suppose , that's the thing about personal preferences , they're personal, doesn't make them right of course. I prefer Airbus, cause I like their flight computers and the European design aesthetic. But that's just me. I do like some US military engineering ( having worked on some) cost plus is a great thing for an engineer. !!!

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Old 31-07-2013, 20:32   #42
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Originally Posted by donradcliffe View Post
Having watched chinese chain fail at less than its WORKING load, I wouldn't have chinese chain or shackles on my boat.
Did it fail due to where it was made or because was cheap rubbish?
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Old 31-07-2013, 21:11   #43
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Re: China chain quality

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Originally Posted by goboatingnow View Post
as a once holder of ISO9000 it was never a indication of quality nor was it designed as such , it was an indication that you had a documented quality system, i.e. if you decided to make cheap crap, then thats fine as long as you documented it.

Hence your right ISO 9000 is/was a joke

dave
From what I have seen of ISO 9000 series requirements, it looks more like a system for making manufacturing into a color by numbers game where you can bring in any moderately skilled laborer, make them read the procedures, then do the job. In my opinion, it looks like a system to set up companies so that they can be traded as a commodity, without the need to worry about loosing key individuals who know the necessary processes. It always looked to me like a grass roots tool of the one-world government movement.

But that is just my take on it.
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Old 31-07-2013, 21:24   #44
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Re: China Chain Quality

Back to the subject of chain...

Whenever I assemble a custom G80 chain sling for a specific overhead lifting application, I am required to load test it, at greater than rated load, before it can be put into service. I would think that it might be prudent to adopt a similar approach to putting anchor chain into service, especially if it came from a questionable source.

One problem with Chinese product quality comes from the way that business is sometimes done over there. There are some mega-factories & then there are also a lot of smaller factories, right down to mom & pop shops. Many times, an exporter will buy product from several different small shops, then bulk the product all together as a single lot & export it. This happens with Chinese jacks, motorcycles, lathes, calipers, socks, underwear & many other products. If you don't believe me, just go to a few different Harbor Freight locations & look at the motorcycle lifts or lathes that are all sold as the same part number, or go to a Walmart & look at the socks in different bags with the same part number. One might think that Walmart buys large enough quantities to always go to the mega-factories, but it isn't the case. They buy a lot of bulked export product too & the quality does vary.

I am not going to try to say that all Chinese chain is garbage, but I will say that I am not confident that the quality will not vary in an undesirable way. I think that a test is always prudent before putting any chain into service, but In the case of China, I, for one, would give it the once over twice before trusting it.
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Old 01-08-2013, 08:03   #45
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Re: China Chain Quality

Chain welds are done by machine, that machine works just as well no matter what country it's in, but when I bought my chain I did hand check the welds before I used it.
I have 316 SS chain, at the time it was like 2X the price of US galvanize chain, YMMV.
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