Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 07-12-2015, 09:24   #16
Senior Cruiser
 
skipmac's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: 29° 49.16’ N 82° 25.82’ W
Boat: Pearson 422
Posts: 12,387
Re: RIB repair. Hypalon and ????

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scout 30 View Post
I've got the exact same problem. My rub rail for my '99 Avon R3.41 is sitting on a shelf in the garage. I'm also getting a little lifting around the wood transom. When I called for an estimate a few years ago it was about $500 so I didn't bother since we use our Bauer 10 most of the time. But I will have to tackle this at some point so I'd be very interested to hear the results of your repair.
Keep watching this thread for more opinions and if/when I do the repair I will certainly post the results.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Scout 30 View Post
FYI, the guy I talked to about the repair said that they would use a 2 part hypalon glue & sand the boat & rubrail thoroughly to get off all of the old glue.
I did a trial sanding and this will be a problem. Parts of the old glue (the areas that are very dark brown, almost black) are dry and hard and take a LOT of sanding to get to Hypalon. Areas that are light brown are still tacky and gooey and just ball up and clog the sandpaper. I'm thinking it might take a month of Sundays to sand the dink sides clean.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Scout 30 View Post
On a previous thread REMA SC2000 was given a good recommendation for a transom repair but I've also read about good results with 5200. It was also recommended that I mix the white & black 5200 to get a matching color.
Saw the same. On a couple of older threads several people reported great results and years of use using 5200 but the SC2000 is usually recommended as the correct stuff to use.
__________________

__________________
The water is always bluer on the other side of the ocean.
skipmac is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2015, 09:30   #17
Moderator
 
a64pilot's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Albany Ga.
Boat: Island Packet 38
Posts: 17,062
Re: RIB repair. Hypalon and ????

Try a Dremel with the flexible cable for sanding, maybe even use a wire brush on it.

Might just be possible that Toluene may soften the glue if left on it with with a rag wetted with it?
__________________

__________________
a64pilot is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2015, 09:44   #18
Senior Cruiser
 
skipmac's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: 29° 49.16’ N 82° 25.82’ W
Boat: Pearson 422
Posts: 12,387
Re: RIB repair. Hypalon and ????

Quote:
Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
Try a Dremel with the flexible cable for sanding, maybe even use a wire brush on it.
Have been considering this but makes me a little nervous getting that aggressive with my dinghy fabric. Would hate to go to deep and end up with a big hole.


Quote:
Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
Might just be possible that Toluene may soften the glue if left on it with a rag wetted with it?
Got most everything in the shed except toluene so headed out later today to find a can and give it a go.
__________________
The water is always bluer on the other side of the ocean.
skipmac is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2015, 11:11   #19
Marine Service Provider

Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: California
Boat: Alerion Express 38 Yawl
Posts: 269
Re: RIB repair. Hypalon and ????

I have a few thoughts:

1. The rub rail is not PVC, but probably an extrudable material that has good UV resistance. Look for materials that are compatible with Hypalon, not PVC.

2. Avon used to recommend two glues, which may still be available. For small repairs, they recommended one-part Barge cement. For large repairs, they recommended Bostick glue, which is two-part and more finicky. In fact, I think the original construction of the boats was done with Bostick. As with many issues with inflatable boats, having a clean, rough surface is vital for a good glue joint, as is the temperature and humidity of the conditions under which the repair is made.

3. Rubbing out the air bubbles and getting a really good contact is vital. There are rolling tools (perhaps that could be used for wallpaper or other tasks) that press the pieces together and work all of the air to the edges. I think you can do this with an inflated boat, but pressing against a hard underlying surface would be better if you can keep the fabric flat.

If you use something like 5200, I think you'll only get one chance to do a good job. I'd try a purpose-made cement first.

Chuck Hawley
__________________
Chuck Hawley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2015, 11:16   #20
Registered User
 
hamburking's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Kingston Ont Canada
Boat: Looking for my next boat!
Posts: 2,149
Re: RIB repair. Hypalon and ????

I had an Avon Rover 2.81 with the exact same problem. It was particularly annoying when deflated when the rub rail was still holding on a bit. I refrained from tearing it off, and sold it (pretty cheap, with full disclosure of course).

Aside from that, pretty excellent dinghy!
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Compromise Island Trip 104.jpg
Views:	86
Size:	399.5 KB
ID:	114474  
__________________
hamburking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2015, 11:17   #21
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2012
Boat: Catalac 12 M
Posts: 14
Re: RIB repair. Hypalon and ?

I just did this repair 6 months ago. I sanded the old glue off and cleaned the dingy with. MEK. Using MARINE GOOP, I applied to a 3 foot section at a time and held for a few minutes and kept repeating till all the rail was attached. The temperature was in the 90's which sped up the curring time. I also masked the area.
__________________
DrDelmas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2015, 11:34   #22
Registered User
 
Scout 30's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Florida
Boat: Scout 30
Posts: 2,353
Re: RIB repair. Hypalon and ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDelmas View Post
I just did this repair 6 months ago. I sanded the old glue off and cleaned the dingy with. MEK. Using MARINE GOOP, I applied to a 3 foot section at a time and held for a few minutes and kept repeating till all the rail was attached. The temperature was in the 90's which sped up the curring time. I also masked the area.
Just reading about Goop. I've never use it but sounds pretty good. Are you happy with the results so far?
__________________
Scout 30 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2015, 12:16   #23
Registered User
 
anacapaisland42's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Ontario, Canada
Boat: Challenger 32 1974
Posts: 294
Images: 3
Re: RIB repair. Hypalon and ?

I used Home Depot roofing paint, plasticated, I think it's called White Night, $42 Canadian gallon, 5 coats, good thick layer, looks nice and s t r e t c h e s
Bill
__________________
anacapaisland42 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2015, 12:22   #24
Registered User

Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: SF Bay Area/Baja California
Boat: Rafiki 37
Posts: 32
Re: RIB repair. Hypalon and ?

Be careful with the toluene. It's hard on your brain cells.
__________________
coolboat30 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2015, 12:32   #25
Moderator
 
a64pilot's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Albany Ga.
Boat: Island Packet 38
Posts: 17,062
Re: RIB repair. Hypalon and ?

This is the ticket for rolling out air bubbles and making the glue stick well, cheap too.
http://www.amazon.com/Wooden-Handle-...s=patch+roller
__________________
a64pilot is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2015, 12:51   #26
Senior Cruiser
 
Jim Cate's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2008
Location: cruising SW Pacific
Boat: Jon Sayer 1-off 46 ft fract rig sloop strip plank in W Red Cedar
Posts: 11,465
Re: RIB repair. Hypalon and ?

Don't know about Avons, but the rubbing strake on our Gemeni Hypalon RIB was indeed PVC. According to friends who are dinghy professionals, regluing an old rub rail on a Hypalon dink is very difficult, for in their opinion there are no glues compatible with both materials. There are several problems: 1. Getting the original glue off and the surfaces clean enough for t he contact glue tpes to work well. 2. The PVC has lost much of its plasticizer and has become stiff, making good contact between the surfaces difficult to acheive. 3. This stiffness also increases the forces that try and separate the strake from the hull in normal flexing, and in particular when folding for storage. These pros didn't anticipate a long lasting repair for folks like us who use a dinghy daily and deflate/store it on deck frequently for passages.

Ignoring their advice, we tried several time, using first SC2000 and then when tht failed, a variety of sealant type glues (not including 5200 which was not available where we were). None of these fixes lasted more that a few weeks.

In the end we removed it. Turns out that it is a spray deflector as well as a rubbing strake, and the ride was somewhat wetter. Also worried more about oyster shells etc! In the long run ( maybe a year or so later) the dinghy became quite porous and wouldn't hold air well, so we replaced the tubes. Problem solved.... for a while!

Jim
__________________
Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II , lying Port Cygnet, Tasmania once again
Jim Cate is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2015, 14:03   #27
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 18
Re: RIB repair. Hypalon and ????

Quote:
Originally Posted by skipmac View Post
Thanks Antilag. Do you happen to recall what brand?
Sorry, I don't remember the brand. Apparently Rema tip top makes a glue that is excellent, but finding it locally seems a hastle.
__________________
http://www.lerapideescargot.com
Antilag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2015, 14:39   #28
֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎֍֎

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 13,055
Re: RIB repair. Hypalon and ?

If you can't be sure of an adhesive, maybe 3M's VHB tape would do instead? The wealer versions of VHB are used to permanently bond side moldings on cars, and they just never seem to fall off. VHB is flexible, and at least if it falls off...you won't have to scrape off old glue.


For "clamping" either glue or VHB, I would take the dink ashore, deflate it slightly, then wrap a line around it, from head to tail, all the way on the outside of the whole thing. Reinflate to full pressure, and voila, you've clamped the whole rail under good tension.


Offhand I think VHB takes 48 hours for a full bond to set up, I'd plan on that much time for any material.
__________________
hellosailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2015, 16:06   #29
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Caribbean
Boat: Oyster 66
Posts: 973
Re: RIB repair. Hypalon and ?

I have an Avon too and recently re-stuck the rub rail. I previously tried 5200 as a quick fix for small areas. It worked for a while, but it started to fail and the rail started to fall off in a big way, so I got a tin of Bostik 2 part and re-stuck the whole rub rail. I used toluene to get the old glue off, but I tried acetone too and that was ok. The clean up of old glue was the biggest job. End result was a good strong repair.

I used an edge roller too to press the material together. Buy a good one, mine broke near the end of the job - too flimsy.

If the Bostik isn't easy to get then I imagine there are many other 2 part adhesives specially made for hypalon out there that will work fine.

It was a day of work, so your cost quote isn't a mile out at yard rates.
__________________
poiu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2015, 16:12   #30
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: On the hook in Florida
Boat: Tayana V42 - Passages
Posts: 504
Re: RIB repair. Hypalon and ?

Strange that my 3M 4000 attached rub rail holds fine after 3 years of constant UV exposure and 3M 5200 attached rails fail.

Prep maybe.
__________________

__________________
Trying to live on 20th century money in the 21st century.
jcapo is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
rib

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
For Sale: Avon Hypalon 10' RIB Dinghy With Sunbrella Cover silverp40 Classifieds Archive 22 20-03-2013 11:48
What's the Best 11-12' Hypalon RIB? Travis McGee Auxiliary Equipment & Dinghy 2 15-08-2012 19:34
Fixing 3" Cut in Hypalon RIB Acadia Auxiliary Equipment & Dinghy 28 22-02-2011 13:32
For Sale: West Marine Hypalon RIB 310 rja Classifieds Archive 0 18-11-2010 11:01
PVC? Hypalon? RIB or High Pressure? svDragonfly General Sailing Forum 33 09-06-2009 18:24



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 19:40.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.