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Old 23-05-2010, 11:34   #31
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# of posts???

Gordy:
Once again I must protest that you get credit for a post of merely 2 words. It seems unfair as when I post my average word count is much higher yet you can post but 2 words and receive the same 'credit' as I do for much more thought and time. How is a guy to catch your record 14,074 when you post such posts obviously for the sole reason of padding your numbers. Your average 5.45 posts per day for the 86 months since joining is very impressive at face value but when you see that you get credit for posts such as 'any examples?' you get the real picture. And Gord, that picture is of a guy screaming for attention from Guiness. The only thing important here Gord is that you can look yourself in the mirror with posts like this.
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Old 23-05-2010, 11:38   #32
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Old 23-05-2010, 14:02   #33
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Originally Posted by ude123 View Post
Gordy:
Once again I must protest that you get credit for a post of merely 2 words. It seems unfair as when I post my average word count is much higher yet you can post but 2 words and receive the same 'credit' as I do for much more thought and time. How is a guy to catch your record 14,074 when you post such posts obviously for the sole reason of padding your numbers.
I’m sorry that my self-indulgent inconsequential “fluff” posts so offend you, and (by their frequency & duration) thwart your aspiration to become our most frequent poster.

To what does the "once again" part of your protest refer?
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Old 23-05-2010, 16:53   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ude123 View Post
Gordy:
Once again I must protest that you get credit for a post of merely 2 words. It seems unfair as when I post my average word count is much higher yet you can post but 2 words and receive the same 'credit' as I do ...
Huh?!?

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Old 23-05-2010, 17:30   #35
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Huh?!?

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(Do I get credit for this?)

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Old 23-05-2010, 17:31   #36
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Mike gets it!

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Old 23-05-2010, 17:42   #37
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In the interest of getting this thread back on topic, here's the OP's post:
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Originally Posted by JusDreaming View Post
I need to replace our anchor chain badly! It is 3/8 ht which is costly to say the least. So I found a wholesaler locally to avoid the shipping cost. But all he carries is chain from China. Is it really inferior compared to Acco/Peerless? It is about half the price. But I don't want something that will not work well on the windless, or fail when I need it most.
Please stick to answering the OP's inquiry. If you have nothing to offer that will help the OP reach a decision on replacing his chain, don't post. If you really feel you must debate / educate another member, please do so via PM.

Thank you for your cooperation.

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Old 23-05-2010, 21:26   #38
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I am sorry my sarcastic attempt at humor in pointing out the tremendous job Gord does at moderating and offering advice on this forum for over 7 years now. I guess I shouldn't attempt to write humor and keep my day job. I know I personally appreciate Gord and his knowledge and links(lots of links gotten from him over the years) and was just pointing out(in what I thought was a humorous way, but obviously no one else thought so) that Gord is the man and he helps many(including myself at times) sort out problems. Thanks Gord for all your help over the years.
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Old 23-05-2010, 21:32   #39
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oh man, I HATE it when that happens to me. I always put it down to my humour being too subtle and sophisticated for the average reader.

What can I say, denial is so much more comforting than the cold hard truth that I am not nearly as clever as I think I am
; -)

Feel free to borrow my ploy if it helps take the sting away!
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Old 23-05-2010, 23:45   #40
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Several of the above posters referred to chain "quality". Many then discussed the safety and reliability of the product.
So, you have to wonder, is there any relationship between the strength and integrity of chain, and its propensity to rust?

We can buy chain that has been tested for strength, but is there any, any way at all, to buy chain that is 'officially' graded for durability of the galvanization (other than brand reputation)? Are there grades of galvanization?

If not, then is there any quick, home-made test for quality of galvanization?

(Answer is probably No, No and No; but you never know).
Martin
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Old 24-05-2010, 00:04   #41
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Hot dip galvanizing is done to national standards, the American package is one of the best but they're all more or less equivalent.

There are no "grades", HDG is HDG - either done properly or not.

You could increase the specification by demanding a greater minimum coating thickness but it would quickly become uneconomical. HDG isn't a perfect process and the standards allow for small imperfections. It's the nature of the beast. If you want to eliminate these issues entirely, buy stainless chain.

You can measure HDG coating thickness with little electronic magnetometers, they're not 100% accurate but will pick-up sections of coating that are too thin. But a full inspection of the coating and assessment of adherence to standards is a bit more involved.

Higher tensile grades of chain will rust more slowly once the galvanizing coating has failed.
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Old 24-05-2010, 02:34   #42
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Originally Posted by craigsmith View Post
Hot dip galvanizing is done to national standards, the American package is one of the best but they're all more or less equivalent.

There are no "grades", HDG is HDG - either done properly or not.

You could increase the specification by demanding a greater minimum coating thickness but it would quickly become uneconomical. HDG isn't a perfect process and the standards allow for small imperfections. It's the nature of the beast. If you want to eliminate these issues entirely, buy stainless chain.

You can measure HDG coating thickness with little electronic magnetometers, they're not 100% accurate but will pick-up sections of coating that are too thin. But a full inspection of the coating and assessment of adherence to standards is a bit more involved.

Higher tensile grades of chain will rust more slowly once the galvanizing coating has failed.
I find this difficult to follow. So hot dipped galvanizing is binary -- "proper" or "not proper"; there are no gradations of quality. Yet, it could be better if it were thicker, but it would be "uneconomical" (for whom, I wonder). American galvanzing is "one of the best", but actually it's all the same everywhere.

Huh?

The chain I am probably going to buy is made in China, but it is made to order from a reputable UK company and individually tested. It is galvanized not in China, but in the U.K. The importer says that high quality galvanizing is still not available in China.

Whether that's true or not I have no idea, but it sounds more or less plausible.

Craig, do you galvanize your anchors in New Zealand or in China?


To all those who have posted that everything made in China is cr*p, per se:

Country of origin is not the only, or indeed the main factor influencing quality of manufactured goods. The Chinese were able to produce good enough aerospace goods to put a man in space. I've seen a lot of cr*p from China, but a lot of very good things as well. It all depends on who makes it, and who orders it. Kind of like U.S. goods -- which include a lot of cr*p too.
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Old 24-05-2010, 04:23   #43
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Hot dip galvanizing is done to national standards...
If someone does some back-yard hot dip galvanizing, it is likely not to the National Standard. And it may even be the case for some low key manufacturers that they don't dip to any standard.

So Craig, does this mean that if a chain/anchor has actually been dipped in a way compliant with the US national standard, there is some certification or labeling that the galvanization complies with said standard?
Can a private buyer at all ascertain such compliance?

When I think about architectural use of galvanized cables and chains where structural integrity is at stake, one would certainly expect there to be some form of grading and certification of galvanization because architects would generally want to be confident about expected lifetimes. It can cost millions to maintain such structures. Difficult to imagine them simply relying on brand or the supplier's assurance that "trust us, our galvanization is the best".

Martin

PS: From personal experience with galvanized gate latches I used on a parcel of land, I was surprised that one latch started showing rust after only a couple of seasons of rain water exposure, while other examples showed little sign of rust after several years.
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Old 24-05-2010, 05:03   #44
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I was answering the question in the context of how HDG plants work. If the work is amateur or the specifier (chain manufacturer) is completely incompetent then sure all bets are off. Ask the manufacturer to what standard their HDG is done. Buyer beware.

Classification requirements mandate one or t'other standard. The RINA Rules that Rocna anchors are built within the scope of, for example, mandate the ISO galvanizing standard for chain, so RINA certification would in turn certify that standard as a minimum, within the scope of testing for adherence that the certification also provides for. This is the only verifiable and reliable (independent) way of getting the assurance you want, and it is "fixed" to the one and only standard level. Such classification however is not required for most small private vessels and chain will not come with it unless you pay extra (in the majority of private vessel circumstances globally, there are no legal or coding requirements w.r.t. any of the ground tackle components, much to our lament - otherwise the real cheap rubbish you see in chandlers would disappear).

Alternatively you can rely on simply asking the chain manufacturer what HDG standards they comply with and how their QA measures ensure compliance, then trust their answer based on their reputation - or not.
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Old 24-05-2010, 12:45   #45
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oh man, I HATE it when that happens to me. I always put it down to my humour being too subtle and sophisticated for the average reader.

What can I say, denial is so much more comforting than the cold hard truth that I am not nearly as clever as I think I am
; -)

Feel free to borrow my ploy if it helps take the sting away!
I long for a smiley with it's tongue firmly planted in it's cheek.

Mike
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