Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 03-08-2017, 09:27   #166
Marine service provider
 
newhaul's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: puget sound washington
Boat: 1968 Islander bahama 24 hull 182, 1963 columbia 29 defender. hull # 60
Posts: 4,907
Re: Hookah ,diy

Quote:
Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
You could not with a regular Scuba reg, but it could be done, for example my CPAP is set to 8 in of water which is I think about .3 PSI, and I can't over breathe it. I have tried out of curiosity.
We are talking only very shallow depths of course, or otherwise it would have to have a way to ramp up pressure with increasing depth
Look at how big the hose is on a cpap my daughters unit has a 1inch hose that is about 4 ft long now restrict that to 3/8 hose and 50 ft long bet you could over breath it then.
Takes pressure to move volume thru small hose.
__________________

__________________
Non illigitamus carborundum
newhaul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2017, 10:55   #167
Registered User
 
transmitterdan's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2011
Boat: Valiant 42
Posts: 4,582
Re: Hookah ,diy

Denverdon,

Care to share your calculations on the flow rate and pressure drop of 0.25" hose?

You will find that physics requires higher pressure than you are estimating. It takes pressure to work the regulator. Without several psi pressure drop the regulator will not regulate.
__________________

transmitterdan is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2017, 12:15   #168
Registered User
 
denverd0n's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 4,203
Images: 6
Re: Hookah ,diy

Quote:
Originally Posted by transmitterdan View Post
Care to share your calculations on the flow rate and pressure drop of 0.25" hose?
The number I quoted came from the website of an air hose manufacturer, the hose being specifically rated for breathing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by transmitterdan View Post
It takes pressure to work the regulator. Without several psi pressure drop the regulator will not regulate.
Yes, of course. Which is why I have repeatedly mentioned that as an issue that could complicate things. Of course, "several psi" is one thing, and thinking that it needs a differential of 60-80 psi is a whole different thing.

Nonetheless, I suspect that the main reason most diving regulators need as much pressure in the hose as they do is just because that's the way it is done with tanks. And hookah regulators have always been made by simple spring modifications to existing SCUBA second-stage regulators.

We know that regulators can be made to work with only 40 psi in the hose. They already exist. My suspicion is that they could be made to work with significantly less pressure than that. Perhaps someday I will get around to trying it.

I'm certainly not going to believe that it is impossible just because, "that's how it has always been done."
denverd0n is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2017, 17:29   #169
Registered User
 
transmitterdan's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2011
Boat: Valiant 42
Posts: 4,582
Re: Hookah ,diy

And yet if it was a safe thing to do surely it would be marketed by reputable companies. As you point out the math ain't that hard to cypher. But once you add up all the required pressure drops needed to supply breathing air safely through a long small hose I think you will find that the well established and relative safe systems are not over designed that much. At least not enough to make a big dent in the required pump power.
transmitterdan is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2017, 18:58   #170
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2008
Boat: Custom cutter, 42'
Posts: 468
Re: Hookah ,diy

For all those asking questions about flow capacity, pressure drop, etc there are on line calculators that make simple work of this. From Gates (the hose and belt company) 50' of 1/4" ID hose with a supply pressure of 25 PSIG will flow 3CFM at a pressure drop of 5.38 PSI, ie delivered pressure at 3 CFM = 19.62 PSIG.
Pauls is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2017, 19:22   #171
Moderator
 
a64pilot's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Albany Ga.
Boat: Island Packet 38
Posts: 22,007
Re: Hookah ,diy

It could be done, and it would be safe, however you would need a big cumbersome hose, and what would be the advantage of a low PSI system? Lower power consumption would be the only possible advantage I can think of, but I'd bet that the number of customers that care how much power their Hooka draws is slim to none.
So far as cleaning a boat hull anyone with much experience at all can handle a Hooka suddenly failing.
a64pilot is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2017, 06:35   #172
Registered User
 
denverd0n's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 4,203
Images: 6
Re: Hookah ,diy

Quote:
Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
...and what would be the advantage of a low PSI system?
Probably none at all. Like I said before, this is just a mental exercise.
denverd0n is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2017, 06:37   #173
Registered User
 
denverd0n's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 4,203
Images: 6
Re: Hookah ,diy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pauls View Post
For all those asking questions about flow capacity, pressure drop, etc there are on line calculators that make simple work of this. From Gates...
You don't have a link to where you found this, do you? I poked around the gates.com website some and could not find it.

EDIT: Okay, never mind. I found it here... http://tinyurl.com/y9gdb7kj
denverd0n is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2017, 06:43   #174
Moderator
 
a64pilot's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Albany Ga.
Boat: Island Packet 38
Posts: 22,007
Re: Hookah ,diy

Quote:
Originally Posted by denverd0n View Post
Probably none at all. Like I said before, this is just a mental exercise.


I like to participate in those myself, sometimes it educational
a64pilot is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2017, 07:54   #175
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Michigan
Boat: Beneteau 38 first
Posts: 54
Re: Hookah ,diy

Quote:
Originally Posted by funjohnson View Post
*we were given a Sea breath hookah unit from the companies' owner. We haven't even had the chance to try it yet. I'm only posting as I thought something from their FAQ would be germane to this discussion about operating PSI:

What pressure does the system operate?

Sea Breathe incorporates a unique variable pressure system that allows the air pressure to increase as the diver descends. Thus if you are at shallow depths, i.e. cleaning your boat hull, the pressure (and hence the current draw from the battery will be minimized., approximately 12-14 psi. When the diver descends to say 20 feet the pressure will automatically adjust to about 20 psi. This feature ensures that there is the minimal drain on the battery during the dive, which of course increases battery duration.

Matt

Matt I love your videos....

But

I have a system from them and it does not increase in pressure or I should say the one I have doesn't....

Mine is a twin pump unit, plug one inlet for 1 diver or use both pumps for 2 divers... supposed to save power not having one compressor pumping air but it's still spinning just not getting inlet air...


As far as a review it's a good unit. Does the job for sure.

The downsides are
price
the inflation bag they use as a regulator.


Really I like my DIY system better and that's what I use the most.

I have read the posts about the puma being a consumer pump from china. All I can say about that is the one I bought wasn't soaked in oil and I wasn't breathing oil. I guess if someone was worried about that it wouldn't take too much to rinse the tank out.

Watching your videos I can see you have the skills to put together your own kit no problems.

Bob
snokid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2017, 11:17   #176
Registered User
 
funjohnson's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Out cruising again (Azores until spring)
Boat: 37' aluminum pilothouse "Elements"
Posts: 2,081
Re: Hookah ,diy

Thanks Snokid for watching the videos.

What were the issues you found with the inflation bag reservoir tank? It seemed like a smart alternative to a rigid tank, but I could see a leak being an issue.

Matt
__________________
Youtube MJ sailing - Vlog
MJSailing.com - Written Blog
Rebuilt Aluminum Boat Over 2 Years... Now Back Cruising!
funjohnson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2017, 11:23   #177
Marine Service Provider
 
fstbttms's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Under a boat, in a marina, in the San Francisco Bay
Posts: 3,708
Re: Hookah ,diy

Quote:
Originally Posted by denverd0n View Post
Have you ever tried using a regulator that will operate at 30 or 40 psi?

I strongly suspect that, with the right regulator, and the right compressor, you would find that half that much pressure could provide all the air you would ever need.
No. No reason to.
fstbttms is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2017, 14:44   #178
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Michigan
Boat: Beneteau 38 first
Posts: 54
Re: Hookah ,diy

Quote:
Originally Posted by funjohnson View Post
Thanks Snokid for watching the videos.

What were the issues you found with the inflation bag reservoir tank? It seemed like a smart alternative to a rigid tank, but I could see a leak being an issue.

Matt
The main thing I don't like is the bags.

They are large both while using them and also storing them. Made of the same material as a dinghy, so you roll up the hose then you have to store the bags but they are attached to the hoses.

The compressor on the unit I have is in a heavy duty plastic box. If you have the box in a dinghy and are diving I have come up to having the lid shut. easy enough fix with a bit of rope.

But take my other setup, the puma and breathing hose. Toss the battery compressor and hose into the dinghy drive out flip a switch start diving.

The only thing I have not tried with my DIY version is 2 divers at once at depth more than 6' I know it works fine in shallow water like cleaning your hull, but diving reefs not sure if the puma has enough volume/pressure for 2 divers, been 30' single I know it works fine.

Bob
__________________

snokid is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Hookah Diving Systems shipofools Auxiliary Equipment & Dinghy 9 27-08-2009 12:02
Scuba, Hookah, Brownie Alternatives? Greg B Fishing, Recreation & Fun 136 20-08-2009 14:40
Unused Brownie Explorer 390 Hookah ess105 Classifieds Archive 0 24-11-2008 05:58
hookah capn_nik Fishing, Recreation & Fun 2 02-05-2004 23:29



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 20:08.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.